Handbook</>, page 90.) Using the former alternative, SGMLS outputs the ESIS (?) of the subdocument when parsing the SGML document entity, while it does not (?) using the second alternative. Anyone who wants to supply a bit of tutorial on SUBDOC beyond what's found in Goldfarb 89-90 (Eliot?) will be counted blessed. Thanks in advance. Robin </message> <message id="<199311111914.LAA01206@netcomsv.netcom.com>" date="2962033771"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 11 Nov 1993 19:09:31 UT From: Chet Ensign \<DOCCOE@IBIVM.IBMMAIL.COM> Message-ID: <199311111914.LAA01206@netcomsv.netcom.com> References: <9310281443.AA19372@netcomsv.netcom.com> <19931029.065225.214@almaden.ibm.com> <2b5rii$r9s@meaddata.meaddata.com> \<CG6Lrq.8Es@tc.fluke.COM> <19931109.064032.489@almaden.ibm.com> Subject: MS fact sheet on SGML [Eliot Kimber] | At the risk of sparking a Jihad, I will claim that this argument is | entirely specious because it assumes that only a human can create such | a presentation... Jihad, yes! I love it. Well, to have a Jihad, you've got to have an infidel, so why don't I volunteer. Not that I disagree with a bit of what's been writ, which I'll summarize. To whit: * Arguing that authors need to "see the page" in order to write makes no sense once you replace the axiom "writers create pages" with the new axiom "writers create information." * Pages (or panels, pop-ups or, for that matter, paper airplanes) can be deduced from the structure and relationships of the information if they are sufficiently richly described. But all this assumes an environment -- that is to say, an organization or enterprise -- that truly recognizes the value of information and so supports pure, formal use of SGML. I'd like to live and work in such a world. Sadly, I live in a world that rejects pure and formal in favor of expedient and ad hoc. From that point of view, I'd like to argue that there is a spectrum of SGML use where products like "SGML Author" or "Intellitag" may serve a useful purpose. My department writes technical manuals. We need a pure, formal SGML-based system that replaces physical access to files and markup with logical access to documents and structure. Nothing less than pure and formal will do. However, there is a wider world around us, where product managers, technical contacts, programmers, etc., write stuff that we can use. Sometimes it's little things like release notes. Sometimes it is very big things like whole books they want us to publish. It is all valuable but, of course, it is coming to us in wildly different formats. Most of these people are using Word or Wordperfect. They are -- and this is key -- happy to do anything I recommend to help ease the transition from the stuff on their desktop to our files **except** buy expensive new products that they'll have to learn from scratch. They have even gone so far as to say; "You give us the style sheet and we'll use it." They're cooperative, they're beginning to understand some of issues involved, and they're willing to try anything within reason that will reduce the small fortune we charge them every time we have to wrestle their stuff to the ground. Here, I can see the WP add-ons working quite well. It may be asking too much of "SGML Author for Word" to provide a robustly tagged SGML instance. But if it gives us a file that is modestly tagged and valid for our DTD, we'll still make enormous strides in improving inter- enterprise productivity. The SGML-disciplined writer in our department can take it from there; put it out in the pasture, feed it growth hormones, etc., until it is fat and ripe with semantic possibilities. In the meantime, these other writers, scattered about the company, will begin to learn and appreciate the difference between format and structure, the necessary first step if they are to eventually embrace SGML as a corporate solution. /chet -- Chet Ensign Information Builders, Inc. 212-736-6250 X4349 internet: doccoe@ibivm.ibmmail.com ibmmail: USUBUVMV@IBMMAIL compuserve: 73163,1414 </message> <message id="<1993Nov11.234140.20466@ncsu.edu>" date="2962050100"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 11 Nov 1993 23:41:40 UT From: "Jennifer Barlow" \<barlow@unity.ncsu.edu> Organization: NCSU Campus Computing Message-ID: <1993Nov11.234140.20466@ncsu.edu> Subject: Getting started with SGML Jennifer Barlow jennifer_barlow@ncsu.edu </message> <message id="<1993Nov12.131640.27032@news.lrz-muenchen.de>" date="2962099000"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 12 Nov 1993 13:16:40 UT From: "Martin Josko" \<martin@pollux.edv.agrar.tu-muenchen.de> Organization: Leibniz-Rechenzentrum, Muenchen (Germany) Message-ID: <1993Nov12.131640.27032@news.lrz-muenchen.de> Subject: Storing SGMLS output in database I'm developing an application which stores the SGMLS output in a relational database structure (in about 15 relations). Does somebody have any experience with this theme ? -- Martin Josko Technical University Munich TU-Muenchen Department of Mathematics DVS-Weihenstephan Statistics and Data Processing D-85350 Freising Freising Germany email: martin@pollux.edv.agrar.tu-muenchen.de phone: +49-(0)8161-71-4506 fax: +49-(0)8161-71-4409 </message> <message id="<JJC.93Nov12142849@jclark.jclark.com>" date="2962103329"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 12 Nov 1993 14:28:49 UT From: "James Clark" \<jjc@jclark.com> Organization: None, London, England Message-ID: \<JJC.93Nov12142849@jclark.jclark.com> References: \<ROBIN.93Nov11104409@utafll.utafll.uta.edu> Subject: Re: SUBDOC and (SGMLS) ESIS [Robin Cover] | I think I'm having trouble understanding details of SGML subdocument, | or ESIS, or perhaps both. | | SGMLS seems to output a different result, depending upon whether a | subdocument is called using a general entity reference or whether it's | called using a general entity name as an attribute value. (The | alternative methods are described in Goldfarb \<title>Handbook</>, page | 90) Using the former alternative, SGMLS outputs the ESIS (?) of the | subdocument when parsing the SGML document entity, while it does not | (?) using the second alternative. The difference between the two alternatives is that in the former case the entity is referenced but in the latter case it is not. The ESIS specification says (Handbook, pp 591-3): i) Attribute information ... General entity name attribute values include the entity name and entity text. The entities themselves are not treated as having been referenced. NOTE - An application can use system services to parse the entities, but such parsing is outside the context of the current document. ... k) References to external entities ... - For SUBDOC entities, the entity name and entity text and passed. The application can require that the subdocument entity be parsed at the point at which the reference occurred. NOTE - Parsing of the subdocument entity can result in other ESIS information being passed. ... One question is: why does sgmls always output ESIS for referenced subdocument entities? My view is that the ESIS specification is wrong and that ISO 8879 requires that a validating parser always parse a referenced subdocument entity. Firstly I would claim that if a SGML document references a subdocument, then that subdocument is as much a part of the SGML document as as a referenced SGML text entity, and if the subdocument is not conforming then the document as a whole is not conforming, and a validating parser must detect this. See clause 6.1. Secondly clause 9.4.2 states that `the number of open SGML subdocument entities cannot exceed the quantity specified on the "SUBDOC" parameter of the SGML declaration.' Clause 4.221 defines `open entity' as `an entity that has been referenced but whose entity end has not yet occurred.' A validating parser must detect whether this restriction has been violated, and to do so it must parse any referenced subdocument entity. Thirdly clause 9.8 on capacities states that points are counted for `the set of open subdocument entities and SGML text entities referenced from them that would require the largest capacity'. This calculation makes no sense unless referenced subdocument entities are parsed. Another question is: why does sgmls not output ESIS information for subdocument entities that occur as names in general entity name attribute values and are not referenced? None of the points listed above apply to such entities and I haven't been able to find anything in the standard that requires that such entities be parsed. Furthermore I think there are applications where it would not be desirable to parse some such entities. For example, you might have an element that represented a reference to an ID in a subdocument by having a NAME attribute giving the name of the ID and an ENTITY attribute giving the name of the subdocument. So it seems to me that it must be for the application to determine whether such entities are parsed, as the ESIS specification says. How can an application parse such entities using sgmls? Sgmls gives you the names of the files containing the subdocument entity, so you can just fork off an sgmls process to parse the subdocument. Somehow, however, you must get a file containing the SGML declaration and add its name as an argument to sgmls before the names of the files containing the subdocument entity. This is not really satisfactory: the output of sgmls should contain sufficient information to allow the application to create such a file. James Clark jjc@jclark.com </message> <message id="<memo.957294@cix.compulink.co.uk>" date="2962104935"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 12 Nov 1993 14:55:35 UT From: "Richard Parker" \<pindar3@cix.compulink.co.uk> Organization: Pindar Infotek Ltd Message-ID: \<memo.957294@cix.compulink.co.uk> Subject: Arbortext on the Mac Hi, Entities Can anyone out there enlighten me as to whether we can run ArborText on a Macintosh? Has anyone ported it? Excuse my ignorance, just a humble programmer... Reply to mail address or here, Thanx in advance, Rich --- Please make 'Attn:\<space>Richard Parker' the first line of your reply (not thesubject) to ensure automatic forwarding to the correct Pindar user. </message> <message id="<19931112.102615.443@almaden.ibm.com>" date="2962114021"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 12 Nov 1993 17:27:01 UT From: "Eliot Kimber" \<drmacro@vnet.IBM.COM> Message-ID: <19931112.102615.443@almaden.ibm.com> References: \<ROBIN.93Nov11104409@utafll.utafll.uta.edu> Subject: Re: SUBDOC and (SGMLS) ESIS [Robin Cover] | I think I'm having trouble understanding details of SGML subdocument, | or ESIS, or perhaps both. | | SGMLS seems to output a different result, depending upon whether a | subdocument is called using a general entity reference or whether it's | called using a general entity name as an attribute value. (The | alternative methods are described in Goldfarb \<title>Handbook</>, page | 90) Using the former alternative, SGMLS outputs the ESIS (?) of the | subdocument when parsing the SGML document entity, while it does not | (?) using the second alternative. | | Anyone who wants to supply a bit of tutorial on SUBDOC beyond what's | found in Goldfarb 89-90 (Eliot?) will be counted blessed. Thanks in | advance. Subdocuments are a special case of data entity. Like other data entities, they can be referred to either using a normal entity reference (\&mysubdoc;) anywhere that data is valid, or via an entity attribute or, in HyTime, from a nmlist element, or via any other application-defined reference mechanism. The reference to data entities from ENTITY attributes (attributes with a declared datatype of entity, e.g.: \<!ATTLIST MultiMediaObject object ENTITY #REQUIRED -- name of data entity -- > must be handled by the processing application in all cases -- the parser will not normally handle it, because the processing that is to be done for data entities is not defined by ISO 8879, not even for subdocument entities. You can think of a subdocument entity as a data entity with a notation of SGML. ISO 8879 defines the constraint that subdocument entities must conform to the SGML declaration of the document from which they are referred. Just as for any other notation, it is up to the processing application to define and implement processing for the SUBDOC. Of course, in the case of sub documents, since the notation is SGML, it might be reasonable to assume that a parser could provide this service for us automatically. However, I think that it would be presumptuous for a parser to this, because the application may have a specific behavior in mind for subdoc references that may not involve the use of the current parser--who's to say other than the application designers themselves? Thus, a system that supports SUBDOC needs to do the following things: 1. Report a reference to subdoc entity as it would report a reference to any other data entity, indicating that it is a SUBDOC entity. 2. Provide an application API by which the *application* can request processing of the subdocument entity. This could be a recursive call to the parser or it could start a new instance of the parser in a separate thread. Without these functions, it is impossible for an application to implement subdoc references, especially from ENTITY attributes. Also, we must have function 2, because there may be situations where a subdocument entity is referred to other than an ENTITY attribute, such as in the HyTime NMList case. Neither ISO 8879 nor *The SGML Handbook* give much guidance about how one might use SUBDOC or what the intent was. It's my understanding that SUBDOC was intended to solve the ID and entity name space scoping problem, and that seems to be the most compelling use of SUBDOC, and is certainly an elegant solution to the problem. One of the interesting things about SUBDOC is that you can define SUBDOC document types derived from a superset DTD at will because SGML allows the declaration of elements in a DTD that are not used in any active content models. This means, for example, that you can use the same DTD for a complete "logical document" and proper subset document types without modifying the base DTD itself. Consider this very simple public DTD fragment: \ \<!ELEMENT SIMPDOC - - (section+) > \<!ELEMENT Section - O (p*, subsection*) > \<!ELEMENT Subsection - O (p*) > \<!ELEMENT P - O (#PCDATA) > For a complete "logical document", where by logical document I mean a document that represents the content that would be required by the application to create a complete output instance, e.g., a printed book. I use logical document to contrast with "syntactic document", which is "document" as defined by ISO 8879, namely a document type declaration and a document instance, where the document instance consists of the "document element" (that element whose GI is the same as the document type name), and any valid content of the document element. I have to make this distinction because subdocuments are complete syntactic documents, but are incomplete logical documents (at least for this use of SUBDOC). A complete SIMPDOC document would look like this: \<!DOCTYPE SIMPDOC SYSTEM "simpdoc.dtd" > \<simpdoc> ... \</simpdoc> Now, say I want to use SUBDOCs to create blindly-reusable sections, I need do only this: \<!DOCTYPE SECTION SYSTEM "simpdoc.dtd"> \<section> ... \</simpdoc> Note that the document type name is "section", but the dtd is still the same simpdoc.dtd (and the document element is now section, by the rules of SGML). My parser may issue informational messages to the effect that SIMPDOC is declared but not used in any content models, but that is not an error and will not affect the parsing or validity of the DTD. With this DTD, I must use an ENTITY attribute to refer to a subdoc from within a SIMPDOC instance for "meaningful" uses of subdoc (e.g. a use where the content of the subdoc makes sense in the current context--it probably wouldn't make sense to refer to a Section subdoc from within the content of a paragraph, although there's no way to prevent it by the rules of SGML). The reason I must use an entity attribute is that direct data entity references are only valid where character data is valid (#PCDATA or mixed content), but the SIMPDOC content model is element content, allowing only elements. Therefore, a data entity reference is not valid within the direct content of a SIMPDOC element. For this application, I can define an entity attribute for section that will allow a subdoc reference, say: \<!ATTLIST section contentref ENTITY #CONREF > Now I can use a Section element to refer to a subdoc entity. SGML imposes no constraints on the content of that SUBDOC, but you could define constraints in your application, such as the constraint that the document type of the subdoc must be the same as the GI of element doing the referencing, e.g., Section can only refer to subdocs of document type Section. It would be up to the processing application to validate that constraint--no rule of SGML provides a way to impose that constraint. The subdoc reference would look like this: \<!DOCTYPE simpdoc SYSTEM "simpdoc.dtd" [ \<!ENTITY sec1 SYSTEM "sec1.section" SUBDOC > ]> \<simpdoc> \<section contentref=sec1>\ \<section> ... Inline section for contrast ... \</section> \</simpdoc> As explained above, to process this reference, the application has to interpret the ContentRef= attribute value, get the declaration information from the parser, and actually process the subdocument, for example, recursively call the parser to parse it. It could process the data therein as though it had occurred inline since it has imposed a constraint that makes that possible, or it could do something different, depending on the function being performed and the precise design of the application. The sub document, because it is a syntactically-complete SGML document, has its own ID and entity name space, which means it can be used within the context of a larger document without the need to worry about conflicts between ID or entity values in the referencing document. Also, because it has a document type declaration, it could have its own element declarations local to it and tightly bound to the data that use those declarations. This use of SUBDOC to re-use proper subsets of a larger document type has some interesting properties: 1. Blind re-use of logical document fragments is enabled because of the name space isolation. 2. If the GI/doctype match constraint is imposed, structural validation is maintained because it becomes impossible to create references to elements that are not meaningful 3. If you use HyTime's unified ID/entity name space, it is not necessary for the reference to a subdoc to change if the subdoc becomes part of the larger document, or if a part of the document already referred to via a content reference link is made into a subdoc, because the form of reference will be identical in both cases. 4. Complete logical documents may be used as subdocuments by a yet larger document. For example, say I have all these SIMPDOCs, and I want to create a single SGML document that represents a multi-volume collection, I need only do this: \<!DOCTYPE MultDoc &#DSO; \<!ELEMENT MultDoc - - (Simpdoc+) > \<!ENTITY % simpdoc SYSTEM "simpdoc.dtd"> %simpdoc; \ \<!ELEMENT doc1 SYSTEM "doc1.simpdoc" SUBDOC > \<!ELEMENT doc2 SYSTEM "doc2.simpdoc" SUBDOC > \<multdoc> \<simpdoc contentref=doc1> \<simpdoc contentref=doc2> \</multdoc> Pretty cool, I think. Note that this mechanism scales in both directions with equal utility. Speaking personally, I would have to look pretty hard at any use of SUBDOC that did follow the above model, although I certainly wouldn't preclude the existence of other uses of SUBDOC. It might be useful for some standard application architecture, possibly HyTime, to codify this use of SUBDOC explicitly. We're almost certainly going to define IBMIDDoc and the InfoMaster Architecture in this way. -- Eliot Kimber Internet: drmacro@vnet.ibm.com Dept E14/B500 IBMMAIL: USIB2DK9@IBMMAIL Network Programs Information Development Phone: 1-919-254-5160 IBM Corporation Research Triangle Park, NC 27709 "But Ranger Doug, can't we just use some proprietary data format instead of this SGML stuff?" "Sure Slim, that would be the easy way, but it wouldn't be the Cowboy Way." </message> <message id="<19931112.130136.243@almaden.ibm.com>" date="2962126401"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 12 Nov 1993 20:53:21 UT From: "Eliot Kimber" \<drmacro@vnet.IBM.COM> Message-ID: <19931112.130136.243@almaden.ibm.com> References: <9310281443.AA19372@netcomsv.netcom.com> <19931029.065225.214@almaden.ibm.com> <2b5rii$r9s@meaddata.meaddata.com> <199311111914.LAA01206@netcomsv.netcom.com> Subject: Re: MS fact sheet on SGML [Eliot Kimber] | At the risk of sparking a Jihad, I will claim that this argument is | entirely specious because it assumes that only a human can create such | a presentation... [Chet Ensign] | However, there is a wider world around us, where product managers, | technical contacts, programmers, etc., write stuff that we can use. | Sometimes it's little things like release notes. Sometimes it is very | big things like whole books they want us to publish. It is all | valuable but, of course, it is coming to us in wildly different | formats. I think Chet is completely correct -- there is a need to bridge between the world of high-function technical information and more ad-hoc ways of creating documents. One solution I'd like to see pursued more is one that Wayne Wohler first proposed while we were developing the IBMIDDoc language, which is to define a minimal subset language, which Wayne calls "CasualDoc" that would conform to our InfoMaster Architecture, but would be as simple as possible and still be usefully functional. This would be a very small language, about 40 elements or so (not counting structured stuff like name and address, which might retain their IBMIDDoc complexity because of their utility). It would not require the same capacities as a larger language, (apart from the name length), and as it conforms to the same architecture, could be processed by the same InfoMaster-based processors as IBMIDDoc. The key to making this work is the common underlying architecture, and supporting tools. We haven't explored this idea within IBM to date because we simply haven't had the resources and it's not a priority. -- Eliot Kimber Internet: drmacro@vnet.ibm.com Dept E14/B500 IBMMAIL: USIB2DK9@IBMMAIL Network Programs Information Development Phone: 1-919-254-5160 IBM Corporation Research Triangle Park, NC 27709 "But Ranger Doug, can't we just use some proprietary data format instead of this SGML stuff?" "Sure Slim, that would be the easy way, but it wouldn't be the Cowboy Way." </message> <message id="<CGEH2A.7yF@caracara.cdev.com>" date="2962132065"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 12 Nov 1993 22:27:45 UT From: "Jon C. Stonecash" \<jcs0ka15@redstart.cdev.com> Organization: Computing Devices International Message-ID: \<CGEH2A.7yF@caracara.cdev.com> Summary: Need to know about opportunities Subject: Research possibilities wrt SGML My company is interested in document management. We are positioning ourselves as systems integrators in this area. I am the chief technologist in this area. I am also involved in my company's pursuit of customer funded research where the customer defines the subject area and we do the research on their nickle. We get a leg up on the technology and the customer (typically a government lab) advances the state-of-the-art in an area of interest to them. My questions to this newsgroup are: Is anybody doing research of this type in areas related to SGML? If SO, what is the research and who is doing it? Does anyone have some research ideas that we might pitch to whomever pops out as a result of the answers to the first question? -- Jon C. Stonecash Phone: (612) 921-7356 Computing Devices International Fax: (612) 921-6552 8800 Queen Avenue South Internet: stonecash@cdev.com Bloomington, Minnesota, USA 55431 Mailstop: BLCN2C </message> <message id="<2c1ecs$o0d@samba.oit.unc.edu>" date="2962144092"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 13 Nov 1993 01:48:12 UT From: "Simon E Spero" \<ses@tipper.oit.unc.edu> Organization: University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill Message-ID: <2c1ecs$o0d@samba.oit.unc.edu> References: <19931109.004@sfo.naggum.no> \<THOMAS.93Nov9142606@noosa.gmd.de> <19931110.018@sfo.naggum.no> <1993Nov11.134442.25810@gdstech.grumman.com> Subject: Re: Standard DTDs (was: Evaluating SGML) [Larry Beck] | I wonder if there's a way to get an ISO standard withdrawn?? Can't this happen during the review cycle? I can't find my I-SPY book of ISO anywhere. If other standards start referencing it then withdrawl would cause a lot of dangling references. I think a far more productive activity would be to work on standardising a few general purpose DTD fragments. For example, I have a chunk o' DTD for references which is more or less a naive encoding of MARC. Something like that would be very useful to standardise; processing it nicely takes some fairly complicated code; however that code can be reused whenever I use it with a different DTD. The chances of me getting my personal report DTD accepted by NISO are not too good, and quite rightly so. However a standard way of handling bibliographies would be much more useful and generally applicable. Hmmm - Quick question; could a parameter entity reference expanding into several ELEMENT defines occur in a DOCTYPE ? Simon -- Hackers Local 42- National Union of Computer Operatives, Chapel Hill section ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Tar Heel Information Services - Nothing but net! | WAIS/Z39.50 spoken here North Carolina - First in Usenet | DoD #612 | Tel: +1-919-962-9107 </message> <message id="<1993Nov13.154817.5269@falch.no>" date="2962194497"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 13 Nov 1993 15:48:17 UT From: Steve Pepper \<pepper@falch.no> Organization: Falch Hurtigtrykk as, Oslo, Norway Message-ID: <1993Nov13.154817.5269@falch.no> Subject: SGML tools I am compiling a list of SGML-aware software tools in connection with a presentation called "The Whirlwind Guide to SGML Tools" and would appreciate help from readers of this group. While I would like the list to be as comprehensive as possible, I am not interested in every piece of software that claims "SGML compatibility". My main criterion for inclusion in the list is that the software incorporates some kind of SGML parsing capability, or that it is in some way specifically geared to handling SGML documents. The products in the list are arranged in a set of very broad categories that no doubt could become the subject of heated disputes, but that's a chance I have to take... I am appending a (very) preliminary version of the list and would like to appeal to anyone (particularly vendors) who have comments, corrections or additions to contact me at pepper@falch.no. Please DO NOT post comments to this newsgroup. I will post an updated version of the list at a later date if people are interested. The information below is taken from Robin Cover's SGML Bibliography and GCA's SGML Source Guide. If anyone knows of other publicly available product listings, please let me know. Thanks for your help. Best regards, Steve -- </(pepper)steve> pepper@falch.no ------------------------------------------------------------------ falch hurtigtrykk a.s, postboks 130 kalbakken, n-0902 oslo, norway tel +47 2216 3040 fax +47 2216 2350 ========================= cut here =============================== \<sgmltools> SGML tools (list generated 13 November 93) ========================================================== 1. By product category ---------------------- Supported platforms (where known) are shown in brackets as U = UNIX D = MS-DOS W = MS-Windows M = Macintosh O = OS/2 Browsers - DynaText [U,W,M] Electronic Book Technology - Lector [U,W] Open Text Corp. - Pathways [U] Westinghouse Electric Corp. Conversion software - Balise [U,D] MID Information Logistics Group - FastTAG [U,W] Avalanche Development Co. - qwertz/FORMAT [U] PD - SGML Hammer [U,W] Avalanche Development Co. - SGML Translator [ ] Shaffstall Corp. - SGML Translator [ ] DCF Edition IBM Corp. - TableTAG [U,D] Unifilt Co. Databases - PAT [U] Open Text Corp. - SGML Darc [U,W] Synex Information AB - SGML/DB [U] AIS Berger-Levrault - SGML/Search [U] AIS Berger-Levrault Editors - ADEPT Editor [U,W] ArborText Inc. - Author/Editor [U,W,M] SoftQuad, Inc. - EASE (E2S Advanced SGML Editor [D] E2S - GRIF SGML Editor [U] Grif S.A. - Intellitag [U,D] WordPerfect Corp. - SGML Smart Editor [D] Auto-Graphics, Inc. - TextWrite [O] IBM Corp. - Write-It [D] SEMA Group - WriterStation [D] Datalogics, Inc. - XGML CheckMark [M] Exoterica Corp. HyTime engines - HyMinder [U,D] TechnoTeacher, Inc. Page layout software - ADEPT Publisher [U,W] ArborText Inc. - DL Composer [U] Datalogics, Inc. - FrameBuilder [U,W] Frame Technology Corp. Parsers - Amsterdam Parser [U] PD - ARC-SGML [D] PD - Mark-It [U,D] SEMA Group - MarkMinder [U,D] TechnoTeacher, Inc. - sgmls [U] PD - XGML OmniMark [U,D,M] Exoterica Corp. - XGML Validator [U,D,M] Exoterica Corp. Various - Near & Far [ ] Microstar Software Ltd. - SGML DTD Viewer [ ] ZIFTech Computer Systems, Inc. 2. By vendor ------------ Application category is shown in brackets as B = Browser C = Conversion software D = Database E = Editor H = HyTime engine L = Page layout software P = Parser V = Various AIS Berger-Levrault - SGML/DB \<D> - SGML/Search \<D> ArborText Inc. - ADEPT Editor \<E> - ADEPT Publisher \<L> Auto-Graphics, Inc. - SGML Smart Editor \<E> Avalanche Development Co. - FastTAG \<C> - SGML Hammer \<C> Datalogics, Inc. - DL Composer \<L> - WriterStation \<E> E2S - EASE (E2S Advanced SGML Editor \<E> Electronic Book Technology - DynaText \<B> Exoterica Corp. - XGML CheckMark \<E> - XGML OmniMark \<P> - XGML Validator \<P> Frame Technology Corp. - FrameBuilder \<L> Grif S.A. - GRIF SGML Editor \<E> IBM Corp. - SGML Translator DCF Edition \<C> - TextWrite \<E> Microstar Software Ltd. - Near & Far \<V> MID Information Logistics Group - Balise \<C> Open Text Corp. - Lector \<B> - PAT \<D> PD - Amsterdam Parser \<P> - ARC-SGML \<P> - qwertz/FORMAT \<C> - sgmls \<P> SEMA Group - Mark-It \<P> - Write-It \<E> Shaffstall Corp. - SGML Translator \<C> SoftQuad, Inc. - Author/Editor \<E> Synex Information AB - SGML Darc \<D> TechnoTeacher, Inc. - HyMinder \<H> - MarkMinder \<P> Unifilt Co. - TableTAG \<C> Westinghouse Electric Corp. - Pathways \<B> WordPerfect Corp. - Intellitag \<E> ZIFTech Computer Systems, Inc. - SGML DTD Viewer \<V> \</sgmltools> </message> <message id="<93317.133429U35395@uicvm.uic.edu>" date="2962208069"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 13 Nov 1993 19:34:29 UT From: C. M. Sperberg-McQueen \<U35395@uicvm.uic.edu> Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago, ADN Computer Center Message-ID: <93317.133429U35395@uicvm.uic.edu> Subject: references to undeclared elements [C. M. Sperberg-McQueen] | This ought to be a warning, not an error message, I think: SGML | specifically allows elements to be referred to but not defined (clause | 11.2.4). [Peter Flynn] | I know it permits it, but that is a theoretical problem. A/E is a | practical application, and my feeling is that mkrls is right to reject | the DTD on this basis, otherwise users would be left with a partial | DTD. Hmm. I guess all I can say is that it becomes a practical problem if you work with the TEI DTDs (and, I daresay, many others): the TEI DTDs rely on being able to refer to elements whether they are declared or not. Many TEI content models, for example, refer to parameter entities like %phrase, the class of phrase-level elements, which includes both phrase-level elements defined in the core tag set and also phrase-level elements defined by optional additional tag sets. The ones in the additional tag sets, however, won't be declared unless the tag set which declares them is selected. But it is not an error not to have selected that tag set: that tag set is *optional*. That is, the TEI *relies* on clause 11.2.4, for the same reason that Goldfarb says the clause was included: it makes life much easier for those who define large public element sets which may reasonably be subsetted, and also for those who use those large public element sets. The alternative would be a somewhat hairier scheme to ensure that elements in an optional tag set get included in the declaration of %phrase (and the various other element classes!) only if the optional tag set is actually selected by the user -- as if the guts of the TEI's driver file weren't hairy enough as it is. (And note that even such a hairier scheme would not work, if you were to suppress one of the TEI elements; at least, not without adding complexity all out of proportion to what would be gained.) I agree that clause 11.2.4 makes it harder to distinguish between a DTD like the TEI DTD, behaving as designed, and a DTD which has lost some of its element declarations owing to errors in transmission. But I have no idea how to reconcile the desire for enforcement of a 'clean' document grammar with the need for convenient subsetting of large element sets, and given the conflict, I think the design of 8879 makes the right choice. -C. M. Sperberg-McQueen ACH/ALLC/ACL Text Encoding Initiative P.S. You ask about the TEI DTDs on the various servers; these are still being checked and fixed periodically, and so are subject to change without notice. Those who are working with them (and finding bugs) have our thanks, and an invitation to report problems directly to me or to Lou Burnard (lou@vax.ox.ac.uk), or preferably to both of us. Those who don't want to be pioneers should wait a few weeks, for an announcement that the DTDs are all there and clean enough for use by those who are not SGML hackers. [Apologies to those who get this twice, or who were confused by the garbling of the first version posted.] </message> <message id="<1993Nov14.032534.7945@stats.govt.nz>" date="2962236334"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 14 Nov 1993 03:25:34 UT From: "Gary Houston" \<ghouston@stats.govt.nz> Organization: Statistics New Zealand Message-ID: <1993Nov14.032534.7945@stats.govt.nz> References: <19931109.004@sfo.naggum.no> <19931110.018@sfo.naggum.no> <1993Nov11.134442.25810@gdstech.grumman.com> <2c1ecs$o0d@samba.oit.unc.edu> Subject: "was: Standard DTDs" \<Bibliographies> [Simon E Spero] | I think a far more productive activity would be to work on | standardising a few general purpose DTD fragments. For example, I have | a chunk o' DTD for references which is more or less a naive encoding of | MARC. Something like that would be very useful to standardise; | processing it nicely takes some fairly complicated code; however that | code can be reused whenever I use it with a different DTD. | | The chances of me getting my personal report DTD accepted by NISO are | not too good, and quite rightly so. However a standard way of handling | bibliographies would be much more useful and generally applicable. I've been thinking about this recently, in the quest for a bibliographic system for my own DTD. Some experimentation with the TEI method (from P2CO) has suggested that it would do the job, perhaps with some minor modifications (perhaps to mine, not TEI) during the shoehorning process It makes an interesting change from the Scribe/BiBTeX type systems. I'm not sure that I have completely recovered yet from the last contact I had with MARC, but I would still be interested in taking a look at how such an implementation would look (posting a chunk o' DTD to comp.text.sgml should be seen as the first step on the road to becoming one of the standards :-) A big problem with DTD fragments is going to be name-space collisions. I find this with the TEI fragment: my DTD already has \<title> and \<author> elements, and a system of phrases etc. The way in which bibliographic information is to be encoded can have ramifications elsewhere in the DTD. I hereby reserve the name "Snafu" for my DTD, unless a popular movement arises to make it a synonym for DTD in general :-) A question about the TEI DTD, just in case the relevant authorities are reading: Why is the biblScope attribute not permitted at the analytic level? It seems like a logical place to put the page numbers of an extract, rather than at the monograph level as suggested. Also a note, in case this has not already been fixed (is there a recent DTD fragment around somewhere? I am still missing several parameter entities): There are a few typos in the P2CO document. \<publ> is used instead of \<publisher> in one example. \<individual> is used in several places where \<indiv> is presumably intended. The content model for monogr has (edition, (editor | resp)*) where (edition, (editor | resp))* would be more reasonable (cf. examples which otherwise fail). Gary </message> <message id="<bosakCGHzCn.2HE@netcom.com>" date="2962295735"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml,alt.hypertext Date: 14 Nov 1993 19:55:35 UT From: "Jon Bosak" \<bosak@netcom.com> Message-ID: \<bosakCGHzCn.2HE@netcom.com> Subject: SGML/hypertext example available Persons looking for examples of commercial hypertext applications based on SGML may be interested in the following announcement, which was posted recently in comp.sys.novell. The NetWare 3.12 document set described below is freely available and demonstrates how basic hypertext concepts can be applied to existing printed materials. The electronic version contains all of the text and illustrations in the printed NetWare 3.12 manual set, which runs about 5000 pages. All of the books in the set were originally authored in FrameMaker and then converted to SGML using Avalanche FastTAG. After validation with the sgmls parser, the SGML was indexed using DynaText 1.5 from Electronic Book Technologies. The "ElectroText" viewer included with the set is a customized version of the DynaText 1.5 viewer for MS-Windows. We are currently in the process of converting from our old "homemade" DTD to the industry-standard DocBook DTD and from the old DynaText 1.5 environment to the current DynaText 2.x. We plan to make available revised versions of our manual sets using new viewers running across multiple platforms sometime in the first quarter of 1994. Jon Bosak Novell Corporate Publications ================================================ NETWARE 3.12 ELECTRONIC MANUALS AVAILABLE BY FTP ================================================ The ElectroText online documentation set for NetWare 3.12 is now available for download via anonymous ftp from ftp.novell.com in the directory /pub/documentation/corppubs/nw312. This release corrects a file-naming error in the collection provided on the NetWare 3.12 CD. It may be downloaded and used by anyone needing information about NetWare 3.12. Contents -------- This release includes both the electronic version of the NetWare 3.12 manual set and the ElectroText viewer for Windows. The complete set occupies about 41 MB of disk space and can be installed on either a NetWare server or a standalone workstation. Obtaining the manual set ------------------------ Download the set as follows: 1. ftp ftp.novell.com (or ftp 137.65.1.1) 2. Give your name as "ftp" and enter your email address when prompted for a password. 3. Enter the following commands at the ftp prompt: bin hash cd /pub/documentation/corppubs/nw312 4. Download directions for installing the manual set with the command get README 5. The manual set itself is available in two forms: a large compressed file named nw312d8.zip created with pkzip 2.04g and another large compressed file named nw312d8.tar.Z created with the Unix tar and compress utilities. Choose one of these two files depending on whether you wish to install the set using pkunzip running under DOS or uncompress and tar running under Unix. ElectroText currently runs only under Windows, so most users will want to download nw312d8.zip. The file nw312d8.tar.Z is provided for system administrators who wish to install the document set from a Unix system for network access from Windows workstations. Download one of the two large compressed files by entering either get nw312d8.zip or get nw312d8.tar.Z Make sure that you have previously entered the hash command to keep your connection from timing out during the download. 6. If you do not already have a copy of pkunzip, download it with the command get pkunzip.exe 7. Enter bye to close the connection. 8. Follow the directions in the README file to install the manual set. Note: Some sites will experience problems in downloading the manual set due to the large size of the compressed file. If you have set "bin" and "hash" according to the directions above and you still can't transfer the file successfully, then there is something wrong with your system configuration. Contact your system administrator for assistance in adjusting your system's spool size or timeout parameters. Novell cannot assist you in troubleshooting ftp transfer problems, and the complexity of the manual set's directory structure prevents us from providing its components in separate files. If you cannot download the manual set, it can be ordered on CD. See the ordering information included with your copy of NetWare 3.12 or contact your Novell distributor for details. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Jon Bosak -*- Information Architect -*- Novell Corporate Publications ---------------------------------------------------------------------- </message> <message id="<2c6dhj$bj6@frame.frame.com>" date="2962307059"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 14 Nov 1993 23:04:19 UT From: "Lynne Price" \<lprice@frame.com> Organization: Frame Technology Corporation Message-ID: <2c6dhj$bj6@frame.frame.com> References: <93314.150427U35395@uicvm.uic.edu> <753013087snz@pira2.demon.co.uk> \<JJC.93Nov11125002@jclark.jclark.com> Subject: Re: Can I "escape" delimiters in Attributes? James Clark correctly observes that general entity references can be used to enter the character strings used as the LIT and LITA delimiters into attribute values: [James Clark] | Markup that would terminate replaceable character data is not | recognized in an entity that was referenced from within the same | replaceable character data. | | Attribute value literals contain replaceable character data (production | 34). Numeric character references can also be used. See clause 9.5: A replacement character is treated as though it were entered directly except that the replacement for a numeric character reference is always treated as data in the context in which the replacement occurs. --Lynne </message> <message id="<ricko.753357516@ee.uts.EDU.AU>" date="2962346316"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 15 Nov 1993 09:58:36 UT From: "Rick Jelliffe" \<ricko@ee.uts.edu.au> Organization: University of Technology, Sydney Message-ID: \<ricko.753357516@ee.uts.EDU.AU> Keywords: SGML, OS/2 Summary: Request for OS/2 SGML applications Subject: SGML on OS/2 I am interested to know what SGML programs are available to run on OS/2 2.1. I can run: * X's Omnimark (omnic & omnir) * SQ's Author/Editor & RulesBuilder Rules Builder needed to have the correct DOS version passed to it. Author/Editor froze once: I don't know if that is an OS/2 thing or an A/E thing, or what yet. Does anyone else have anything else up? -ricko -- Rick Jelliffe Allette Systems and University of Technology, Sydney </message> <message id="<19931115.064609.134@almaden.ibm.com>" date="2962363271"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 15 Nov 1993 14:41:11 UT From: "Eliot Kimber" \<drmacro@vnet.IBM.COM> Message-ID: <19931115.064609.134@almaden.ibm.com> References: \<ricko.753357516@ee.uts.EDU.AU> Subject: Re: SGML on OS/2 [Rick Jelliffe] | I am interested to know what SGML programs are available to run on OS/2 | 2.1. I can run: | | * X's Omnimark (omnic & omnir) | * SQ's Author/Editor & RulesBuilder | | Rules Builder needed to have the correct DOS version passed to it. | Author/Editor froze once: I don't know if that is an OS/2 thing or an | A/E thing, or what yet. | | Does anyone else have anything else up? Datalogics sells the WriterStation/PM SGML editor for OS/2. It is rougly comparable to Author/Editor in function and price (more or less). WS/PM does some things A/E doesn't, doesn't do others. -- Eliot Kimber Internet: drmacro@vnet.ibm.com Dept E14/B500 IBMMAIL: USIB2DK9@IBMMAIL Network Programs Information Development Phone: 1-919-254-5160 IBM Corporation Research Triangle Park, NC 27709 "But Ranger Doug, can't we just use some proprietary data format instead of this SGML stuff?" "Sure Slim, that would be the easy way, but it wouldn't be the Cowboy Way." </message> <message id="<93319.170820U35395@uicvm.uic.edu>" date="2962393700"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 15 Nov 1993 23:08:20 UT From: "C. M. Sperberg-McQueen" \<U35395@uicvm.uic.edu> Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago, ADN Computer Center Message-ID: <93319.170820U35395@uicvm.uic.edu> References: <19931109.004@sfo.naggum.no> <19931110.018@sfo.naggum.no> <1993Nov11.134442.25810@gdstech.grumman.com> <2c1ecs$o0d@samba.oit.unc.edu> <1993Nov14.032534.7945@stats.govt.nz> Subject: Re: Bibliographies (was: Standard DTDs) [Gary Houston] | A big problem with DTD fragments is going to be name-space collisions. | I find this with the TEI fragment: my DTD already has \<title> and | \<author> elements, and a system of phrases etc. The way in which | bibliographic information is to be encoded can have ramifications | elsewhere in the DTD. I hereby reserve the name "Snafu" for my DTD, | unless a popular movement arises to make it a synonym for DTD in | general :-) Of course, the TEI DTD does allow elements to be renamed. If, for example, you want to use 'bibTitle' and 'bibAuthor' inside bibliographies (because, say, your 'title' and 'author' refer to the title and author of the document being encoded), this will do it; put it in your DTD subset: \<!ENTITY % n.title 'bibTitle' > \<!ENTITY % n.author 'bibAuthor' > (This also makes it easier to use DTDs in a language other than English; unfortunately, you have to put up with English in the attribute names or make somewhat more serious changes.) I should note in passing that the choice to use the shorter GI 'title' for bibliographic references rather than for the title of the document is an instance of a general design principle which the TEI attempts to apply, and which I recommend to everyone: use the shorter name for the more common element, and qualify the other one. Hence in the TEI DTD, 'title' refers to the title of a work being mentioned, and 'docTitle' to the title of the work being created, because the latter typically appears just once, on the title page, while there may be *lots* of bibligraphic references. | A question about the TEI DTD, just in case the relevant authorities are | reading: | | Why is the biblScope attribute not permitted at the analytic level? It | seems like a logical place to put the page numbers of an extract, | rather than at the monograph level as suggested. Hmm. good question. It's allowed at the monographic level since so many of (though not all of) the bibliographic styles want page numbers to follow the monographic information; I don't know that there is a good reason *not* to allow it at the analytic level, unless it's to prevent even the possibility of conflict with a biblScope at the monographic level (and that argument is a non-starter for something as vague as biblScope anyway). | Also a note, in case this has not already been fixed (is there a recent | DTD fragment around somewhere? I am still missing several parameter | entities): ... I think the most recent, cleanest DTDs are those on the sgml1.ex.ac.uk server. Thanks for the list of errors. -C. M. Sperberg-McQueen ACH / ACL / ALLC Text Encoding Initiative University of Illinois at Chicago </message> <message id="<2caa79$4ut@figment.dircon.co.uk>" date="2962437759"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 16 Nov 1993 11:22:39 UT From: Bruce Hunter \<bruce@sgml.dircon.co.uk> Message-ID: <2caa79$4ut@figment.dircon.co.uk> Subject: Release of Ox I've cross-posted this from comp.compilers, as I thought it might also be of interest to some folks here. I haven't tried it yet, but I plan to. This announces the first general release of Ox: An Attribute Grammar Compiling System based on Yacc, Lex, and C Ox generalizes the function of Yacc in the way that attribute grammars generalize context-free grammars. Ordinary Yacc and Lex specifications may be augmented with definitions of synthesized and inherited attributes written in C syntax. Ox checks these specifications for consistency and completeness, and generates from them a program that builds and decorates attributed parse trees. Ox accepts a most general class of attribute grammars. The user may specify postdecoration traversals for easy ordering of side effects such as code generation. Ox handles the tedious and error-prone details of writing code for parse-tree management, so its use eases problems of security and maintainability associated with that aspect of translator development. Ox is a Yacc/Lex/C preprocessor, and is designed to bring attribute grammars to the mainstream of Unix-based language development. Ox inherits all of the familiar syntax and semantics of Yacc, Lex, and C, so it is a good choice for language designers, experimenters, and developers familiar with those tools. It is relatively easy to convert programs between Ox code and "pure Yacc/Lex/C" code. Ox is carefully engineered for reliability, portability, compatibility, simplicity, and efficiency. Ox can be used with Bison, Flex, and C++. Use of Ox is free. Code generated by Ox is the property of the Ox user. The distribution is available by anonymous ftp from the directory `/pub/ox' on: ftp.cs.iastate.edu The Ox G1.01 distribution includes: * source code (Ox is written in Yacc, Lex, and C) * tutorial introduction (new, informal, 19 pages). This emphasizes examples and helps you cover the main points quickly. If you already know Yacc, Lex, and AGs, you are soon ready to begin using Ox with your favorite Yacc/Lex parser. * user reference manual (indexed, up-to-date, 57 pages) * on-line manual * small examples (files containing all of the examples from the user reference manual and the tutorial introduction) * Ox-ready Yacc/Lex parsers for C, C++, Pascal, Ada, and FORTRAN * a large example (block-structured imperative-language compiler suitable for instruction and experimentation) with documentation Ox is designed and implemented by Kurt Bischoff, in association with Kelvin Nilsen, Department of Computer Science, Iowa State University. Questions about Ox should be sent to: ox-request@cs.iastate.edu -- Kurt Bischoff, bischoff@cs.iastate.edu -- Send compilers articles to compilers@iecc.com or {ima | spdcc | world}!iecc!compilers. Meta-mail to compilers-request@iecc.com. </message> <message id="<19931116.061326.666@almaden.ibm.com>" date="2962447465"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 16 Nov 1993 14:04:25 UT From: "Eliot Kimber" \<drmacro@vnet.IBM.COM> Message-ID: <19931116.061326.666@almaden.ibm.com> References: <19931109.004@sfo.naggum.no> <19931110.018@sfo.naggum.no> <1993Nov11.134442.25810@gdstech.grumman.com> <1993Nov14.032534.7945@stats.govt.nz> Subject: Re: Bibliographies (was: Standard DTDs) [Gary Houston] | A big problem with DTD fragments is going to be name-space collisions. | I find this with the TEI fragment: my DTD already has \<title> and | \<author> elements, and a system of phrases etc. The way in which | bibliographic information is to be encoded can have ramifications | elsewhere in the DTD. I hereby reserve the name "Snafu" for my DTD, | unless a popular movement arises to make it a synonym for DTD in | general :-) The way to avoid name space collisions is to define architectures, not DTDs (although the architecture may be defined as a DTD "template", as HyTime is). In the simple case, the concrete instantiation of the architecture uses the architectural form names as the actual element GIs (e.g., nameloc GI used for instances of Nameloc architectural forms), but concrete DTDs can also uses other GIs as well, since the architecture-level processing only looks at the architectural form name. Name conflict between archtectures is avoided because each architecture has its own "architectural form declaration attribute", e.g. HyTime= for the HyTime architecture, InfoMaster= for the InfoMaster Architecture, TEI= for the TEI architecture. -- Eliot Kimber Internet: drmacro@vnet.ibm.com Dept E14/B500 IBMMAIL: USIB2DK9@IBMMAIL Network Programs Information Development Phone: 1-919-254-5160 IBM Corporation Research Triangle Park, NC 27709 "But Ranger Doug, can't we just use some proprietary data format instead of this SGML stuff?" "Sure Slim, that would be the easy way, but it wouldn't be the Cowboy Way." </message> <message id="<2cbekb$s14@dr-pepper.East.Sun.COM>" date="2962472011"> Newsgroups: comp.infosystems.www,comp.lang.postscript,comp.text.sgml,comp.text.desktop,comp.unix.solaris Followup-To: comp.infosystems.www Date: 16 Nov 1993 20:53:31 UT From: "Gary Adams" \<Gary.Adams@East.Sun.COM> Organization: Sun Microsystems Laboratories, Inc. Message-ID: <2cbekb$s14@dr-pepper.East.Sun.COM> Keywords: pdf viewer html hypertext links ghostview Subject: PDF viewer or pdf2html filter ? Does anyone have a viewer for Adobe's PDF files? My initial thoughts are to modify a copy of ghostview to "do the right thing" for the basic PostScript capabilities. Another approach might be to create a PDF to HTML filter and use a standard web client for viewing. Would it be possible to extend the PDF definition to include URL links? A simple commenting convention like the links in AnswerBook documents for hypertext links might go a long way for interoperability. e.g. %%HTML \<a href="foo"> bar \</a> or %%Link ... Thanks for any pointers or "land mine" warnings. -- Gary R. Adams Email: Gary.Adams@East.Sun.COM Sun Microsystems Laboratories, Inc. Tel: (508) 442-0416 Two Elizabeth Drive Fax: (508) 250-5067 Chelmsford MA 01824-4195 USA (Sun mail stop: UCHL03-207) </message> <message id="<FUCHS.93Nov17002840@aye.nyu.edu>" date="2962484920"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 17 Nov 1993 00:28:40 UT From: "Matthew Fuchs" \<fuchs@graphics.cs.nyu.edu> Organization: Courant Institute of Mathematical Sciences Message-ID: \<FUCHS.93Nov17002840@aye.nyu.edu> References: <19931109.004@sfo.naggum.no> <19931110.018@sfo.naggum.no> <1993Nov11.134442.25810@gdstech.grumman.com> <1993Nov14.032534.7945@stats.govt.nz> <19931116.061326.666@almaden.ibm.com> Subject: Re: Bibliographies (was: Standard DTDs) I understand DTDs, etc., but might someone give some pointers to what an "architecture" is? The term is starting to show up often in this group. Thanks, Matthew [Editor's note: This is in reply to Eliot Kimber's article. \</E>] </message> <message id="<1993Nov17.091007.1446@edf.fr>" date="2962516207"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 17 Nov 1993 09:10:07 UT From: "Christophe Espert" \<espert@edf.fr> Organization: EDF Direction des Etudes et Recherches Message-ID: <1993Nov17.091007.1446@edf.fr> References: <1993Nov9.225810.25034@fripp.ri.cadre.com> Subject: Re: C++ Class Library for SGML?? [Joe Cascio] | Please pardon if this is a FAQ. I am trying to find out if there are | any C++ libraries available for free or for sale which present an API | to SGML documents and abstractions. Such an API/Library would allow | you to parse an SGML file, and be delivered a network of class or | struct instances linked together with pointers that represent the | semantic elements in the document. For instance, you might get an | instance of "SgmlElementDefn" that represented the content description | of the element (say "Chapter") that's found in the DTD. | | You would also get multiple instances of "SgmlElementInstance" for each | Chapter in the document. The instance would point to it's element | defn, and have a collection of pointers to the element instances | composing the Chapter. Such a thing exists today. It is called MarkMinder/HyMinder and can be purchased from TechnoTeacher, Inc. 1810 High Road Tallahassee. FL 32303-4408 USA Tel: 904-422-3574 Fax: 904 386 2562 You can also contact Dr. Steven R. Newcomb, TechnoTeacher's President by e-mail: srn@techno.com. MarkMinder is a set of C++ libraries to build SGML applications. It is beautifully designed and represents from my point of view a REAL SGML parsing system. You can of course do usual things such as validation, but MarkMinder allows you to do much more. MarkMinder will also represent the SGML substrate for TechnoTeacher's HyTime engine, HyMinder. I suggest you contact Steve Newcomb for more information, especially prices. (As I can remember the product is cheap.) I can also tell you that something big is going to come out in the public domain by the end of this year hopefully and it might be of interest for you. Regards, Chris -- Christophe Espert Electricite De France | Direction Etudes et Recherches | 1, Avenue du General de Gaulle | ISO/IEC 8879:1986 - SGML 92141 Clamart CEDEX - FRANCE | ISO/IEC 10744:1992 - HyTime Tel: 33.1.47.65.43.21 ext. 6635 | ISO/DIS 10179 - DSSSL Fax: 33.1.47.65.50.07 | E-mail:espert@cln46fw.der.edf.fr | </message> <message id="<2cdbda$dhd@figment.dircon.co.uk>" date="2962534250"> Newsgroups: comp.text,comp.text.desktop,comp.text.sgml Date: 17 Nov 1993 14:10:50 UT From: "Bruce Hunter" \<bruce@sgml.dircon.co.uk> Organization: SGML Systems Engineering Message-ID: <2cdbda$dhd@figment.dircon.co.uk> Subject: Quark Xpress Tags format Does anyone know where there is description of the Quark Xpress Tags form at for Version 3.11? The description of this format in the Reference Manual bears no relation to what is actually found in the files. Any help greatly appreciated. Thanks. Best wishes, -- Bruce Hunter SGML Systems Engineering bruce@sgml.dircon.co.uk </message> <message id="<199311171810.KAA24311@netcomsv.netcom.com>" date="2962538755"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 17 Nov 1993 15:25:55 UT From: Chet Ensign \<DOCCOE@IBIVM.IBMMAIL.COM> Message-ID: <199311171810.KAA24311@netcomsv.netcom.com> Subject: SGML Forum of NY Presents Peter Jerrum of Novell ANNOUNCEMENT: SGML FORUM OF NEW YORK The SGML Forum of New York invites you to attend Novell's Integrated Publishing System: an SGML Case Study Date: Tuesday, November 30, 1993, 5:30 p.m. Place: McGraw-Hill, Inc. 2nd Floor Conference Center 1221 Avenue of the Americas (lobby entrance off 49th Street) Agenda: 5:30 Registration and Opening Remarks 5:45 Keynote Speaker: Peter Jerrum, Novell Inc. "Novell's Integrated Publishing System" 6:30 Refreshments 7:00 Vendor Demonstration: Chip Pettibone, EBT Dynatext At our November meeting, Peter Jerrum, Director of Corporate Publications at Novell, Inc. will describe how Novell incorporated SGML into an established technical writing department in order to deliver the documentation for Netware Release 4.0 online. Novell's Integrated Publishing System introduced SGML with minimal disruption to the procedures or tools that their writers were already using. For our vendor presentation, Chip Pettibone, Regional Sales Manager for Electronic Book Technologies (EBT) will demonstrate Dynatext, an electronic publishing system that accepts and exploits SGML directly. Dynatext is the delivery engine used by Novell for their online manuals. Upcoming Programs: On January 18th, Tommie Usdin from ATLIS Consulting Group will talk about analyzing documents and developing DTDs. If you've wondered how this critical aspect of SGML system design is done, this session is for you. David Harkness of WordPerfect will demonstrate Intellitag, WordPerfect's tool for coupling SGML constructs to their popular word processor. About the Forum The SGML Forum of New York is a nonprofit organization devoted to the exchange of ideas and information about SGML. Organized primarily as a user group, the Forum seeks to promote an understanding of the scope and benefits of the SGML standard and to further its practical application within a variety of industries, including publishing, financial services, insurance, pharmaceuticals, and telecommunications. Membership helps support the Forum's activities, but it is not required for attending general meetings. If you would like to receive word about future Forum meetings, send your name and address to: SGML Forum of New York, Inc. Bowling Green Station P.O. Box 803 New York, NY 10274-0803 We will be happy to put you on our mailing list. </message> <message id="<19931117.151435.770@almaden.ibm.com>" date="2962545250"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 17 Nov 1993 17:14:10 UT From: "Eliot Kimber" \<drmacro@vnet.IBM.COM> Message-ID: <19931117.151435.770@almaden.ibm.com> Subject: IBMIDDOC Changes to Comply with HyTime Standard If you have received from us a copy of the IBMIDDoc DTD and/or documentation, please note that we are in the process of updating the hyperlinking design to make it completely HyTime conformant. When we started doing the IBMIDDoc design, our understanding of HyTime of was incomplete, and we made a few design choices that seemed reasonable at the time, but in retrospect, were not the best thing to do, now that we better understand HyTime. In short, we have resolved all the various attributes used to create specific types of hyperlinks (Annotations=, RetrievalAlts=, PropertyRef=, and Revisions=), into a set of defined anchor roles to be used in conjunction with a single Linkends= attribute. Thus, where in the old design you would specify retrieval alts like so: \<p retrievalalts="alt1 alt2"> You would now do: \<nameloc id=alts> \<nmlist>alt1 alt2\</nmlist> \</nameloc> \<p linkends="alts" anchorroles="alternate linksource"> Where the anchor roles "alternate and linksource" are IBMIDDoc-defined anchor roles, and the association of the alternate role to the Linkends= ID value "alts" indicates that the objects ultimately located are alternates of the linksource element. We have also removed the Docname= (our name for Docorsub=) from all elements except NMList, and are now allowing Nameloc within DataPool (phrase-level) content for convenience. While this change leads to more characters of markup, it is completely HyTime compliant. We are further assuming that editor functionality will be used to hide the complexity of the markup itself, letting authors focus on the semantics of the hyperlinks and not the details of their encodings. (This approach also suggested to me that part of any SGML application design should be an abstract definition of the authoring functionality the application designer expects to be provided in any conforming authoring implementation, parallel with an abstract definition of the processing functionality. In a sense you could think of this definition as the authoring "style" to be applied to the source document -- a nice bit of symmetry, I think). I am in the process of updating the documentation and Wayne is slaving over the DTD changes. If you've requested a copy of the IBMIDDoc documentation, I am delaying sending it out until these changes are finalized. -- Eliot Kimber Internet: drmacro@vnet.ibm.com Dept E14/B500 IBMMAIL: USIB2DK9@IBMMAIL Network Programs Information Development Phone: 1-919-254-5160 IBM Corporation Research Triangle Park, NC 27709 "But Ranger Doug, can't we just use some proprietary data format instead of this SGML stuff?" "Sure Slim, that would be the easy way, but it wouldn't be the Cowboy Way." </message> <message id="<19931118T085810Z@news.naggum.no>" date="2962547530"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 17 Nov 1993 17:52:10 UT From: "Steven R. Collard" \<Steve_Collard.SD@xerox.com> Message-ID: <19931118T085810Z@news.naggum.no> Subject: Documation '94 Conference/Expo, Feb 21-25, Los Angeles In light of recent requests of more advanced notice of conference information, here is the Documation '94 Conference Information forwarded from Marion Elledge of the GCA. Steve Collard Xerox/XSoft Publishing Systems San Diego, California ---------------------------------------------------------------- Please feel free to distribute the information on Documation '94 in the same fashion as SGML '93. Thanks, Marion L. Elledge (document@well.sf.ca) DOCUMATION '94 Conference and Exposition Century Plaza Hotel and Tower Los Angeles, California USA February 21-25, 1994 Frank Gilbane Conference Chair DOCUMATION '94 the international forum for document management applications, document systems and document computing Managing documents and the information they contain is the most important information management challenge facing businesses today. New products and technologies are reshaping the information technology industry as publishing, document management, workflow, imaging, database, retrieval, and computer system suppliers all focus on the problem of managing document information with the same flexibility and control we demand of corporate database applications. Document system technology has begun to have a profound impact on the way businesses operate in both local and competitive global environments, and will drive corporate information management strategies in the 90s. This is why document management is now widely recognized as the most critical client/server application for businesses to focus on. Documation is the annual event where the future direction of document management technology will be decided by corporate users and technology suppliers. At Documation you will see and hear what you need to know about document management applications. Help define the future of the document computing industry -- join us at Documation '94! GENERAL SESSION Tuesday Morning, February 22 Document, Data & Image Management 8:30 am - 12:30 pm Chair: Frank Gilbane, President, PTM, Publisher, The Gilbane Report Businesses looking for document management solutions are confronted with a variety of solutions from different segments of the information technology industry. There is a confusing and sometimes conflicting array of terminology being used. In the opening session our keynote speakers will address: What is document management? What are the roles of publishing, data base, document management,workflow/imaging and integration suppliers? Who is best equipped to supply you with a document management solution? General Session Keynotes: Charles M. Geschke, President & COO, Abobe Systems, Inc. Peter Lamb, Senior Partner, Andersen Consulting Mark Ruport, President & CEO, Interleaf, Inc. Larry Stevens, Vice President, Office Systems, Oracle Corporation Jordan Libit, Vice President, Marketing, FileNet Tuesday Afternoon, Tuesday, February 22 2:00 pm - 4:45 pm Document, Data & Image Management Sessions Track Chair: Matthew Shanahan, Manager, Andersen Consulting Document and image management have not only become high profile technologies, they are quickly becoming integral to organizations' information infrastructures. These technologies can easily frustrate or derail a project if they are deployed incorrectly or for the wrong reasons.The document management track will present sessions to help you plan successful deployment and alignment of document and image management systems within your information infrastructure. These sessions address the following questions: What are the tools that comprise document management? How can they be used to reengineer my business processes?, and What is the role of workflow? Understanding the state of the market is key to successfully implementing a project in the near term, but understanding current challenges and industry directions allow strategic technology decisions to be made. It is with this in mind that the document management track will investigate issues such as the role of object management and how to manage documents in conjunction with external data stores. The sessions that deal with these issues are intended to provide you with insight and inputinto industry technology directions. Tools of the Trade: What are the tools that comprise document management? Chair: Claude Finn, Vice President of Information Technologies, Datalogics Division of Frame Technology Corporation. Speakers: Brian Cassidy, Vice President, Saros Corporation John Newton, Chief Architect, DOCUMENTUM, Inc., David Ruiz, Director, Product Marketing, ViewStar Corporation Tools of the Trade will be a panel session that provides attendees with an inventory of tools and utilities, comprising a document management system. Rather that providing a top down definition of document management, the panelists of this session will define the tools and utilities that they feel are required within a document management system. Along with describing the tools, panelists will define the purpose of the tools and the motivations for incorporation the tools within a given system.Examples of these tools and utilities include version management,document access auditor, tool launchers, converters and archival mechanisms. Business Process Reengineering: How does document management change my business? Chair: Matt Shanahan, Manager, Andersen Consulting Speakers: Scott Wilson, Partner, Deloitte and Touche, Michael Devereol, Partner, Deloitte and Touche, Bill Braasch, President, Database Architects, Inc. The session will present three aspects of business process reengineering as it pertains to document management. The first presentation will cover a survey of document management implementations. The second presentation will develop a profile of process improvement opportunities within an organization and a set of metrics for verifying the process improvements. The third presentation will describe value-driven reengineering as a part of a document management systems implementation. The goal of this session is to develop an understanding of the role of document management within the organization, the metrics for managing success and methods for achieving successful business integration. Case Studies: Best of Breed Integration, Image and Document Integration, Project Life Cycle Chair: Catherine Leloup, Director, GEIE Gavel (France) Speakers: Paula Angerstein, Director, Product Development, Texcel (UK) Michael Polelle, Manager, Andersen Consulting, Helmut Faasch, Information Systems Engineering, Lufthansa German Airlines (Germany), Jean Louis Henriot, LASCOM (France), Gareth Lloyd, Westrn Provident Association This session will present a series of case studies about document management implementations. The goal of this session is to deliver practical considerations to attendees as the result of document management projects that have been implemented within the last year. The first case study will present a "best-of-breed" integration in which disparate authoring, document management and viewing tools were integrated into a seamless authoring and retrieval platform. The second case study will present a systems implementation that integrated image and document management. The third case study will present the life cycle of a document management project examining the development process from initial design to application roll-out. Workflow and Document Management: Competing or Complementary Technologies? Chair: Ronni Marshak, Editor & Chief, Workgroup Computing Report Speakers: Daniel Cheifetz, President, Odesta, Dave Seaman, President, InfoDesign, Frank Deven, Aldus Workflow is an important aspect of any document system. Workflow is the enabler that allows the processes associated with a document to be managed. This session answers the questions: How does workflow integrate with document management? and are workflow and document management competing technologies? As a panel session, the goal will be to develop a positioning of workflow within a document system. The session will provide a description of the role of workflow within a document system and the types of workflow a document system will encompass, e.g. ad-hoc, process-based and project-based. As a follow up, the session panelists will define the requirements of a workflow monitor. The panelists will additionally discuss the ability to integrate a workflow product with a document management product. Documents as Objects: Is It Necessary? Chair: Larry Bohn, Senior Vice President, Business Development, Interleaf, Inc. Speakers: Tom Atwood, Chairman, Object Design Others to be announced Document management systems are increasingly using object-based technologies to model and encapsulate documents. Is an object oriented technology ultimately required to manage documents? Is it relational technology that is required?, or is it both? The goal of this session is to help managers make decision on technology directions for methodologies, development tools and databases. This session will examine the object issue by examining the factors influencing the object decision. Factors include data type support in relational databases, inheritance of document attributes and behavior (reuse), techniques for object encapsulation (e.g. SGML), techniques for encapsulating behavior (e.g. RPC), version control and performance. Managing Collections: Managing Large Numbers of Documents and Multiple External Databases Chair: Michael Rogers, Director, Information Technology Products, SunSoft Inc. Speakers to be announced Document management systems not only manage a single instance of a document but must in many cases manage collections of documents and relationships to multiple external data stores. This session will investigate the techniques required to manage collections and relationships. The synchronization, transaction control and interchange. The goal of this session is to provide attendees with a background for making technology decisions concerning document management of thousands of documents and collections of documents that are tightly integrated to external systems. Wednesday, February 23, General Session Document System Technology 8:30 am - 10:30 am Chair: Frank Gilbane Some corporate requirements for management of complex document information can only be efficiently achieved with low level support from operating environments. In this session our keynote presenters will provide a look at what is coming and what we need in the form of compound document architectures, document-oriented interfaces, and other platform technologies that will facilitate document management and information delivery. General Session Keynotes: Larry Tesler, Chief Scientist, Apple Computer Bruce Tognazzini, Distinguished Engineer, Sun Microsystems Invited Speaker to be announced Vertical Industry Senior Executive Forum 11:00 am - 12:30 pm Chair: Frank Gilbane Large vertical industries face similar document management problems, yet use different terminology and sometimes choose different kinds of solutions. In this session we will examine what document management problems some of these industries have in common, and where they differ. You will hear from leading executives in four vertical industries talk about the important document management challenges they face, and what they require from suppliers and integrators to meet them. Speakers: Ed Jowdy, Senior Vice President, Information Technology, Aetna Life & Casualty Fred Mitchell, Vice President, Customer Service, The Boeing Company Charles Popper, Vice President, Corporate Computer Resources, Merck & Company Donald G. Hedeen, Director, Desktops and Deployment, General Motors Corporation Wednesday Afternoon 2:00 pm - 4:45 pm Document Creation & Capture: Standards, Technology and Applications Sessions Chair: Jack Gold, The Meta Group This track includes corporate publishing application case studies and covers technical issues in the creation component of document systems. How can SGML provide for interoperability between authoring and document management systems? How do you decide which kind of authoring system you need to meet your company's information management requirements? Which new technologies for authoring systems are ready for prime time? What are the authoring issues you need to be aware of when creating information for electronic delivery? What technologies are being developed to "image enable" horizontal applications? What is the state-of-the-art in scanning and recognition software? Interoperability Success Stories & Challenges Chair: Pamela Gennusa, Chief Marketing Officer, SGML Open Speakers: Companies who have implemented SGML systems In this session members of the SGML Open consortium will host customers who will describe the challenges they face integrating authoring, publishing and database systems in ways that allow them to share and re-use structured information. SGML Open members will describe how the work of the consortium addresses these challenges. Learn why so many companies have chosen SGML as a foundation for managing information in documents. Choosing An Authoring System for Corporate Applications Chair: Linda Burman, Director of Marketing, SoftQuad Inc. Speakers: David Harkness, Director, Electronic Publishing Tools, WordPerfect Corporation, Yuri Rubinsky, President, SoftQuad Inc. Others from Frame, InContext to be announced. In this session vendors of word processors, structured authoring, and WYSIWYG authoring systems will each describe the kinds of applications best suited to their type of authoring system. Conversion, database integration, and demanding publishing applications all impose requirements on authors. Is there a single best solution for you? Advanced Authoring Technology for Corporate Publishing Chair: Craig Cline, Associate Editor, Seybold Publications Speakers: Doug Gorman, President, Information Mapping; Lisa Wellman, Industry Manager, Publishing, Apple Computer; Lorraine Fox, Manager, Interactive Services Strategy, Sun Microsystems Computer Company Authoring systems that only allow for the creation of black and white text and illustrations are no longer sufficient for many kinds of technical documentation, training, and other corporate publishing applications.Electronic delivery for desktops and PDAs as well as low cost color printers are upping the ante. Hypertext, color, and multimedia support are all being added to authoring systems. This session will discuss the challenges these new features entail, and what makes sense to implement today, and what strategies make sense for the future. Image-Enabling Horizontal Applications Chair: Keith Dawson, Contributing Editor, The Gilbane Report Speakers: Kevin Strehlo, Executive Editor, Reviews and Testing, InfoWorld; David Skok, President, Watermark; John Hoy, Marketing Manager, Kodak Imagery Document imaging is moving from a specialized application towards a horizontal system service. Solutions are becoming available that enable a broad range of applications on a network to make use of faxes, scanned pages, and other kinds of images. Infrastructure is being developed that will provide the document-management and storage-management services that imaging requires for the same broad range of applications. Panel members will provide perspectives on the development, present reality,and future direction of image as a data type. Technical Documentation Case Studies: Government Applications Chair: Robin Tomlin, Senior Manager, Federal & Industrial Publishing Solutions, Intergraph Corporation Speakers: Horace Layton, Senior Project Manager, Computer Sciences Corporation, Donald Rollert and James Byers, Government Printing Office. Others to be announced. This session provides an opportunity to hear from users involved in large government technical document system applications. Standards issues for forms, IETMs (Interactive Electronic Technical Manuals), and CALS,integration, document distribution, and costs and benefits will all be covered. Compound Documents: Using Compound Document Architectures With Document Management Systems Chair: Richard Hay, Vice President, Marketing, DOCUMENTUM, Inc. Speakers: Kurt Piersol, Software Architect, Apple Computer, Paul Grosso, Vice President, Arbortext. Others to be announced. Document authoring or capture tools provide mechanisms for constructing large documents from graphics, tables, data from other applications and multiple sub documents. A document built from multiple object types is typically called a compound document and while authoring tools support a document's construction, the document management tools assume that the compound document will be stored in the directories of the computer's file system, not in a document repository. This session will examine the issues of managing compound documents using a repository both in terms of what is possible in the market today and what the approaches will be in the future. Compound document technologies examined include Object Linking and Embedding, OpenDoc, proprietary architectures and SGML. Thursday, February 24, General Session Document Presentation & Distribution 8:30 am - 10:30 am Chair: Frank Gilbane There is no hotter topic these days than electronic document delivery. Businesses are already implementing electronic delivery systems and reducing document distribution costs. Businesses also have many requirements for rapid delivery of paper documents, and will for the foreseeable future. There are still challenges facing companies who want to implement on-demand document delivery for either electronic or paper media, including support for color, multimedia, or hypernavigation, and integrating a delivery system with a document management system. Our keynote presenters will discuss the challenges and predict how document delivery applications will evolve. General Session Keynotes: Ed Heresniak, Senior Vice President, Information Technology, McGraw-Hill Ron Brumback, Senior Vice President, Information Management Services & Products, R.R. Donnelley & Sons Dennis Andrews, President, X-Soft Thursday Vertical Industry Tracks 11:00 am - 12:30 pm Each of the four vertical industry sessions (automotive, aviation, insurance, and pharmaceutical) will be devoted to the most critical document management problem facing each industry. Hear representatives from each of these industries discuss the requirements they face, and what they are doing to meet them. This is an opportunity to see and learn from what other industries are doing to manage documents and document information. Commerical Aviation Chair: Frank Ruggiero, Manager, Technology Development, The Boeing Company Speakers: Peter M. Morton, Director, Customer Training, Boeing Commercial Airplane Group, Lou Mancini, Vice President Engineering and Fleet Operations, Northwest Airlines Inc. Ron Sorenson, Director Information Technology, Canadian Air International (Retired) Dave Fastenow, Director Integration Technology Management, Collins Air Transport Div., Rockwell International Pharmaceutical Chair: Fred Moehle, Consultant Speakers: Barry Behnken, Director Quality Control, Schwarz-Pharma, Dennis Devonshuk, CANDA Task Force, Miles Pharmaceuticals, Dr.Joshua Sharline, Reviewer FDA Center for Veterinary Medicine Automotive Chair: Connie Greaser, Manager, Service Communications, American Honda Company Speakers to be announced. Insurance Chair: Richard Stover, Editor, Document Management & Windows Imaging Magazine Speakers: Lou Londono, Assistant Vice President & Director AMS Strategic Systems, ITT Hartford George McKenna, President, Roll Systems. Others to be announced. Thursday Afternoon: Document Distribution Sessions 2:00 pm - 4:45 pm Track Chair: Mary Laplante, President, Laplante & Associates Meeting the Challenge of Electronic Document Distribution Chair: Jamie Popkin, The Gartner Group Speakers: Kent Summers, Director, Marketing, Electronic Book Technologies, Bill Freeland, Product Marketing Manager, Interleaf Inc. Clint Nagy, Vice President, Adobe Systems, Rick Dillhoff, CEO, InfoAccess, Robert J. Glushko, Chief Scientist, Passage Systems Inc. In this session, vendors and their customers discuss real-world applications for electronic document delivery products and technologies. Vendor panelists will briefly describe their company, their products, and the capabilities that make them unique in the marketplace. Customer panelists will describe their business problems, the solutions that they developed, and how they leveraged their vendors' product strengths to solve the problems and create competitive advantage. The team discussions are preceded by an overview of electronic document delivery, including a report on the current state-of-the-art and methodology for determining the benefits and risks of implementing electronic distribution within your company. Managing Document Printing and Distribution Chair: Brian Corrigan, Pesko and Associates Speakers: Ron Arelano, Director, Publishing Operations, F.W. Dodge, Carolyn Strong, Test and Measurement, Documentation Manager, Tektronix. Others to be announced. Companies with large-scale document production and distribution requirements can be overwhelmed by the challenges involved in publishing, printing, and distributing hundreds of thousands of documents a year. In this session, speakers describe how their companies are successfully meeting these challenges. They will explain how their organizations saved money, reduced production time, and improved reader satisfaction with various print-related technologies including: - On-demand printing - Automatic production and distribution of customized documents - Network printing architectures Delivering Performing-Critical Information Chair: Jim Giles, Senior Research Fellow, Logistics Management Institute Speakers: Jeff Pepper, President, ServiceWare, Inc., Harry Caplowitz, President, InfoData Systems, Inc. Others to be announced. Performance-critical documents are documents that support the optimum performance of task-related work. They convey knowledge and information that helps people execute tasks more efficiently, more effectively, and more consistently. Such documents play an important role in customer and product support environments, where users need fast access to very specific information. This session explains how business organizations can leverage their investment in corporate knowledge by using leading-edge document distribution technologies to deliver performance-critical documents an realize the benefits associated with getting the right information to the right people at the right time. Automating Document Distribution Chair: Janet Endrijonas, Editor, Managing Automation Speakers: Steven Kiser, Vice President, Business Development, XSoft Others to be announced. Many companies have attempted to address the challenges of reducing costs, improving productivity, and enhancing quality by automating manufacturing and production processes. This session looks at some of those automation efforts and examines how they can serve as models for automating the distribution of documents, both print and electronic. What do the successes -- and the failures -- tell us? How can we apply the economic, social, and technical lessons we've learned from automating other business processes to building information distribution systems for the 21st century? Keep the Customer Satisfied: Assessing Requirements for Document Distribution Chair: Carlton Neville, Consultant Speakers: Les Cowan, Publisher, Micro Publishing News Carmen Egido, Bellcore The new technologies for generating and distributing documents can offer great potential for economic and productivity benefits within your company. But how do they affect people outside your organization? Most importantly, what impact will your decision to adopt new document technologies have on your customers? In this session, speakers share their experiences with assessing customer response to new distribution methods. They also offer practical advice on evaluating customer-related risks and on helping them to make the technology transition with you. Additional Conference Speakers Confirmed Colin Brace, Editor, Language Industry Monitor, Harvey Spencer, Harvey Spencer Associates, Ken Goist, Senior Information Analyst, Computer Task Group, Steve Sklepowich, Product Marketing Manager, Apple Computer Tim Bray, Founder, Open Text, Paul Deccico, Partner, Branscomb, Decicco, Copelowitz & Quinn. About the sponsors -- What is GCA? GCA is a volunteer non-profit membership association formed in 1966 to apply computer technology to printing and publishing. Its purpose is to bring about the coordination among industry segments that is necessary to apply technologies and in other ways increase productivity and market responsiveness in the creation, manufacture, distribution, management and marketing of information. GCA currently has over 40 working committees developing industry specifications and standards and providing solutions to a number of document production and delivery issues. GCA sponsors a number of annual conferences, such as the TechDoc Series, Spectrum and Color Connections and tutorials providing the forums for examining a vast number of topics and technology advancements, presenting solutions, and encouraging user to user and user to supplier interface. What is PTM & The Gilbane Report? Publishing Technology Management, Inc., is publisher of The Gilbane Report on Open Information and Document Systems, and an independent international consulting organization specializing in open information technology. The Gilbane Report covers the same issues being addressed at Documation. PTM provides consulting service and seminars in the U.S. and Europe on document systems, document management and electronic delivery. PTM clients include: the U.S. government, computer manufacturers, software suppliers, aerospace and manufacturing companies, and system integrators. What is GCARI? GCARI, the Graphic Communications Association Research Institute, is a nonprofit organization devoted to the support of technological advancements in information technology and graphic arts through the establishment, coordination and funding of research and development to create and apply new opportunities for information managment and dissemination. The Documation Exposition The Documation Exposition will showcase the latest in open document and information systems technology and applications. Suppliers participating in the exposition will represent publishing systems and software, database management software, document storage and retrieval systems, information management systems, imaging systems, conversion software, client/server architectures and multiple platform solutions. Over 30,000 square feet of exposition space has been reserved. If your organization is interested in exhibiting, please contact Tanya Bosse at GCARI. Telephone (703) 519-8174. Exposition space may be reserved after July 5. There will be a major emphasis on new product releases and press announcements. The Documation Exposition will be managed by GCARI. All income from the Exposition will be used for research and development. Exposition hours Tuesday, February 22 12:30 pm - 8:00 pm Wednesday, February 23 10:00 am - 7:00 pm Thursday, February 24 10:00 am -7:00 pm Exhibitors to date include: Andersen Consulting Arbortext CALS Journal Computer Sciences Corporation Computer Task Group Database Publishing Systems Data Conversion Laboratory Datalogics Documentum Electronic Book Technologies Exoterica FileNet Frame Technologies GCA GCARI ICL, Ltd. Information Dimensions Inc. InfoAccess InContext InfoDesign Intergraph Interleaf Inc. PTM SoftQuad Inc. SGML Open Texcel Ltd. US Army Printing & Publishing US Lynx Westinghouse Xerox Corporation X-Soft Xyvision Tutorials - Monday, February 21, 1994 Tutorials precede Documation '94 to provide up-to-speed/or in-depth discussions of mainstream issues to be addressed during the conference program. These sessions will provide conference participants with a better understanding of the terminology, methodology and technology discussed in the following three days. Introduction to Document Management The term "document management" has a different meaning to anyone you ask to define the term. And one definition is probably just as good as any other. This session will take a look at the basic concepts of document management and attempt to provide a better understanding of how to define it; what processes are involved; the terminology; and available technology. Industry Standards Can you define the following standards? CCITT, TIFF, SGML, DSSSL, HyTime, ODA, SQL, CGM. Can you make the decision on which to use in your organization? What are the benefits of one over another? How does one work with the others? What products are available today to support these standards? This session will provide a guide to industry standards and how each plays a role in the overall process of document management. Electronic Distribution A number of options are available today for the electronic distribution of information. How must information be created and managed to allow for the method of electronic distribution that you chose? What technology is available now to support delivery of information through electronic books,online and optical disks? How does electronic mail play a role? Imaging & Workflow What are the components of an imaging system? What are the unique aspects of imaging? How does image processing fit into an organization's overall document management philosophy? What is the relationship between imaging and electronic workflow? What technologies support electronic workflow? This session will provide answers to these questions and present examples of existing applications. Database Technology A number of issues must be addressed in building an organizational database. How is the information to be accessed? For what purposes will the information be used? What are the advantages of object-oriented database technologies over relational? Will the database be centralized or decentralized? Is security an issue? Does SGML meet organizational requirements? What tools are available today to support document management? Authoring & Copyright Issues As documents go electronic, information can be re-used in ways that its author never intended. Who "owns" electronic documents? Does it matter whether the author is an employee? What about multimedia -- are the rules the same for text, graphics, sound or movies? What kinds of re-use are permitted under the law? What constitutes permission? How far must corporations go to police their employees' use of information? What if you also do business oveseas -- whose law applies? In this sesson we look at the many questions corporations must ask themselves when doing business in the electronc age, and we discuss tools and procedures that can help firms minimize their liability. Industry Advisory Board Representatives from the following organizations serve on the Industry Advisory Board: Adobe Systems Aetna Life and Casualty American Honda Andersen Consulting Apple Computer Avalanche Development Company The Boeing Company Computer Task Group Documentum EDS Frame Technology The Gartner Group GEIE Gavel InfoAccess Intergraph Corporation Interleaf, Inc. McGraw-Hill Merck & Company Novell Object Design Oracle Corporation R.R. Donnelley & Sons SoftQuad, Inc. Sun Microsystems Texcel Xerox Corporation Xyvision Media Advisory Board Mark Walter - Seybold Report on Publishing Systems Janet Endrijonas - Managing Automation Karyl Scott, David Strom - InfoWorld Esther Dyson - Release 1.0 Jeff Hill - CALS Journal Yves Stern - Argos (France) Caroline Pinola - Database Advisor Dave Churbuck - Forbes Les Cowen - Micropublishing Report John Verity - Business Week Chris Locke - Internet Business Report Thomas Temin - Government Computer News Ronni Marshak - Workgroup Computing Report Dale Waldt - \<TAG> Colin Brace - Language Industry Monitor (Netherlands) Richard Stover - Document Management & Windows Imaging Country Agents Catherine LeLoup - France Pam Gennusa - United Kingdom Eric van Herwijnen - Switzerland Ping-Shia Kung - Taiwan Akira Mizobuchi - Japan Tibor Tsechke - Germany Per-Olof Jonasson - Sweden User Group Meetings Industry associations, working groups, standards committees and user groups are encouraged to hold meetings prior to or immediately following Documation '94. Meeting rooms will be provided by GCA. Space is limited. FOR MORE INFORMATION: For more information on the Documation Conference program contact: Frank Gilbane, President, PTM Telephone: (617) 643-8855 FAX: (617) 643-0678 E-mail: fgilbane@world.std.com or Marion Elledge, Vice President, Information Technologies, GCA Telephone: (703) 519-8193 FAX: (703) 548-2867 E-mail: document@well.sf.ca.us For exposition details and information contact: Tanya Bosse, Exposition Manager, GCARI Telephone: (703) 519-8174 FAX: (703) 548-2867 E-mail: document@well.sf.ca.us Hotel Information The Documation '94 conference and exposition will take place at the Century Plaza Hotel and Tower, 2025 Avenue of the Stars, Los Angeles, California. A block of rooms has been reserved at the conference rate of $119 single/double in the Century Plaza, and $160 single/double in the Tower. These rates do not include tax currently at 12.5%. For reservations, contact the hotel reservations department direct at (213) 551-3300 or toll free (800) 228-3000 for accommodations. A deposit equal to the room rate for one night, or a major credit card number is required to confirm reservations. Reservations and deposits received after January 19, 1994 will be confirmed on a space available basis only. Check-in time is 3:00 pm. Check-out is 1:00 pm. REGISTRATION MAIL registration form to GCA, (check or credit card only) 100 Daingerfield Rd., Alexandria, VA 22314-2888; OR PHONE registration (credit card only): Call 703-519-8160; OR FAX registration (credit card only): FAX form to 703-548-2867 GCA Member: $745 Non-Member of GCA: $895 Exposition Only Sign up now! Save $25: Pre-register before February 4 for FREE admission to the Exposition. Register by mail or fax. Conference registration include exposition. Please register me for the following: (check appropriate boxes): [ ] Tutorials [ ] Introduction to Document Management [ ] Industry Standards [ ] Electronic Distribution [ ] Imaging & Workflow [ ] Database Technology [ ] Authoring & Copyright Issues [ ] Documation '94 Conference [ ] Exposition only Name (as you wish it to appear on badge): Title:_____________________________________________________________ Company:___________________________________________________________ Street Address/Mail Stop/Suite:____________________________________ City/State/Zip:____________________________________________________ Country:___________________________________________________________ Telephone Number:__________________________________________________ Fax:_______________________________________________________________ E-Mail:____________________________________________________________ Payment Payment accepted in US Funds only, payable to GCA. [ ] Visa [ ] MasterCard [ ] AmEx Credit card #______________________________________________________ expiration date_____________ Name on card:______________________________________________________ Signature:_________________________________________________________ Cancellations There is a $100 cancellation fee for cancellation before February 7, 1994. After that date registrants are liable for the entire registration fee. Cancellations must be received in writing. Substitutions are welcome. ICO9421 </message> <message id="<1993Nov18.105352.22805@newsserver.rrzn.uni-hannover.de>" date="2962608832"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 18 Nov 1993 10:53:52 UT From: "Stephan Olbrich" \<zzol@ipc1.rrzn.uni-hannover.de> Organization: RRZN Message-ID: <1993Nov18.105352.22805@newsserver.rrzn.uni-hannover.de> References: <199311081605.IAA04086@mail.netcom.com> Subject: Re: G4 Decompression Algorithms [Lori Snyder] | Does anyone know where I can find algorithms for CCITT G4 decompression | for a Unix X-platform or any library routines or any conversion | utilities to convert G4 to X11 bitmap? | | We are in the process of converting a hypertext product for a DOS | platform to Unix. Any information would greatly be appreciated. There are sources that includes compression/decompression of G4 coding in the TIFF tools, available at sgi.com (192.48.153.1) in directory graphics/tiff. -- // Stephan Olbrich voice: +511 762 4720 or \\\\ // RRZN/Universitaet Hannover +511 762 3078 \\\\ // Schlosswender Str. 5 fax : +511 762 3003 \\\\ // D-30159 Hannover email: olbrich@rrzn.uni-hannover.d400.de \\\\ </message> <message id="<2cfme5INN1r6@nestroy.wu-wien.ac.at>" date="2962611077"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 18 Nov 1993 11:31:17 UT From: Rony Flatscher \<Rony.Flatscher@wu-wien.ac.at> Organization: Vienna University of Economics and Business Administration Message-ID: <2cfme5INN1r6@nestroy.wu-wien.ac.at> Subject: SGML on OS/2: EPM ? In the online-help (help -> product information -> list box), there is an "advertisement" about upcoming SGML-authoring tools. Does anyone from IBM know the status of this project? What would be included, when would it be available? ---rony </message> <message id="<2cfniu$1ds0@ina.zfn.uni-bremen.de>" date="2962612254"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 18 Nov 1993 11:50:54 UT From: "Projekt FORAUS" \<foraus@alf.zfn.Uni-Bremen.DE> Organization: Universitaet Bremen Message-ID: <2cfniu$1ds0@ina.zfn.uni-bremen.de> Subject: ICA & QWERTZ Hello! We are a little student project working on an SGML-Textbased-System. Now we got some informations that 2 Public Textsystems exists, called ICA & QWERTZ - but no one could tell us were we could get them. Could someone here help us??? Please EMail us directly! Project Foraus foraus@alf.zfn.uni-bremen.de Thanx :) </message> <message id="<1993Nov18.131004.28005@cscs.ch>" date="2962617004"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Followup-To: poster Date: 18 Nov 1993 13:10:04 UT From: "Nicole Vecchi" \<nvecchi@cscs.ch> Organization: Centro Svizzero di Calcolo Scientifico / CH-6928 Manno Message-ID: <1993Nov18.131004.28005@cscs.ch> Subject: User Group Meeting in Zurich? I heard that there's a user's group meeting in Zurich next week -- could someone confirm that with more definitive information? Thanks! Nicole </message> <message id="<2cgfpr$5ll@fitz.TC.Cornell.EDU>" date="2962637051"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 18 Nov 1993 18:44:11 UT From: "Steve J. Lombardi" \<stlombo@eos.acm.rpi.edu> Organization: The Voice of Fate Message-ID: <2cgfpr$5ll@fitz.TC.Cornell.EDU> Subject: Looking for SGML consultant (short term) We're looking for an SGML consultant to help us sort through the maze of software options. This is a paid position. It would be advantageous if you were located in the Northeast. we're in Albany, NY. If interested please call steve lombardi at 518-436-8647 or send email to stlombo@acm.rpi.edu thanks. -- | steve lombardi | She won't get out of the tub. She stlombo@acm.rpi.edu | has morning wood. -- Beavis | </message> <message id="<NORM.93Nov18142537@ruby.ora.com>" date="2962639536"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 18 Nov 1993 19:25:36 UT From: "Norman Walsh" \<norm@ora.com> Organization: O'Reilly and Associates, Inc. Message-ID: \<NORM.93Nov18142537@ruby.ora.com> Subject: sgml-mode in emacs 19? I've just started trying to use the sgml-mode that comes with Emacs 19, and I can't seem to get next-error to parse sgmls output. Before I go digging around, has anyone else been able to make this work? Here's an example of my *compilation* buffer, if that helps. cd ~/ report test.sgm Validating test.sgm using sgmls version 1.1 sgmls: SGML error at test.sgm, line 4 at ">": PARA end-tag implied by PARA start-tag; not minimizable Element structure: DOCBOOK CHAPTER sgmls: SGML error at test.sgm, line 4 at "s": CHAPTER end-tag implied by data; not minimizable Element structure: DOCBOOK sgmls: SGML error at test.sgm, line 4 at "s": Out-of-context data ended DOCBOOK document element (and parse) ... testing is completed. Compilation finished at Thu Nov 18 14:24:55 </message> <message id="<lenrandCGpn7C.Lo9@netcom.com>" date="2962653239"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 18 Nov 1993 23:13:59 UT From: "Len Rand" \<lenrand@netcom.com> Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest) Message-ID: \<lenrandCGpn7C.Lo9@netcom.com> Summary: Looking for source of descriptive documentation Subject: SGML spec Can anyone give me a source on the net for a description of SGML and a spec on its syntax? I've done a quick ARCHIE search, but haven't found what I'm looking for (I'm a new, and somewhat inexperienced user of the internet, so I may have missed the obvious). Please mail me the answer directly. Thanks, Len Rand -- +--------------------------------+ | From: Len Rand | | lenrand@netcom.com | | compuserve: 72570,1506 | +--------------------------------+ </message> <message id="<4728@newton.mdavcr.mda.ca>" date="2962720720"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 19 Nov 1993 17:58:40 UT From: "Duncan Fraser" \<djf@mdavcr.mda.ca> Message-ID: <4728@newton.mdavcr.mda.ca> Subject: Where are: FAQ? DTD's? I'm looking for an SGML FAQ, and any standard (approved, de facto, whatever) DTD's I can get my hands on. Thanks -- Duncan Fraser (djf@mda.ca) Research Dept., MacDonald Dettwiler Richmond, B.C., Canada </message> <message id="<19931119.012@sfo.naggum.no>" date="2962765413"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 20 Nov 1993 06:23:33 UT From: Erik Naggum \<erik@naggum.no> Message-ID: <19931119.012@sfo.naggum.no> Subject: About comp.text.sgml, archives, FAQs, etc. This messages contains some information about the newsgroup, and assorted services related to the newsgroup. If you are about to ask _the_ most frequently asked question on this newsgroup, "where is the FAQ?", you will find the answer below. For future revisions of the FAQ, it would be helpful if people could give some indication of what they are looking for when they ask this question. The newsgroup's topic is "ISO 8879 SGML, structured documents, markup languages," as it was defined when the newsgroup was created by Edward Vielmetti in September of 1990. Ed sent out the Call for Votes on 1990-08-02, but I have lost track of the actual creation date; it was probably the first week of September, 1990. The earliest trace of e-mail about comp.text.sgml that I have seen dates back to 1990-01-20, so if we let history begin with the year 1990, we are not off by too much. The Standard Generalized Markup Language (SGML) itself was created by Charles Goldfarb, and through an excruciatingly slow and painful process known as "standardization", the specification for the language was published by the International Organization for Standardization, ISO, in 1986 as ISO 8879:1986, full title "Information processing -- Standard Generalized Markup Language (SGML)". A few fixes to the specification were published in 1988, called Amendment 1, ISO 8879/A1:1988. Charles Goldfarb's work dates back to the late 1960's, with the very successful language GML, for Generalized Markup Language, or Goldfarb, Mosher, and Lorie. More on the history of the language can be found in the article "A Brief History of the Development of SGML", available in _The SGML Handbook_, the reference for which is near the end of this message. The standard, like all ISO standards, is available from ISO in Geneva, and from various national standards bodies, such as the American National Standards Institute (ANSI) in the U.S., British Standards (BS) in the U.K., Deutsche Institut fuer Normierung (DIN) in Germany, Association Francaise de Normalisation (AFNOR) in France. However, instead of going to any of these standards bodies for copies, use _The SGML Handbook_. It contains the entire standard, annotated by the creator and editor of the standard, as well as incorporating the amendment and some clarifications of difficult parts of the standard. The standard is _not_ available electronically. In the first few months of its existence, sufficiently interesting material had been posted to the newsgroup that I wanted an archive of the newsgroup. This was at the time when I was trying to figure out what the "Entity end" really meant, so if anyone can attest to the usefulness of USENET as a means of learning and open communication between interested people, it is me. The first article in the archive is dated 1991-03-20, although almost 300 articles had appeared in the newsgroup before that time. Systematic archiving did not start until early April 1991, but from then on, every article that has appeared on the newsgroup, with the exception of canceled articles, has been archived. The archive is found at FTP.IFI.UIO.NO in /pub/SGML/comp.text.sgml. There are two trees: by.date and by.msgid, so that retrieval can be by these two keys. The first article is "by.date/1991/03/20/114250.Lennestal" and also known as "by.msgid/3635@lulea.telesoft.se". The time format in the by.date tree should be obvious given that time on USENET is usually GMT (aka UTC.) In addition to anonymous FTP, the archive can be accessed through the WAIS source "comp.text.sgml.src". The SGML archive contains more than the newsgroup archive. At the time of writing, it contains the ARC SGML parser by Charles Goldfarb in the directory "ARC-SGML", the Amsterdam SGML Parser in "ASP-SGML", some information about the Computer-assisted Acquisition and Logistics Support standards from the DoD in "CALS", a list of ISO 10646-1:1993 names and character numbers for use with SGML systems in "CHARSET", proceedings of the Davenport group in "DAVENPORT", various user-supplied programs in "DEMO", some public document type definitions in "DTD", some public entity sets in "ENTITIES", a draft set of answers to Frequently Asked Questions in the file "FAQ.0.0", the FORMAT package that handles SGML-to-LaTeX mapping in the directory "FORMAT", some information about the now approved ISO standard ISO 10744 Hypermedia/Time-based Structuring Language in "HyTime", the distribution images of the Interactive Authoring and Display System in "IADS", the Integrated Chameleon Architecture version 1.5 in "ICA", an enhanced version by James Clark of the ARC SGML parser in "SGMLS", some information about the SGML Users' Group Special Interest Group on Hypertext and Multimedia in "SIGhyper", archives of the Text Encoding Initiative in "TEI", Robin Cover's excellent bibliography in the file "bibliography", some useful Emacs-lisp functions in the directory "elisp", and the recently published comprehensive list of ISO standards that users of SGML might find interesting, compiled by Heather Davenport, in file "standards". The SGML archive is liberal in what it accepts. Requests for information on how to put things in the archive can be obtained by writing the archive maintainer at \<SGML.archive@ifi.uio.no>. The newsgroup archive is updated manually, after articles have been edited to obtain a consistent style of presentation. Excessive quoted text (e.g., signatures and cascades) is trimmed, and the article is reformatted. Spelling is normalized and capitalization is applied where missing or wrong, but no other changes are made. The edited articles are also available on a mailing list that helps people who are not able to receive or post USENET news get access to the newsgroup. The mailing list service consists of two parts: a news-to-mail service that distributes archived articles, and a mail-to-news service that allows non-USENET users to post articles. The mail-to-news service has _one_ restriction on posting: if the article quotes something that has not appeared on the newsgroup, the article will not be posted immediately, but held, waiting for the quoted article to appear. If it does not, the article is returned to the author with a request that an appropriate copyright or "reprinted by permission" note is attached. USENET effectively removes copyright from articles, unless the author take great pains to protect to it, so text that is already copyright by someone else, or, worse, is private communication, must not be distributed. Other than this rule, everything will be posted, although I do reserve the right to discourage posting. Insisting that it be posted works, though. Since you read this article either on the mailing list or in the newsgroup, keep the following for friends who ask for information. If you have previously quoted from similar articles by me, _please_ note that I have changed the addresses a few times, but that I intend to keep these. To subscribe, send a note to \<comp-text-sgml-request@naggum.no>. You will be added to the mailing list if I can talk to a system that is willing to accept mail for you and which does not send error messages to wrong places. (Well-known culprits include cc:Mail and Microsoft Mail, so if you rely on either of these, kindly make a request to your systems administrator that he get something that works all the time.) To post an article, send it to \<comp-text-sgml@news.naggum.no>. If you reply to an article you have received from the mailing list, this will be automatic. The only thing I ask you to do is to keep the article number that appears in the Subject header, including the brackets to distinguish it from anything else in the header. If you don't, it will take me more time to post the article, and this may cause delays. If you look for the definition of SGML, there is only one place to go at present: Charles F. Goldfarb: The SGML Handbook; Oxford University Press, 1990. ISBN 0-19-853737-9. This book will set you back almost $100, but will also answer all your questions about the language itself. The rest may be in the archive. If you have Internet access, you are well advised to search it. Several issues have been discussed a few times over, and in the absence of any strong reason to want to stop further discussion, the archive material should be regarded as background material rather than authoritative answers, even though the authoritative answer may be found therein. No attempt has been made to mark those articles, however. A word of encouragement as well as caution: Everybody who is something in the SGML world, in particular the creator of the language and the ISO working group that defined SGML, as well as several vendors of outstanding SGML products, are listening to what you say in this newsgroup. If you have problems with the language or an implementation of it in a product, or with implementing it, and particularly if you have a suggestion for a solution to some problem, you may find that your article is quoted at ISO meetings and taken very seriously by vendors. Know that your voice is heard, and that your input is very much appreciated. In fact, the archive for this newsgroup is a source of information for the review process now taking place in the ISO working group. As of early November, the estimated readership of this newsgroup was 36,000 people, up 4,000 from October. 78% of the USENET community receives the newsgroup on their system, and can read it if they want to, down 1% from October. In October, 178 messages comprising 495K were posted to the newsgroup. Only 2% of the articles are crossposted to other newsgroups, which indicates a continued and specific need for the newsgroup, although only 1% of the total USENET readership reads it. The newsgroup with the highest readership is news.announce.newusers with 12.6% share of the readership, for a total of 470,000, followed by alt.sex.stories with 8.1% share, and 300,000 readers. This indicates the diversity of USENET, if nothing else. Amidst all this diversity (read: chaos), this newsgroup has been known for the highest "signal to noise ratio" on USENET over its three years of existence, and this can only continue with the support of readers like you. Best regards, \</Erik> -- Erik Naggum \<erik@naggum.no> \<SGML@netcom.com> ISO 8879 SGML Chairman, SGML SIGhyper \<SGML.SIGhyper@naggum.no> ISO 10744 HyTime "Memento, terrigena. Memento, vita brevis." ISO 10646 UCS </message> <message id="<CGtJ2v.M2t@lysator.liu.se>" date="2962834492"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 21 Nov 1993 01:34:52 UT From: "Lars Aronsson" \<aronsson@lysator.liu.se> Organization: Lysator Academic Computer Society Message-ID: \<CGtJ2v.M2t@lysator.liu.se> References: <20@markj.win.net> \<THOMAS.93Nov9093731@noosa.gmd.de> <19931109.004@sfo.naggum.no> \<THOMAS.93Nov9142606@noosa.gmd.de> <19931110.018@sfo.naggum.no> Subject: Re: Standard DTDs (was: Evaluating SGML) [Erik Naggum] | At the time when troff was king, there were several communities that | used different macro packages. Is there yet a DTD that replaces the troff "man" macros? I guess it would take an afternoon to design one, and then one could make translators between the troff/man and SGML/man formats. This could be the base for some free SGML software: the "test data" is already there, on every UNIX system. Perhaps I am reinventing some wheels? -- Lars Aronsson, Lysator, Linkoping University, Linkoping, Sweden </message> <message id="<3318@cthulhuControl.COM>" date="2962882487"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 21 Nov 1993 14:54:47 UT From: "Bill Downing" \<bdowning@Control.COM> Organization: Control Technology Corp., Hopkinton MA Message-ID: <3318@cthulhuControl.COM> Subject: SGML '93 - When/Where? The subject says it all. Please email reply, if possible... Thanks, -- Bill Downing, President Email: bdowning@control.com DOWNING ASSOCIATES, INC. 8 Doyle Lane Hopkinton, MA 01748 Voice: 508-435-4567 </message> <message id="<2cp28k$tq8@genesis.ait.psu.edu>" date="2962918100"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 22 Nov 1993 00:48:20 UT From: "Bernie Thompson" \<bernie@bjt105.rh.psu.edu> Organization: Penn State class of '94 Message-ID: <2cp28k$tq8@genesis.ait.psu.edu> References: <2cfme5INN1r6@nestroy.wu-wien.ac.at> Subject: Re: SGML on OS/2: EPM ? [Rony Flatscher] | In the online-help (help -> product information -> list box), there is | an "advertisement" about upcoming SGML-authoring tools. | | Does anyone from IBM know the status of this project ? What would be | included, when would it be available? I don't know, but you can contact the author, Larry Margolis, directly. He hangs out in comp.os.os2.apps and his email is margoli@watson.ibm.com -- Bernie Thompson -- Internet connected with Linux over PSU dorm ethernet IBM co-op for OS/2 2.0 and 2.1 (video devices) </message> <message id="<HAYASHI.93Nov22160933@arrow.rst.fujixerox.co.jp>" date="2962940923"> Newsgroups: comp.databases,comp.databases.theory,comp.lang.visual,comp.theory,comp.ai,sci.logic,comp.text.sgml Date: 22 Nov 1993 07:08:43 UT From: "Koichi Hayashi" \<hayashi@rst.fujixerox.co.jp> Organization: FUJI XEROX Co., Ltd. Message-ID: \<HAYASHI.93Nov22160933@arrow.rst.fujixerox.co.jp> Subject: Pre-Announcement of Principles Of Document Processing'94 Pre-Announcement of Principles Of Document Processing'94 Distribution: world Pre-Announcement PODP'94 Second International Workshop on Principles Of Document Processing PODP'94 is the second in this series of workshops, which focus on modeling document processing systems. The goal of PODP is to foster a happy marriage between (A) documents in the real world, and (B) theories and tools developed in computer science, mathematics, and any other promising sources. We would like to see papers that attempt to find a good balance between these two. Papers that address both (A) and (B) on a somewhat equal basis are welcome. The program committee members will be chosen from (A) those who are active in the area of document processing, and (B) those who are active in relavant areas of computer science, such as database, and are very interested in documents. Derick Wood (University of Western Ontario) will join the program committee. We will ask that the organizers of PODP'92 to join. They are: Anil Nerode, Department of Mathematics, Cornell University; Richard Furuta, Texas A\&M University; Howard Blair, Syracuse University; and, Allen Brown, Jr., Xerox. PODP'94 will be a part of this April's set of coordinated conferences in Darmstadt (Germany). (However, PODP'94 is only a workshop and not a conference.) The date is April 11-12th, 1994. The other conferences in this set are EP'94, TEP'94, and RIDT'94. You are invited to submit six copies of an extended abstract or a complete paper by January 15th, 1994 to: Murata Makoto Xerox Webster Research Center 0128-29E 800 Phillips Road Webster, NY 14580 USA Each submission should have one cover page, which indicates the name, affilitiation, address, electronic mail address, and telephone number of the contact author. Submission by e-mail (to murata@wrc.xerox.com) is acceptable but not preferable. In this case the paper should be in ASCII, LATEX, or Postscript. One author of each accepted paper will be expected to present the paper at the workshop. Proceedings will be distributed at the workshop but will not be publicly available afterwards. However, as in PODP'92, some of the accepted papers will be published in a widely available journal or book. In order to assess the number of participants and contributors, we ask those who are interested in PODP'94 to fill out the form below and return it promptly to murata@wrc.xerox.com. Details of the conference (the program committee, registration procedure, etc.) will appear in the final announcement in December. CO-CHAIR Herve Gallaire Murata Makoto (My family name is Murata) Rank Xerox Fuji Xerox -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Q1. Are you interested in submitting papers to PODP'94? Yes or No. Q2. What is the title of your paper (if you intend to submit)? Q3. Are you interested in attending PODP'94? Yes or No. Q4. What is your affilitiation? </message> <message id="<9311220850.AA00479@ipsi.darmstadt.gmd.de>" date="2962947052"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 22 Nov 1993 08:50:52 UT From: Klemens Boehm \<kboehm@darmstadt.gmd.de> Message-ID: <9311220850.AA00479@ipsi.darmstadt.gmd.de> Subject: HyperODA Hello, I am interested in introductory, illustrative material on HyperODA. Any hint is sincerely appreciated. Cheers, Klemens Boehm </message> <message id="<753987127snx@sgml.com>" date="2962975927"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 22 Nov 1993 16:52:07 UT From: "Brian E. Travis" \<brian@sgml.com> Organization: SGML Associates, Inc. Message-ID: <753987127snx@sgml.com> Subject: \<TAG> Abstracts, November, 1993 The November, 1993 issue of \<TAG> The SGML Newsletter is in the mail. As a service to the readers of this list, the table of contents, along with a brief description of each article, is listed below. \<TAG>, published monthly, is the only regular source of information for the SGML industry: articles, reviews, product news, tutorials, standards updates, user group information, case studies, and useful technical tips and information. \<TAG> is designed to be an objective voice of the SGML community. We accept no advertising and encourage frank and open debate on the issues faced by the information publisher. For more information about \<TAG>, contact SGML Associates at +1 303-680-0875, by fax: +1 303-680-4906, or by e-mail: tag@sgml.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------- \<TAG> November 1993 ----------------------------------------------------------------- A Business Case for SGML By Chet Ensign In the first article of a two-part series, the author explains how his company, Information Builders, Inc., came to the discovery that, by treating their text in a structured manner, several business problems could be solved. This first article explains the company's business problems in the documentation area. Editorial At the recent Seybold San Francisco Conference and Exposition, there was much debate on the subject of which one of the recently announced electronic page-turner technologies is the best to use for electronic delivery of documents. This is a warning to those who feel these new solutions represent an ideal system. The Battle of the Page-Turners By Brian Travis A trip report on the recent Seybold San Francisco Conference and Exposition. Vendors delivering electronic delivery and management systems for documentation were highly visible at this popular annual conference. In addition, an entire one-day seminar was devoted to SGML -- a first for Seybold. Information and Technology Week By Simon Wickes Mr. Wickes shares his experience as an end-user and developer of SGML applications after attending the recent Graphic Communications Association SGML publishing conference in Los Angeles. SGML on a Silver Platter By Brian Travis A review of the recently released CD-ROM product titled "The Compleat SGML". The product contains the complete text of the ISO SGML standard (ISO 8879), complete with proposed corrections, revisions, or Exoterica's editorial comments. Also included is Exoterica's test suite of 2400 conforming and non-conforming documents, and a couple very large documents for exercising parsers. SGML Tips and Techniques Using DOCTYPE ID to Fool Application News 'Frame-Based' Authoring Tool Released Davenport Group to Meet MID Announces SGML Filter for FrameBuilder ACM Announces Shift to Electronic Delivery 1993 Calendar University of Wisconsin offers SGML Database Course No. Cal. SGML Users' Group -- Submitted by: Brian E. Travis brian@sgml.com Principal Consultant Managing Editor, Tele: +1 303 766-1336 Information Architects, L.L.C. \<TAG> The SGML Newsletter Fax: +1 303 680-4906 </message> <message id="<19931122T220008Z@news.naggum.no>" date="2962994408"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 22 Nov 1993 22:00:08 UT From: Lori Snyder \<Lsnyder@redstone-emh2.army.mil> Message-ID: <19931122T220008Z@news.naggum.no> References: <2b8pcu$di1@pens-emh2.ncts.navy.mil> <2bbr9f$rur@elroy.jpl.nasa.gov> <199311081746.JAA18601@mail.netcom.com> <1993Nov10.204842.27564@gdstech.grumman.com> Subject: Re: Has anyone gotten IADS to load? [Larry Beck] | How can you say that IADS will handle "CALS-standard text?" When I | looked at this product The first thing that I say was that all names | were restricted to eight characters. The "CALS SGML Declaration" | provides for 32 character names. Does the next release of the product | address this issue? That was true for IADS v1.0. But since then, IADS v1.2 and v1.3 both are capable of handling 32 character names. For those of you who did not there was a version 1.3, it was released less than a month ago. Give us a few weeks to figure out the quickest way to update the ftp sites. \</lori> -- Lori Snyder lsnyder@redstone-emh2.army.mil Systems Engineering Soutions, Inc. lsnyder@cs.uah.edu Huntsville, AL 35801 (205) 867-4562 </message> <message id="<19931122.160111.860@almaden.ibm.com>" date="2962996160"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 22 Nov 1993 22:29:20 UT From: "Eliot Kimber" \<drmacro@vnet.IBM.COM> Message-ID: <19931122.160111.860@almaden.ibm.com> Subject: Getting a Grip on HyTime Schedules If you, like me, are trying to understand HyTime and how it works, you are probably struggling to make sense of finite coordinate spaces, event schedules, and the like. I decided to see if I could finally get a grip on schedules, and in so doing, discovered, I think, one serious confusion factor that may be making things more difficult than they should be. This post is an attempt to undo that confusion. The basic idea of schedules and finite coordinate spaces in HyTime is really pretty straightforward: you define a coordinate space (say a grid), and then place things in that space. For example, to create a windowed user interface, you could define a two-dimensional grid, and then define the position of windows and window components in terms of their relative positions on the grid (think of most dialog editors, for example). Elements in the grid can be positioned absolutely or relative to each other, or even relative to other grids (alignment). Grids can be abstract ("screen units") or concrete ("pixels"). However, in HyTime, the simplicity of this basic idea can be obscured by the syntax, which because of its generality and range of function, can sometimes seem overly verbose. Also, the way coordinate spaces are defined and the way objects are placed in them may not be intuitive to everyone. The problem I had was that I was expecting the direction of reference to be from objects to their position in a coordinate space. For example, I might have an element that contains a multimedia object, which I would then want to position in a finite coordinate space. I expected that this object would define its position--in fact, it is just the opposite--the position definition refers to the object to be positioned. This in fact makes sense when you consider that for a given object there may be many places it will be placed (re-use being one of the driving reasons for using SGML in the first place). Therefore, it has to be the case that the object and its positioning would be separate, and since there is a one-to-many relationship between objects and positions, the positions should point to the objects. The thing that defines a position and associates it with an object is called an *event*. An event exists within an *event schedule* and associates a set of coordinates with an object, either by direct containment or by reference. Here's the basic scheme (ignoring several details for the moment): contains Refers to Event ----------> Event-----------> position and extent Schedule | | | contains | | Refers to '----------> FCS definition The event schedule (evsched) refers to a defined finite coordinate space, which defines the properties of the space (number of axes, measurement units, etc), and then contains one or more events, which are placed within the FCS. Each event then refers to an element that defines the position of the event within the FCS and its extent (how big it is in each axis), and also contains the object to be positioned). It was the method by which an event's position and extent is defined that threw me. I was expecting the position and extent to be a direct attribute of the event element, and the definition of the Event architectural form in the HyTime standard does not explicitly show how these properties are defined. I was, in short, confused. After some careful reading, I realized that my original expectation was incorrect, that in fact the Event element uses an ID reference to refer to a separate element, called an *extent specification* (exspec). In the definition of the Event form, this is indicated by a comment showing that the Event element uses the exspec attributes, which are defined separately because they're used by several different forms. It took me a while to make this connection, but once I had, things became a lot clearer. The extent specification elements are what HyTime calls "resources", which are elements that contain data to be used by reference from other elements, but that have no independent function. They can go anywhere, because, since they are only used by reference, it doesn't really matter where they are, since they'll never interact with anything around them. In the HyTime meta-DTD, they are inclusions, but application designers can define specific places for them if they prefer. The reason for using a separate element rather than a direct attribute to specify the coordinates of an event is that the position specification could be quite complex, depending on the needs of the application, and must be able to include subelements. While this is added overhead in the simple case, it is a requirement for all other cases (and in any case, this data would be generated by authoring tools or transforms anyway, so it doesn't really matter). Thus, a typical event will look like this: \<event exspec="exspec-1"> ---> \<exspec id=exspec-1>1 10 1 20\</exspec> \<MultiMediaObject object=myvideo> \</event> (Here I've shown the Exspec element as being "somewhere else"--remember it could be anywhere, we don't really care). In this example, the extent specification is a simple dimension list: a set of two axis marker pairs, where each pair of numbers defines a starting position and an extent, e.g., "1 10" and "1 20", indicating that the event starts at quantum (1,1) of the coordinate space and extends 10 quanta in one direction, 20 quanta in the other. The event element contains the object to be "scheduled", in this case, a video data entity represented by the contained MultiMediaObject element. Thus we have specified that this video should be positioned in one corner of our coordinate space (without knowing the other details of the space, we really don't know that that means, but it's clear otherwise). To put this all together, here's a fairly simple coordinate space example that solves the mundane but important problem of positioning multimedia objects on the screen. The example is represented by a single HyTime document which defines the coordinate space and then contains a single event schedule to define one presentation of the objects to be positioned. You can think of this document as a sort of "style spec" that is being applied to the multimedia objects--it exists solely to relate the objects to positions in a coordinate space. An application would, presumably, take this document as input from which it would derive the actual presentation using whatever presentation functionality it had. \<!DOCTYPE HyTimeSample PUBLIC "ISO/IEC 10744:1992//DTD HyTime//EN" &#DSO; \ \<!ELEMENT HyTimeSample - - (Extents, ScreenFCS+) > \<!ATTLIST HyTimeSample HyTime NAME #FIXED HyDoc unmspace NAME #FIXED "unified" -- Unified entity/ID name space -- > \ \<!ELEMENT ScreenFCS - O (evsched | wand | baton)+ > \<!ATTLIST ScreenFCS HyTime NAME #FIXED fcs -- instance of FCS form -- axisdefs NAMES #FIXED "vgaXaxis vgaYaxis" -- GIs of Axis form instances -- FCSMDU="gquantum" -- Generic quantum measurement unit for simplicity. Assume appl. will map quanta to pixels for now. -- > \<!ELEMENT (vgaXaxis | vgaYaxis) - - (#PCDATA) > \<!ATTLIST vgaXaxis HyTime NAME #FIXED axis axismeas NAME #FIXED "pixels" -- "notation" -- axisdim CDATA #FIXED "1024" -- length of axis -- > \<!ATTLIST vgaYaxis HyTime=axis axismeas NAME #FIXED "pixels" -- "notation" -- axisdim CDATA #FIXED "780" -- length of axis -- > \<!ELEMENT MultiMediaObject - O (TextAlt) > \<!ATTLIST MultiMediaObject HyTime NAME #FIXED ilink anchrole NAMES #FIXED "linksource object" object NAME #REQUIRED -- IDREF or ENTITY -- HyNames CDATA #FIXED "object linkends" -- Object attribute is really HyTime linkends= attr -- > \<!ELEMENT TextAlt - O (#PCDATA) > \<!ELEMENT extents - - (exspec+) > \<!ATTLIST extents HyTime NAME #FIXED HyBrid> &#DSC;> \<HyTimeSample> \<extents> \<exspec id=main-video>\ \<dimlist>10 400 10 300\</dimlist> \</exspec> \<exspec id=subwindow-1>\ \<dimlist>410 200 10 150\</dimlist> \</exspec> \<exspec id=subwindow-2>\ \<dimlist>410 200 155 150\</dimlist> \</exspec> \</extents> \<screenFCS>\ \<evsched id=JFK-Oswald-Ruby> \<event exspec=main-video> \<MultiMediaObject object=JFKinaug> \<textalt>Video of JFK's inauguration speech.\</textalt> \</MultiMediaObject> \</event> \<event exspec=subwindow-1> \<MultiMediaObject object=Zapruder-film> \<textalt>The Zapruder film. \</textalt> \</MultiMediaObject> \</event> \<event exspec=subwindow-2> \<MultiMediaObject object=RubyShoots> \<textalt>Video of Jack Ruby shooting L.H. Oswald \</textalt> \</MultiMediaObject> \</event> \</evsched> \</ScreenFCS> \</HyTimeSample> Note that the properties of the coordinate space are defined in the DTD itself and are therefore fixed. The FCS specification consists of two parts: the FCS element itself, and one axis form element for each axis of the FCS. The FCS element serves to define a specific coordinate space and its basic properties (number of axes, measurement domain, etc.). Each axis element defines the specific properties of a given axis, such as its length, its measurement units (inches, seconds, pixels, units), and so on. Within the document instance, each evsched with the FCS element (ScreenFCS in this example), defines a new instance of the coordinate space, and serves to contain events within that instance of the space. The event elements then associate actual data objects (in this case video clips, but it could be anything) with positions within the FCS. If I've done it right, the document above should define a presentation something like this: +----------------------------------------------------------+ | | | | | | | | Zapruder Film | | | | | JFK video | | | | | | | | | |-------------------------| | | | | | | | | Ruby and Oswald | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | +----------------------------------------------------------+ Note how the extent specification elements are used as resources, serving to define areas within the finite coordinate space with specific meanings and that can then be re-used. For example, I could have many different event schedules with different events, all using the same extents, and thus getting the same relative presentation for different videos. Likewise, by changing just the extent specifications, that change would apply to all events that used those extents. There are more details that I've glossed over, and other things you can do with extents, but this should help put schedules and finite coordinate spaces into a little more concrete context. As an exercise, you might figure out how to integrate the audio with the video (also using an event schedule), or how to control the timing of the three different videos. For really advanced students, you might puzzle out how to define the base FCS completely abstractly and then use HyTime constructs to project that FCS onto a concrete FCS (this would allow you to scale the presentation for different size screens, for example). -- Eliot Kimber Internet: drmacro@vnet.ibm.com Dept E14/B500 IBMMAIL: USIB2DK9@IBMMAIL Network Programs Information Development Phone: 1-919-254-5160 IBM Corporation Research Triangle Park, NC 27709 "But Ranger Doug, can't we just use some proprietary data format instead of this SGML stuff?" "Sure Slim, that would be the easy way, but it wouldn't be the Cowboy Way." </message> <message id="<CGy8IM.B9@nas.nasa.gov>" date="2963054109"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml,comp.text.tex Date: 23 Nov 1993 14:35:09 UT From: "Dr. Kuditipudi V. Rao" \<rao@amelia.nas.nasa.gov> Organization: NAS, NASA Ames Research Center, Moffett Field, California Message-ID: \<CGy8IM.B9@nas.nasa.gov> Subject: Translator from GML to TeX HELP! HELP! HELP! HELP! Does anyone know of a translator from GML to TeX (LaTeX)??? </message> <message id="<754074152snz@pira2.demon.co.uk>" date="2963062952"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 23 Nov 1993 17:02:32 UT From: "Francis Cave" \<cave@pira2.demon.co.uk> Organization: Pira International Message-ID: <754074152snz@pira2.demon.co.uk> References: <9311220850.AA00479@ipsi.darmstadt.gmd.de> Subject: Re: HyperODA [Klemens Boehm] | I am interested in introductory, illustrative material on HyperODA. | Any hint is sincerely appreciated. As far as I know, you have a world expert on HyperODA working at your sister organization GMD-Fokus: Angela Scheller. -- Francis Cave Pira International Randalls Road Leatherhead KT22 7RU United Kingdom Tel +44 372 376161 Fax +44 376 377526 email cave@pira2.demon.co.uk </message> <message id="<754074798snz@pira2.demon.co.uk>" date="2963063598"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 23 Nov 1993 17:13:18 UT From: "Francis Cave" \<cave@pira2.demon.co.uk> Organization: Pira International Message-ID: <754074798snz@pira2.demon.co.uk> References: <1993Nov13.154817.5269@falch.no> Subject: Re: SGML tools for Folio Views 3.0 [Steve Pepper] | SGML tools (list generated 13 November 93) | ========================================================== | | 1. By product category | ---------------------- : | | Databases : | - SGML Darc [U,W] Synex Information AB ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Any more information from anyone? -- Francis Cave Pira International Randalls Road Leatherhead KT22 7RU United Kingdom Tel +44 372 376161 Fax +44 376 377526 email cave@pira2.demon.co.uk </message> <message id="<1993Nov23.175408.18333@vax.oxford.ac.uk>" date="2963066048"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 23 Nov 1993 17:54:08 UT From: "Lou Burnard" \<lou@vax.oxford.ac.uk> Organization: Oxford University VAX 6620 Message-ID: <1993Nov23.175408.18333@vax.oxford.ac.uk> Subject: How to tag tables As a relaxation from the wonders of HyTime, I thought some readers of this list might like to share their wisdom on the subject of that favourite SGML chestnut: how to tag tables. (What prompted this thought was the fact that I'm currently looking at the draft of a chapter of the TEI Guidelines in which this topic is addressed) Here's the current proposal. SGML hackers from way back will recognize several neat ideas stolen from various sources... \<!ELEMENT table - - (head?, (row+|col+|cell+)) > \ \ \<!ATTLIST table rows NUMBER #IMPLIED cols NUMBER #IMPLIED> \ \<!ELEMENT (row|col) - o ((cell|table)+) > \<!ATTLIST (row|col) role (label|data) data > \ \ \<!ELEMENT cell - o (%phraseSeq)> \ \ \<!ATTLIST cell role (label|data) %INHERITED \ \ rows NUMBER 1 cols NUMBER 1 > \ \ This is woefully underspecified if you care about rendering, of course. We're taking the strong TEI position which says "put it all in the global rend attribute (but we're not saying how)". So no particular way of saying "align contents of this cell Left", "use double thick rules between this row and the next" "overprint with the word 'SPECIMEN'" etc. It does however allow you to handle some fairly tricky tables as well as some easy ones. Here's a middling complicated example, based on one I found in the HTML+ spec. +------+----------------------+-----------------+ | | average | fondness for | | | height | weight | tuna fish | +------|----------+-----------|-----------------+ |dogs | 34.2 | 12.3 | LOW | |cats | 23.4 | 11.2 | HIGH | +------+----------+-----------+-----------------+ Figure 7. Pet Preferences and Co-ordinates Here it is encoded row-wise : \<table rows=4 cols=4> \<head n='7'>Pet Preferences and Co-ordinates \<row role=label> \<cell rows=2>\ \<cell cols=2>average \ \<cell rows=2>fondness for tuna fish \ \</row>\<row role=label> \<cell>height \ \<cell>weight \ \</row>\<row role=data> \<cell role=label>dogs \ \<cell> 34.2 \<cell> 12.3 \<cell> LOW \</row>\<row role=data> \<cell role=label>cats \<cell> 23.4 \<cell> 11.2 \<cell> HIGH \</table> That wasn't so bad was it? Now let's try it again, only column-wise and without the stupid comments. At the same time, we'll try to do something about 'average height' by representing that whole thing as a nested table. \<table rows=4 cols=4> \<head n='7'>Pet Preferences and Co-ordinates \<col role=label> \<cell rows=2> \<cell>dogs \<cell>cats \<col> \<table rows=2 cols=2> \<row role=label>\<cell cols=2>average \<row role=label>\<cell>height\<cell>weight \</table> \<cell>34.2 \<cell>23.4 \<col> \<cell>12.3 \<cell>11.2 \<col> \<cell rows=2>fondness for tuna fish \<cell>LOW \<cell>HIGH \</table> Comments? Bouquets? Brickbats? Is this too much? Too little? -- Lou Burnard / Text Encoding Initiative lou@ox.ac.uk Oxford University Computing Services fax: +44 865 273275 13 Banbury Rd, Oxford OX2 6NN tel: +44 865 273200 </message> <message id="<CGz16G.GGA@ora.com>" date="2963091256"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 24 Nov 1993 00:54:16 UT From: "Terry Allen" \<terry@ora.com> Organization: O'Reilly & Associates, Inc. Message-ID: \<CGz16G.GGA@ora.com> Subject: Good CALS Table Documentation? Does anyone know of good CALS table documentation, aside from what I take to be the original (obtained from ftp.ifi.uio.no)? Regards, -- Terry Allen (terry@ora.com) Editor, Digital Media Group O'Reilly & Associates, Inc. </message> <message id="<1993Nov24.012046.7013@sqwest.wimsey.bc.ca>" date="2963092846"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 24 Nov 1993 01:20:46 UT From: "Marcy Thompson" \<marcy@sqwest.wimsey.bc.ca> Organization: SoftQuad Inc., Surrey, B.C. CANADA Message-ID: <1993Nov24.012046.7013@sqwest.wimsey.bc.ca> Subject: Job posting SoftQuad is hiring again. This time we need an experienced Scheme programmer who would like to be involved with training activities and (possibly) customer support, too. For more information, please see the posting titled "Scheme programmer / Training / SGML / OOP" in can.jobs and misc.jobs.offered. Marcy -- Marcy Thompson Manager, Education and Training SoftQuad Inc. +1 604 585 0079 marcy@sqwest.wimsey.bc.ca </message> <message id="<CGzw3t.Cto@curia.ucc.ie>" date="2963131337"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 24 Nov 1993 12:02:17 UT From: "Peter Flynn" \<pflynn@curia.ucc.ie> Organization: University College, Cork Message-ID: \<CGzw3t.Cto@curia.ucc.ie> References: <1993Nov23.175408.18333@vax.oxford.ac.uk> Subject: Re: How to tag tables It looks about right for most purposes. Have you done the canonical test (see the TeXbook, p.247, with footnote?) ///Peter </message> <message id="<9311241332.AA12205@wpdis03.wpafb.af.mil>" date="2963136774"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 24 Nov 1993 13:32:54 UT From: "Matt L. Voisard" \<mvoisard@wpdis03.wpafb.af.mil> Message-ID: <9311241332.AA12205@wpdis03.wpafb.af.mil> Subject: Compton's "patent" on Multimedia Has anyone heard or seen anything on this? I'd like to hear some details about exactly what Compton's is attempting here. What effect will this have on the SGML/HyTime/DSSSL community? Matthew L. Voisard RJO Enterprises, Inc. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1993 21:03:15 +22311151 From: "Karl F. Bridges" \<cfkfb@UX1.CTS.EIU.EDU> Subject: Re: FW: Compton Encyclopedia patents 'Multimedia' ! To: Multimedia List \<MMEDIA-L%ITESMVF1.BITNET@RICEVM1.RICE.EDU> They are that stupid. Does anyone wonder anymore why American business has gone straight into the toilet. Anyway, who really cares. So they patent it. To have a patent you have to be able to enforce it. Lets see how long they have a business when they have to spend all their resources and time suing everyone who is violating their patent. Since, for example, Hypercard was packaged with the Mac for years they will have to sue every person who has ever bought hypercard??? More to the point, they have to sue every person who has ever used a hypercard or hypercard like stack. Tell them to get stuffed. > I've heard this from a few sources - this is so stupid that it could be > true! This surely must have very serious consequences? Does anyone else > know anymore of the details? > > M.P.Stratfold@open.ac.uk > > ________________________________________________________________________ > > JimP writes:- > > From: Info-Amiga List on Sun, Nov 21, 1993 9:36 pm > Subject: Compton Encyclopedia patents 'Multimedia' ! > To: Multiple recipients of list I-AMIGA > > Well, I hate to say this but at COMDEX, Compton's Encyclopedia, Inc. > announced that they have patented the concepts behind multimedia. That > would be 'boot up a program, click on a text, see highlighted word, click > on it, see picture and hear speech attached to that word.' A number of > people in the audience were very upset! { I mean really pissed. } This > is on CNN Headline News for several days now. paraphrase 'You have a lot > of gall patenting something we have been doing since 1986 and 1987! You > are going to get alot of trouble over this!' > > Compton said they had been working on Multimedia since 1989. > > Many of the audience seemd to very very upset! > > The CEO { Chief Executive officer } of the new subsidiary { Compton > Multimedia }, says that they only want one percent of the product's cost > as a royalty, they aren't trying to stifle Multimedia! > > { Yeah, right, and all politicians are honest. } > > Several people in the audience promised litigation. > > Later, JimP. > > -- > Dreamy Jim aka Jim Pierce B.Sc. Disclaimer:Standard. > "We're not shy." Pugsley Addams "We're contagious." Wednesday -- ***************************************************************************** Karl Bridges cfkfb@eiu.edu ***************************************************************************** </message> <message id="<1993Nov24.153051.23052@spectrum.xerox.com>" date="2963143851"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 24 Nov 1993 15:30:51 UT From: "Hugh Stabler" \<hugh_stabler.wgc1@rx.xerox.com> Organization: Rank Xerox Ltd. Message-ID: <1993Nov24.153051.23052@spectrum.xerox.com> References: <1993Nov23.175408.18333@vax.oxford.ac.uk> Subject: Re: How to tag tables On the whole I like it, especially the recursive tables and the choice between row-wise or column-wise markup. A few points occur to me though... A shortref for cell would be handy, say "|". I like the label/data distinction, but in the real tables I deal with there are very often several levels of label rows, ie a column header row followed by a number of sub-header rows, and there would normally be a distinction between headers and sub-headers (in font style or ruling) when it came to rendering. I know it's not politically correct, anathema even, but I have to say that I would like to see an optional alignment attribute for cells, and maybe a ruling attribute too. To take your example table, it seems to me that the meaning might not be quite so clear when the table is formatted if the label "average" were left-justified as opposed to centered. I'm biased mind you, since I'm generally concerned with capturing other folks' (highly technical) tables, and in my experience it can be dangerous to make assumptions about what meaning is implied by particular alignment or ruling, especially if the person doing the markup has no knowledge of the subject matter. As an example of a table where the significance of the ruling might not be immediately apparent to someone not "skilled in the art", look at Figure 15 on page 552 of "The SGML Handbook". In any case, it seems to me that the distinction between format and structure gets rather wooly when we start talking about tables; spanning cells are a case in point. Anyway that's my tuppence-worth. - Hugh Stabler (consultant) </message> <message id="<CH07J3.CJI@dove.nist.gov>" date="2963146142"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 24 Nov 1993 16:09:02 UT From: "Bob Bagwill" \<bagwill@sst.ncsl.nist.gov> Organization: NIST Message-ID: \<CH07J3.CJI@dove.nist.gov> References: <1993Nov23.175408.18333@vax.oxford.ac.uk> Subject: Re: How to tag tables [Lou Burnard] | +------+----------------------+-----------------+ | | | average | fondness for | | | | height | weight | tuna fish | | +------|----------+-----------|-----------------+ | |dogs | 34.2 | 12.3 | LOW | | |cats | 23.4 | 11.2* | HIGH | | +------+----------+-----------+-----------------+ | Figure 7. Pet Preferences and Co-ordinates * (Estimated) [footnote added] First, let me caveat, in an Alexander Haig-ish way, what follows, because I didn't follow the long-ago table discussion closely, and I know almost nothing about SGML, DTD's TEI, etc. Maybe I'm poorly re-inventing a wheel. Anyway, Lou's format seemed over-constrained to me. I drew sort of a bubble chart (zen Venn) of the elements, and came up with this: \<cell name=preferences> Pet Preferences and Co-ordinates \<cell name=species inside=preferences> \<cell name=average inside=preferences> average \<cell name=fondness inside=preferences> fondness For tuna fish \<cell name=height inside=average> height \<cell name=weight inside=average> weight \<cell name=dogs inside=species> \<cell inside=dogs\&height> 34.2 \<cell inside=dogs\&weight> 12.3 \<cell inside=species> cats \<cell inside=cats\&height footnote=(Estimated)> 23.4 \<cell inside=cats\&weight> 11.2 \<cell inside=dogs\&fondness> LOW \<cell inside=cats\&fondness> HIGH Notice that it doesn't say what's a column or row, or what order things appear, or what should be the top or side. It also doesn't use nesting of elements to express containedness. Since an element like 34.2 is not in height or dogs, but both, using nested elements to express the relationship seems wrong. This format also would allow multi-dimensional tables. I would guess that some of the 3D spreadsheets must do something like this. -- Bob Bagwill rbagwill@nist.gov </message> <message id="<1993Nov24.174154.16887@falch.no>" date="2963151714"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 24 Nov 1993 17:41:54 UT From: Steve Pepper \<pepper@falch.no> Organization: Falch Hurtigtrykk as, Oslo, Norway Message-ID: <1993Nov24.174154.16887@falch.no> References: <1993Nov13.154817.5269@falch.no> <754074798snz@pira2.demon.co.uk> Subject: SGML Darc (Document Archive Controller) [Francis Cave] | >- SGML Darc [U,W] Synex Information AB | ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ | Any more information from anyone? Contact: Hasse Haitto Synex Information AB Kallforsv. 24 S-124 32 Bandhagen Sweden \<haitto@nada.kth.se> Best regards, Steve -- </(pepper)steve> pepper@falch.no ------------------------------------------------------------------ falch hurtigtrykk a.s, postboks 130 kalbakken, n-0902 oslo, norway tel +47 2216 3040 fax +47 2216 2350 "Life begins at 0x28" </message> <message id="<199311241754.JAA29277@netcomsv.netcom.com>" date="2963151757"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 24 Nov 1993 17:42:37 UT From: Chet Ensign \<DOCCOE@IBIVM.IBMMAIL.COM> Message-ID: <199311241754.JAA29277@netcomsv.netcom.com> References: <9311241332.AA12205@wpdis03.wpafb.af.mil> Subject: Re: Compton's "patent" on Multimedia Following up on Matt Voisard's message about Compton patenting "multimedia," here is the text of their press release, downloaded from the Multimedia Vendor's Forum on Compuserve. What bothers me is paragraph 4, where it says "There is no intention, therefore, of limiting this invention to the exact abstract or disclosure presented herein." That sentence suggests that, indeed, they are trying to patent not just their delivery engine, but in fact the entire notion of "hypertext." I don't see how they could do that, if only because so many people were already developing the tools years before Compton came on the scene. But then, I'm not a lawyer and I don't think like one. Here's the text. Judge for yourselves. \<TEXT> BUSINESSWIRE 11/15 Compton's NewMedia receives patent for multimedia invention LAS VEGAS--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Compton's NewMedia, a leading publisher, developer, and distributor of multimedia titles, today announced that they were granted United States Patent Number 5,241,671. The patent identifies Compton's NewMedia as the owner of the "Multimedia search system using a plurality of entry path means which indicate interrelatedness of information." An abstract in the patent document further describes the invention as: "A database search system that retrieves multimedia information in a flexible user friendly system. The search system uses a multimedia database consisting of text, picture, audio and animated data. That database is searched through multiple graphical and textual entry paths." And further, "There is no intention, therefore, of limiting this invention to the exact abstract or disclosure presented herein. More particularly, it is contemplated that this invention can be used with any information that can be stored in a database." Compton's NewMedia, while granted patent rights described in the 671 patent, wants to continue to foster the growth of this industry, and will license developers the use of the multimedia invention as defined in the Compton's patent. Compton's licensing program will consist of a tiered structure which will give developers several options including: entering into a strategic joint venture relationship with Compton's NewMedia, entering into a distribution arrangement with Compton's NewMedia's Affiliated Label Program, developing a product using Compton's SmarTrieve technology, or complying with a royalty structure as set forth by Compton's NewMedia. "We simply want the public to recognize Compton's NewMedia as the pioneer in this industry, promote a standard that can be used by every developer, and be compensated for the investments we have made to make multimedia a reality for developers and end users," said Stanley Frank, Ed.D., president and chief executive officer of Compton's NewMedia. "We encourage developers to use the distribution channels and development tools Compton's NewMedia has made available to them. Our royalty structure and distribution options will benefit our licensees." Compton's intends to offer a special reduced royalty program until June 1, 1994 for licensees who sign with Compton's prior to that date. Compton's NewMedia applied for the patent on Oct. 26, 1989, immediately after the release of Compton's MultiMedia Encyclopedia, the first electronic encyclopedia to integrate pictures, sound, motion, and multiple entry paths. A continuing application is currently pending. To distinguish it from other CD-ROM based products in its time, the Compton's multimedia invention uniquely provides the ability to explore databases of text or graphics that can be interrelated and yet searched independently of each other. "We knew immediately that we had an important development when we first conceived of Compton's MultiMedia Encyclopedia," said Stanley Frank. "We decided to patent a system to search and display multiple databases that would include graphics, sound and video in addition to text. It just happened that the first product we developed was an encyclopedia that would set the standard for educational and entertainment multimedia for years to come." The multimedia concept is not limited to CD-ROMs on PCs. As the storage and delivery capacity of media have expanded, Compton's has continued to enhance its technology to extend to other platforms including the Macintosh, Sony Multimedia CD-ROM Player, Philips CD-I, and Tandy VIS, to name a few. The encyclopedia and other Compton's titles will soon appear on other interactive delivery systems as explained by Norman J. Bastin, executive vice president and general manager of Compton's NewMedia: "Compton's has invested many years and millions of dollars to create a solid, patented foundation of multimedia technology," said Norm Bastin. "The patent is not limited to any delivery medium such as CD-ROM. We are looking far down the road beyond the CD-ROM to the Digital Highway and what it promises for education, information, and entertainment from PDA's to interactive television." Technology Throughout its history, Compton's continued to improve its search and retrieval technology. The company developed SmarTrieve in 1986, a developer's tool designed to index unstructured databases (such as encyclopedias or book text) and make them searchable. Compton's SmarTrieve SmartKit Developers Toolkit was released in 1992 providing indexing tools and a standard user interface which gives developers the flexibility to use Compton's front end interface or substitute their own end user interface if they wish. Distribution Shortly after announcing its encyclopedia in 1989, Compton's NewMedia began breaking new ground in multimedia software distribution. Instead of relying entirely on traditional channels such as computer speciality and software only stores, Compton's immediately set out to bring multimedia to bookstores, record stores, mass merchandisers, and consumer electronics retailers. In January of 1993, Compton's announced that it had broken through the software rental barrier by providing CD-ROM titles to Major Video Concepts, one of the nation's leading rental distributors and only last week through Blockbuster. In August 1993, Compton's announced its titles would be available for lending in public libraries. In 1991, Compton's opened its distribution doors to other developers. The company launched its Affiliated Label Program, designed to provide avenues of distribution to smaller developers. Together, these companies and Compton's NewMedia team up to offer a selection of appropriate titles for each of the diverse retail channels that Compton's has opened to multimedia. Today, Compton's has over 20 companies in its affiliated label program, distributing over 150 titles in Compton's twelve channels of distribution. Today, Compton's is a leading producer of interactive information, infotainment, edutainment, and entertainment software on CD-ROM and floppy media. Compton's own titles and those of its affiliates can be found at more than 7,500 retailers throughout the country. Compton's has 22 affiliates bringing the total of titles distributed by Compton's NewMedia to over 150. Compton's has launched an aggressive marketing program for the mass consumer market, offering such compelling CD-ROM titles as Compton's Interactive Encyclopedia for the PC and Macintosh, The Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous Cookbook, and Jazz: A Multimedia History, and The Sporting News series. Compton's MultiMedia Group is part of Tribune Publishing Company, a wholly owned subsidiary of Tribune, a leading information and entertainment company. Tribune publishes six daily newspapers, operates seven television and six radio stations, produces and syndicates information and programming, publishes books and information in print and digital formats, and has an ownership interest in one of Canada's largest newsprint manufacturers. BUSINESSWIRE 11/15 Compton's NewMedia receives patent -2- Early Days, Early Visions What is known today as Compton's Interactive Encyclopedia on the commercial market and Compton's MultiMedia Encyclopedia in schools, started as a concept in the early 80s. Stanley Frank, then executive vice president, and Norman J. Bastin, then executive director of corporate planning and development at Encyclopedia Britannica Inc. were searching for a new generation of products to enhance information delivery. While Encyclopedia Britannica was not interested in electronic publishing of their own volumes, they owned the publishing rights to Compton's Encyclopedia, a well-known, highly regarded family and school encyclopedia. The idea for a multimedia encyclopedia started in 1985 and Compton's Encyclopedia was chosen to be the basis for the product a year later. Stanley Frank and Norman Bastin realized that the appropriate platform would be one that offered flexibility and interactivity. It had to add value for the user beyond what could be found in a print medium or in the text only CD-ROMs currently on the market at that time. Until then, CD-ROM was a little-known medium that focused on text and conventionally used Boolean logic for searches. Frank and Bastin knew they wanted to integrate graphics and set out to find the experts to create the search and retrieval software that would provide easy access to all the textural and graphical elements of the first multimedia encyclopedia. To get a feeling for software, Frank and Bastin acquired Eduware and Designware, two software companies that provided important knowledge about the software industry but lacked development staff. Soon, a relationship was struck with Jostens Learning Co., then Education Systems Corp. and the synergy began. Over the next two and a half years, the Encyclopedia/Jostens team developed proprietary software. Rather than relying entirely on software engineers for their multimedia product, they brought in experts from many disciplines including educational designers, educational consultants, animators, programmers, videographers, marketing gurus, and financial analysts. "We knew what we wanted, got the people we needed, and together created a product with appeal and relevance to the mass public,'' said Norman Bastin. "We tested the product in focus groups who confirmed that people learn best when all the senses are used. They loved the way text and graphics were at their fingertips. We had a winner.'' In conjunction with the software tool development, the editorial team completed an $8.5 million editorial makeover of the underlying Compton's print and photo content. "We knew we were going to have groundbreaking technology and wanted the same for the content," Frank said. "Compton's was written for computers in a pyramid style as with newspapers, with main facts up front, then more depth." /CONTACT: Christina Germscheid of Compton's NewMedia, 619-929-2500; or Pat Meier of Pat Meier Associates, 415-957-5999, for Compton's NewMedia/ 09:37 EST </> </message> <message id="<2d1373$d0s@samba.oit.unc.edu>" date="2963181219"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 25 Nov 1993 01:53:39 UT From: "Simon E Spero" \<ses@tipper.oit.unc.edu> Organization: University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill Message-ID: <2d1373$d0s@samba.oit.unc.edu> References: <9311241332.AA12205@wpdis03.wpafb.af.mil> <199311241754.JAA29277@netcomsv.netcom.com> Subject: Re: Compton's "patent" on Multimedia I think that Compton is going to get squished on this one; not only is the patent vacuously invalid (on grounds of prior art), the companies likely to challenge have the muscle to squash Compton flat. The issue is too important to too many people's strategic plans to settle out of court on; It'll be interesting to see who Compton first tries to collect from. I wonder if IBM would appear as Amicus Curae for Microsoft, or vice versa? Maybe Apple's lawyers are still up for the fight? Simon -- Hackers Local 42- National Union of Computer Operatives, Chapel Hill section ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Tar Heel Information Services - Nothing but net! | WAIS/Z39.50 spoken here North Carolina - First in Usenet | DoD #612 | Tel: +1-919-962-9107 </message> <message id="<CH1t71.DG7@ul.ie>" date="2963220877"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml,comp.text Date: 25 Nov 1993 12:54:37 UT From: "Liam Relihan" \<relihanw@ul.ie> Organization: CSIS Dept, U. of Limerick Message-ID: \<CH1t71.DG7@ul.ie> Subject: architectures of DSSSL and CDA ? Hi... Can anyone give me some pointers to information on the architectures of CDA and DSSSL. I have already read the executive summaries, etc., and these are not helpful (at least the ones I have read). I have also searched the sites where I'd expect information on this stuff to be, but little joy so far. I don't really have enough time to acquire the DSSSL standard from ISO. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks Liam </message> <message id="<1993Nov25.145053.21377@kub.nl>" date="2963227853"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 25 Nov 1993 14:50:53 UT From: "Arthur van Horck" \<Arthur.vanHorck@kub.nl> Organization: KUB, The Netherlands Message-ID: <1993Nov25.145053.21377@kub.nl> Subject: Whereis ICA? Dear Group, Would anyone care to enlighten me as to the whereabouts of the Integrated Chameleon Architecture (ICA)? ICA is a conglomerate of programs to assist in the generation of translators between different representations of electronic data. ICA should be available for anonymous FTP somewhere. Archie was not very helpful, hence this message. Thanks a lot, Arthur -- ***--*--*---------------------- Arthur van Horck ----------------------------+ ** * * KUB-University Tilburg, the Netherlands Phone: (+31) 13 662232| * * * Arthur.vanHorck@kub.nl Fax: (+31) 13 662537| +-*--*-----------------------------SPIN\\SMCT---------------------------------+ </message> <message id="<1993Nov25.210012.25301@sq.sq.com>" date="2963250012"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 25 Nov 1993 21:00:12 UT From: "Yuri Rubinsky" \<yuri@sq.sq.com> Organization: SoftQuad Inc., Toronto, Canada Message-ID: <1993Nov25.210012.25301@sq.sq.com> References: <3318@cthulhuControl.COM> Keywords: SGML '93 and related events Subject: Re: SGML '93 - When/Where? 1) SGML '93 Conference Sesions: December 6-9, 1993 2) SGML Database Migration and "Just Enough SGML" Tutorials: Dec 5 3) OmniMark Users' Group Meeting: Dec 5 4) International SGML Users' Group Meeting: Dec 6 8pm 5) SoftQuad "Conceptual Overview of SGML" Tutorial Dec 2-3 and again 13-14 6) SGML Open Technical and Marketing Working Committee Meetings: Dec 10 Sheraton Boston Hotel and Towers Boston Massachusetts USA Call GCA at 703 519-8160 to register for items 1 and 2 above. Call Exoterica at 613 722-1700 for information about item 3. Call SoftQuad at 416 239-4801 to register for either of item 5. Send mail to me to indicate your interest in attending item 6. Simply show up to take part in item 4. -- Yuri Rubinsky +1 416 239-4801 President, SoftQuad Inc. (800) 387-2777 (from US only) Chairman, SGML '93 uucp: {uunet,utzoo}!sq!yuri Suite 810 56 Aberfoyle Crescent Internet: yuri@sq.com Toronto, Ontario, Canada M8X 2W4 Fax: +1 416 239-7105 </message> <message id="<19931126.009@sfo.naggum.no>" date="2963344197"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 26 Nov 1993 23:09:57 UT From: Erik Naggum \<erik@naggum.no> Message-ID: <19931126.009@sfo.naggum.no> References: <1993Nov25.145053.21377@kub.nl> Subject: Re: Whereis ICA? [Arthur van Horck] | ICA should be available for anonymous FTP somewhere. Try FTP.IFI.UIO.NO:/pub/SGML/ICA. The directory contains these files: -rw-r--r-- 1 enag 1144389 1992-07-21 00:05:11 ICA-1.5.tar.Z -rw-r--r-- 1 enag 682465 1993-11-27 00:01:29 ICA-1.5.tar.gz -rw-r--r-- 1 enag 1093649 1992-07-21 00:07:20 ICAdoc-1.2.tar.Z -rw-r--r-- 1 enag 790150 1993-11-27 00:02:13 ICAdoc-1.2.tar.gz The .gz files are just recompressions of the .Z files, for convenience. The distribution was announced on this newsgroup and a WAIS search on comp.text.sgml.src for "ICA" would have turned up all the relevant articles, including the announcements by Sandy Mamrak in July 1992. The original distribution is on archive.cis.ohio-state.edu in /pub/chameleon. The .Z files above are the latest versions from that archive. Best regards, \</Erik> -- Erik Naggum \<erik@naggum.no> \<SGML@netcom.com> ISO 8879 SGML Chairman, SGML SIGhyper \<SGML.SIGhyper@naggum.no> ISO 10744 HyTime "Memento, terrigena. Memento, vita brevis." ISO 10646 UCS </message> <message id="<19931126.010@sfo.naggum.no>" date="2963344854"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 26 Nov 1993 23:20:54 UT From: Erik Naggum \<erik@naggum.no> Message-ID: <19931126.010@sfo.naggum.no> References: \<CGz16G.GGA@ora.com> Subject: Re: Good CALS Table Documentation? [Terry Allen] | Does anyone know of good CALS table documentation, aside from what I | take to be the original (obtained from ftp.ifi.uio.no)? A copy of MIL-M-28001B has been placed in FTP.IFI.UIO.NO:/pub/SGML/CALS. The formatting is atrocious, and I have made a feeble attempt to reformat the first few thousand lines to fit a 75-column line. Best regards, \</Erik> -- Erik Naggum \<erik@naggum.no> \<SGML@netcom.com> ISO 8879 SGML Chairman, SGML SIGhyper \<SGML.SIGhyper@naggum.no> ISO 10744 HyTime "Memento, terrigena. Memento, vita brevis." ISO 10646 UCS </message> <message id="<1993Nov29.014640.5274@sq.sq.com>" date="2963526400"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 29 Nov 1993 01:46:40 UT From: "Yuri Rubinsky" \<yuri@sq.sq.com> Organization: SoftQuad Inc., Toronto, Canada Message-ID: <1993Nov29.014640.5274@sq.sq.com> Summary: Writer seeks SGML news items for SGML '93 talk Subject: Last Call for Two or Three Sentences Before the Seybold Conference, I posted a request for SGML news of any sort and received an interesting (but small) assortment. Now that we're coming up to the SGML '93 Conference, I'd like to remind those of you who always intended (and all the rest of you too) to send in a mention of: 1 Relevant Standards Activity 2 Governmental (or EC/CE or other international) Initiatives 3 Major Industry Initiatives 4 New (since Oct '92) and Forthcoming Publications 5 Major or Especially Interesting SGML Implementations 6 Any SGML Activity that fits in the "Miscellaneous" Category Of particular interest are updates on any activities reported in previous Year in Review collections. EVEN IF YOU ARE PLANNING TO SPEAK ABOUT THE RELEVANT ITEM AT SGML '93, IT WOULD STILL BE VERY USEFUL FOR US TO HAVE A FEW SENTENCES TO DESCRIBE IT IN THE Year in Review. As always, thanks in advance. Make sure I have them by late Thursday EST, and I'll post the full collection here in a few weeks. -- Yuri Rubinsky +1 416 239-4801 Chairman, SGML '93 (800) 387-2777 (from US only) President, SoftQuad Inc. uucp: {uunet,utzoo}!sq!yuri Suite 810 56 Aberfoyle Crescent Internet: yuri@sq.com Toronto, Ontario, Canada M8X 2W4 Fax: +1 416 239-7105 </message> <message id="<1993Nov29.095744.28682@gmd.de>" date="2963555864"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 29 Nov 1993 09:57:44 UT From: "Thomas F. Gordon" \<thomas@slim.gmd.de> Organization: German National Research Center for Computer Science (GMD) Message-ID: <1993Nov29.095744.28682@gmd.de> Subject: ANNOUNCEMENT: FrameBuilder EDDs for ISO 12083 FrameBuilder versions of the ISO 12083 SGML DTDs for articles and books are available on our ftp server, at ftp.gmd.de:gmd/sgml/fbedds.tar.Z I've also included a few FrameBuilder "templates" for these document types containing layout information. The article template is in the style of a Kluwer journal article. ISO 12083 is a set of SGML DTDs for articles, books and serials. FrameBuilder is a version of FrameMaker with very nice support for editing and formatting structured documents, but unfortunately does not support SGML directly. The README file is attached. Please let me know if you find any errors or make any improvements. Dr. Thomas F. Gordon GMD, FIT-KI; Schloss Birlinghoven 53757 Sankt Augustin / Germany email: thomas.gordon@gmd.de; phone: (+49 2241) 14-2665 --------------------------- READ ME ---------------------------------------- This directory contains FrameBuilder Element Definition Documents (EDDs) "templates" for the ISO 12083 document types. The ISO documents are defined as SGML Document Type Definitions (DTDs), but it was rather straightforward, if tedious, to translate these by hand into EDDs. There are two EDDs, one for books and one for articles. I haven't translated the ISO 12083 DTD for serials. Whereas a EDD describes the logical structure of a document type, a FrameBuilder "template" is contains the paragraph and character styles which define the layout of the document. The templates included here are incomplete. I've only included what I have needed so far in my own work. Their is no template for a complete book. Rather, there is a template for a single chapter. Presumably one will want to use FrameBuilder's "book" feature for combining several documents into a book. The "kluwer" article template is in the style of a Kluwer journal article. The "manuscript" template is the same, except that lines are double-spaced. The article and book templates already include their respective EDDs; they don't need to be imported separately. The "letter" template is a FrameBuilder version of our GMD letterhead stationary, and is presumably only of interest to others here at GMD. This template is unstructured; it doesn't include an EDD. Please inform me about any improvements you may make to these templates, or other templates you may design for these EDDs. </message> <message id="<1993Nov29.165323.10256@falch.no>" date="2963580803"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 29 Nov 1993 16:53:23 UT From: Steve Pepper \<pepper@falch.no> Organization: Falch Hurtigtrykk as, Oslo, Norway Message-ID: <1993Nov29.165323.10256@falch.no> Subject: SGML Tools Thanks to everyone who responded to my previous posting concerning 'The Whirlwind Guide to SGML Tools'. Here is a new version of the listing. By popular demand it now includes vendors addresses, phone and fax numbers and email address. As before, please send corrections and additions to me at pepper@falch.no - DO NOT post them in the newsgroup. And please read the preamble carefully before telling me that I've categorised a product incorrectly or omitted a tool that ought to be on the list. The listing will be made available to participants at the SGML '93 conference in a few days time, so get your comments to me quickly! Best regards, Steve -- </(pepper)steve> pepper@falch.no ------------------------------------------------------------------ falch hurtigtrykk a.s, postboks 130 kalbakken, n-0902 oslo, norway tel +47 2216 3040 fax +47 2216 2350 \<SGMLTOOLS> The purpose of this listing is to give a brief overview of SGML Tools currently available on the market. While we would like the list to be as comprehensive as possible, we are not interested in every piece of software that claims 'SGML compatibility'. The main criterion for inclusion in the list is that the software incorporates some kind of SGML parsing capability, or that it is in some way specifically geared to handling SGML documents. The products in the list are arranged in a set of very broad categories that should not be taken too literally since no two tools have exactly the same functionality. (We could have carried on subdividing categories forever in order to express the finer distinctions, but we had to stop somewhere...) There are bound to be some inaccuracies, for which we apologise in advance. Please send corrections and additions to the address below. Updated versions of this list will be posted periodically in the SGML Archives at ftp.ifi.uio.no. Steve Pepper (pepper@falch.no) Falch Hurtigtrykk A/S Postboks 130 Kalbakken N-0902 Oslo Norway SGML tools (generated 29 November 93) ============================================================= 1. By product category ---------------------- Supported platforms (where known) are shown in parentheses as D = MS-DOS I = IBM CMS/MVS M = Macintosh O = OS/2 U = UNIX W = MS-Windows Browsers - Lector (U W) OpenText - SuperBook (U) Bellcore Conversion software - Balise (U D) MID - FastTAG (U W) Avalanche - Integrated Chameleon Architecture (U) PD - OmniMark (U D M) Exoterica - qwertz/FORMAT (U) PD - SGML Hammer (U W) Avalanche - SGML Translator DCF Edition (I) IBM - TableTAG (U D) Unifilt Databases - BASIS SGMLserver (U) InfoDim - PAT (U) OpenText - SGML/Search (U) AIS - SGML/Store (U) AIS Electronic delivery - DynaText (U W M) EBT - Pathways (U) Westinghouse - WorldView (U W) Interleaf HyTime engines - HyMinder (U D) TechnoTeacher Page layout software - ADEPT Publisher (U W) ArborText - CAPS (U) XSoft - DL Composer (U) Datalogics - FrameBuilder (U W) Frame - Interleaf 5 \<SGML> (U D) Interleaf Document management - PassagePRO (U) Passage - SGML Darc (U W) Synex Parsers/SGML Engines - Amsterdam Parser (U) PD - ARC-SGML (D) PD - Mark-It (U D) SEMA - MarkMinder (U D) TechnoTeacher - SGML Kernel (U D M) Exoterica - sgmls (U) PD Text editors - ADEPT Editor (U W) ArborText - Author/Editor (U W M) SoftQuad - EASE (E2S Advanced SGML Editor) (D) E2S - GRIF SGML Editor (U) Grif - InContext (W) InContext - Intellitag (U D) WordPerfect - SGML Ghost (D) OUP - SGML Smart Editor (D) Auto-Graphics - Write-It (D) SEMA - WriterStation (D O) Datalogics DTD utilities - Document Analyzer (U D) Avalanche - DTDocumenter (U) SoftQuad - Near & Far (W) Microstar - RulesBuilder (U W M) SoftQuad - SGML DTD Viewer (W) ZIFTech Various - ApplicationBuilder (U W M) SoftQuad 2. By vendor ------------ AIS Berger-Levrault 34 Avenue du Roule 9220 Neuilly-sur-Seine France Tel: +33 (1) 46-40-10-60 - SGML/Search - SGML/Store ArborText Inc. 1000 Victors Way, Suite 400 Ann Arbor MI 48108 USA Tel: +1 (313) 996-3566 Fax: +1 (313) 996-3573 - ADEPT Editor - ADEPT Publisher Auto-Graphics, Inc. 3201 Temple Avenue Pomona CA 91768 USA Tel: +1 (909) 595-7204 Fax: +1 (909) 595-3506 - SGML Smart Editor Avalanche Development Co. 947 Walnut Street Boulder CO 80302 USA Tel: +1 (303) 449-5032 Fax: +1 (303) 449-3246 Email: louise@avalanche.com - Document Analyzer - FastTAG - SGML Hammer Bellcore Address anyone? - SuperBook Datalogics, Inc. 441 West Huron Street Chicago IL 60610 USA Tel: +1 (312) 266-3202 - DL Composer - WriterStation E2S Address anyone? - EASE (E2S Advanced SGML Editor) Electronic Book Technologies, Inc. One Richmond Square Providence RI 02906 USA Tel: +1 (401) 421-9550 Fax: +1 (401) 421-9551 - DynaText Exoterica Corp. 1545 Carling Avenue, Suite 404 Ottawa Ontario K1Z 8P9 Canada Tel: +1 (613) 722-1700 Fax: +1 (613) 722-5706 Email: info@exoterica.com - OmniMark - SGML Kernel Frame Technology Corp. 1010 Rincon Circle San Jose CA 95131 USA Tel: +1 (408) 433-3311 - FrameBuilder Grif S.A. Immeuble "Le Florestan" 2, boulevard Vauban B.P. 266 78053 St. Quentin en Yvelines France Tel: +33 1-30-12-14-30 Fax: +33 1-30-64-06-46 - GRIF SGML Editor IBM Corp. 400 Columbus Avenue Valhalla NY 10595 USA Tel: +1 (914) 749-3409 - SGML Translator DCF Edition InContext Corp. 2 St. Clair Ave. West, Suite 1701 Toronto M4V IL5 Canada Tel: +1 (416) 922-0087 Fax: +1 (416) 922-4282 - InContext Information Dimensions Inc. 5080 Tuttle Crossing Blvd Dublin OH 43017-3569 USA Tel: +1 (614) 761-8083 Fax: +1 (614) 761-7290 - BASIS SGMLserver Interleaf, Inc. Prospect Place 9 Hillside Avenue Waltham MA 02154 USA Tel: +1 (617) 290-0710 Fax: +1 (617) 290-4943 - Interleaf 5 \<SGML> - WorldView Microstar Software Ltd. 34 Colonnade Rd N Nepean Ontario K2E 7J6 Canada Tel: +1 (613) 727-5696 Fax: +1 (613) 727-9491 - Near & Far MID Information Logistics Group Ringstrasse 19 D-69115 Heidelberg Germany Tel: +49 6221-166091 Fax: +49 6221-23921 Email: post@mid-heidelberg.de - Balise Open Text Corp. 180 King Street South, Suite 550 Waterloo Ontario N2L 1P8 Canada Tel: +1 (519) 571-7111 Fax: +1 (519) 571-9092 - Lector - PAT Oxford University Press Walton Street Oxford OX2 6DP UK Tel: +44 (865) 56767 Fax: +44 (865) 56646 - SGML Ghost Passage Systems, Inc. 465 Fairchild Dr., Suite 201 Mt. View CA 94043 USA Tel: +1 (415) 390-0911 - PassagePRO Public Domain - Amsterdam Parser - ARC-SGML - Integrated Chameleon Architecture - qwertz/FORMAT - sgmls Sema Group AG Building Place du Champ de Mars 5 Bte 40 B-1050 Bruxelles Belgium Tel: +32 2 508 5323 Fax: +32 2 512 1499 - Mark-It - Write-It SoftQuad Inc. 56 Aberfoyle Crescent, Suite 810 Toronto Ontario M8X 2W4 Canada Tel: +1 (416) 239-4801 Fax: +1 (416) 239-7105 - ApplicationBuilder - Author/Editor - DTDocumenter - RulesBuilder Synex Information AB Kallforsv. 24 S-124 32 Bandhagen Sweden Email: haitto@nada.kth.se - SGML Darc TechnoTeacher, Inc. P.O.Box 3208 1810 High Road Tallahassee FL 32303-4408 USA Tel: +1 (904) 422-3574 Fax: +1 (904) 386-2562 Email: markminder@techno.com - HyMinder - MarkMinder Unifilt Co. P.O.Box 2528 Edison NJ 08817 USA Tel: +1 (908) 225-2243 Fax: +1 (908) 225-2248 - TableTAG Westinghouse Electric Corp. P.O.Box 746 Baltimore MD 21298-6451 USA Tel: +1 (410) 993-2214 - Pathways WordPerfect Corp. 1555 N. Technology Way Orem UT 84057 USA Tel: +1 (801) 228 5006 - Intellitag XSoft 10200 Willow Creek Road San Diego CA 92131 USA Tel: +1 (619) 695 7700 Fax: +1 (619) 695 7710 - CAPS ZIFTech Computer Systems, Inc. 120 Herchmer Crescent Kingston Ontario K7M 2V9 Canada Tel: +1 (613) 531-9226 - SGML DTD Viewer \</SGMLTOOLS> </message> <message id="<1993Nov29.195912.21477@news.lrz-muenchen.de>" date="2963591952"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 29 Nov 1993 19:59:12 UT From: "Martin Josko" \<martin@pollux.edv.agrar.tu-muenchen.de> Organization: Leibniz-Rechenzentrum, Muenchen (Germany) Message-ID: <1993Nov29.195912.21477@news.lrz-muenchen.de> Subject: SGML Database SIG ? I've read in Robin Cover's Bibliography about the SGML Database Special Interest Group (DBSIG/DSIG), but the given contact addresses are not up to date. Could somebody give me an advice how I can get in contact with this SGML SIG?? I'm interested at any basic concepts and any implementations concering the storing of SGML documents in databases. I thank you in advance. -- Martin Josko Technical University Munich TU-Muenchen Department of Mathematics DVS-Weihenstephan Statistics and Data Processing D-85350 Freising Freising Germany email: martin@pollux.edv.agrar.tu-muenchen.de phone: +49-(0)8161-71-4506 fax: +49-(0)8161-71-4409 </message> <message id="<19931129T213404Z@news.naggum.no>" date="2963597644"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 29 Nov 1993 21:34:04 UT From: Lori Snyder \<Lsnyder@redstone-emh2.army.mil> Message-ID: <19931129T213404Z@news.naggum.no> Subject: IETMDB \<MIL-D-87269> I've been looking at MIL-D-87269 (IETMDB). I was wondering how other people have interpreted this specification. It never states how one would test for compliancy. This seems to leave room for numerous interpretations. In Appendix-A on page A-3, the entity declaration for hytime references a file called hytime.dtd. I didn't know there was such a DTD. On page A-9, under the Hytime Linking Mechanism, it defines the element link to use the Hytime 'ilink'. Is this correct or is it suppose to be a 'clink'? Maybe I am just confused on what the difference is between an 'ilink' and a 'clink'. Are there any papers written on this subject? If so, where can I find them? Thanks in advance, \</lori> -- Lori Snyder lsnyder@redstone-emh2.army.mil Systems Engineering Solutions, Inc. lsnyder@cs.uah.edu Huntsville, AL 35801 (205) 867-4562 </message> <message id="<2ddr3b$69v@slip.aisg.com>" date="2963598891"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 29 Nov 1993 21:54:51 UT From: "Michael Clark" \<mdc@aisg.com> Organization: Gateway Conversion Tech. Message-ID: <2ddr3b$69v@slip.aisg.com> Subject: J2008 DTD needed Anyone have a copy of the J2008 DTD(s) they can email me, or a pointer to an ftp site which has it? TIA, Michael -- | Michael Clark | Paul's Law: You can't fall off | | Gateway Conversion Technologies | the floor. | | Research Triangle Park, NC | | | mdc@aisg.com | Cole's Law: Thinly sliced cabbage. | </message> <message id="<19931130.091020.887@almaden.ibm.com>" date="2963601101"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 29 Nov 1993 22:31:41 UT From: "Eliot Kimber" \<drmacro@vnet.IBM.COM> Message-ID: <19931130.091020.887@almaden.ibm.com> References: <19931129T213404Z@news.naggum.no> Subject: Re: MIL-D-87269 (IETMDB) [Lori Snyder] | On page A-9, under the Hytime Linking Mechanism, it defines the element | link to use the Hytime 'ilink'. Is this correct or is it suppose to be | a 'clink'? Maybe I am just confused on what the difference is between | an 'ilink' and a 'clink'. HyTime considers links (the connections or relationships between objects) as peer objects to the anchors of the links (the objects being connected). This allows you to do two things: 1. Apply hyperlinks to objects to which you do not have write access (e.g., "webs applied to data", ala the IRIS system at Brown) 2. Define properties of links independent of the anchors themselves. The basic hyperlink construct is the "independent link", or "ilink". It is called an independent link because the link element is independent of its anchors. Note that the link element itself is transparent to the anchors--in other words, when you traverse a link from one anchor to another, you are unaware that the link itself was established via an ilink element. Ilinks can have two or more anchors, and HyTime defines ways to indicate how the various anchors can be accessed from the other anchors (for example, can you only tranverse from one anchor to another, or can you traverse among all the anchors, etc.), as well as other properties of the link. The normal Ilink picture looks something like this: .---------------Ilink---------------. | | V V Anchor A<- - - - - - - - - - - - - ->Anchor B The ilink element locates the anchors and defines the meaning of the relationship established, but from the point of view of either anchor, the link is directly to the other anchor. The anchors can be located using any of the various HyTime location methods, from direct ID reference to queries of various sorts. This is the general case of hyperlink. However, there is a special case of hyperlink where one of the anchors is also the hyperlink element, such as a cross reference. This is modeled as a "contextual link", or clink. It is a contextual link because the link element occurs in the context of the information, rather than being independent of it. The clink element is a special case of ilink with the following constraints: 1. There are only two anchors, the clink element being one, the target of the clink being the other. 2. The anchor roles are fixed as "refmark refsub". Clink is intended to directly model existing cross-reference elements in existing applications. However, it is also possible to use an Ilink in this way by making the Ilink element one of the anchors of the link: .----. | V '---ilink------------>Anchor A You can do this either by explicit ID reference, e.g.: \<ilink id=me linkends="me anchor-A" anchrole="linksouce target">I link to myself\</ilink> Or by having one more anchor role value than Linkends= value, in which case, the first anchor role applies to the ilink element itself: \<ilink linkends="anchor-A" anchrole="linksource target"> In this example, the anchor role "linksource" applies to the inlink element, and the anchor role "target" applies to the element "anchor-A". Thus, clink is useful for any "traditional" cross references, but not for much else. Ilink should be used for all other types of link elements, with the self-referential form used when the ilink is one of its own anchors. Note that anchor role names are to HyTime what element names (generic identifiers) are to SGML: they are application-specific names intended to relate to some application-specific semantic or object. HyTime, for the most part, does not define any anchor roles, and certainly doesn't constrain the set of anchor roles you might have. It is up to applications to define meaningful anchor roles. In most applications you would expect the anchor role to be used to constrain or inform the processing that is done based on the role an given anchor satisfies. For example, in IBMIDDoc, we define the anchor role "annotation", which means that the object linked to with that role is an annotation of the link source. This can be used, for example, to apply the appropriate "annotation style" to the element linked to. For example, in an online presentation, you might have annotations come up in a window at a particular place relative to what they annotation, and with some specific decoration unique to annotations (think of footnote windows typical in most online systems). (Note: This ends the basic discussion of ilink and clink. The rest is a discussion of anchor roles and how they might be used to do interesting things in conjunction with event schedules. ) Another interesting use of anchor roles is in concert with events in event schedules. Events in event schedules serve to locate objects, contained (literally or by reference) by the events, within coordinate spaces (e.g., windows on a display screen). Events can also refer to events using a clever sort of query called an "accessed anchor list". An accessed anchor list contains a list of anchor role names, and indicates that when an element is accessed as satisfying one of the listed roles, it should be considered to be contained by the event *for the duration of the access*. This is a very interesting way to define the presentation of elements because it means you can define the presentation purely in terms of the relationships between objects with no knowledge of the objects themselves. For example, in my previous post on finite coordinate spaces and event schedules, I used as an example a simple coordinate space that defined three windows on a display screen, like so: +---------------------------+ | | Zapruder| | | | | JFK |---------| | | Ruby | | | | +---------------------------+ In the example, since it was November 22, I had as the contents of the window, JFK's inaugural speech, the Zapruder film, and the video of Jack Ruby shooting Oswald. In my example, I had shown explicit containment of these objects by the events that represented the three windows. Simple enough, but pretty static. However, if we apply accessed anchor lists, we can create an interesting dynamic system. Let's pretend we have a database of various information objects categorized by subject in such a way that we can do queries against them. These objects represent things like people, organizations, etc. As part of the definition of these objects, there are included various interesting multimedia objects associated with them, such as videos, photographs, old engravings, text, sound recordings, etc.. These objects are self describing in the sense that having located an object, you can find out what its notation is, etc. (for example, each one may be represented by a master entity declaration as part of the database). Now, because we are conspiracy theorists, pretend we want to create a system that will present information about heads of state, their assassins, and the controllers of the assassins. This will help us uncover conspiracies while providing an entertaining and enlightening presentation of the data. We could go through the database, find heads of state that were assassinated, find the information about them, get the object locations, build the event schedules, etc. Boring. Tedious. Unnecessary. Instead, we can apply the power of anchor roles and accessed anchor lists to the problem. Our problem statement defines the anchor roles: head-of-state, assassin, controller. Thus, we can define our event schedule for the above presentation like so (ignoring the tedious details for now): \<fcs> \<evsched> \<event exspec="headofstate-extent"> \<accanch> \<acctype linktype="ilink" accrole="head-of-state"> Accesses the head-of-state anchor of any ilink element. \</acctype> \</accanch> \</event> \<event exspec="assassin-extent"> \<accanch> \<acctype linktype="ilink" accrole="assassin"> Accesses the assassin anchor of any ilink element. \</acctype> \</accanch> \</event> \<event exspec="controller-extent"> \<accanch> \<acctype linktype="ilink" accrole="controller"> Accesses the controller anchor of any ilink element. \</acctype> \</accanch> \</event> \</evsched> \</fcs> This FCS now applies to any set of links within our imaginary system that satisfy these roles. We can test it by recreating our original picture. Imagine that our system works by building Ilink elements on the fly that are then input to the system. The act of inputing an ilink starts the process, giving some user interface gizmo by which we can start the "access" action for the murdered leader of our choice. Because we are working against a database that has been designed for query-based retrieval, we can do our accessing using queries, something like this: \ \<nmquery qdomain="assassins" fn="assassinated"> select(CAND eq(%1 Proploc(person_assassinated))) \</nmquery> \ \<nmquery qdomain="database" fn="controledby"> select(CAND eq(%1 Proploc(controledby))) \</nmquery> \ \<nameloc id=head-of-state-loc> \<nmquery qdomain="heads-of-state"> select(DOMROOT eq(TRUE proploc(Was_Assassinated CAND))) \</nmquery> \</nameloc> \ \<nameloc id=assassin-loc> \<nmquery args="\&head-of-state;" usefn=assassinated> \</nameloc> \ \<nameloc id=controller-loc> \<nmquery args="\&assassin;" usefn=controledby> \</nameloc> These location elements set up our queries into the database. The first two NMQuery elements define functions that take arguments, which we'll use by reference from the Nameloc elements. We need to use functions because the specific arguments will be determined by which head of state we choose. The third Nameloc contains a direct query which will serve to set up our system. Assuming that we have a database of heads of state (or a specific "heads of state index in our database), the query returns all those heads of state that were assassinated. This list will then be the entry point into our application, letting us explore the relationships between heads of state, their assassins, and the conspiracies behind them. We only need a single ilink element to set this thing in motion: \<ilink id=conspiracy-adventure linkends="heads-of-state-loc assassin-loc controller-loc" anchrole="head-of-state assassin controller"> This link links heads of state to assassins and controllers via the referenced location elements. It is input to the Conspirator-O-Matic program. \</ilink> Now imagine how this might work when we give this ilink to the Conspirator-O-Matic program: 1. The act of inputing the ilink serves to start access to the "head-of-state" anchor, which in this case is represent by presenting a list of heads of state who have been assassinated. We can then chose an entry in the list, which by definition of our application, serves to access the other two anchors. 2. As soon as the "head-of-state" anchor is accessed, the "head-of-state" event "contains" the object that satisfies that anchor, in this case our list of heads of state. For simplicity, assume that the application is defined such that no objects are actually retrieved until an item in the list is selected. Having selected a head of state, however, the visual representation of that head of state will become the content of the event. Let's pretent we've defined the application such that it picks the first object it finds that it can present and presents it, in this case, the film of JFK's inaugural speech, which comes up in the window defined by the first event's extent spec. 3. As soon as we select a head of state, the system uses that value as the argument value to the "assassin" anchor query, which gets us to the assassin entry in the database. Again, we pick the first displayable thing associated, this time the Zapruder film (remember, I'm just making this up, it could be defined any way we like). It comes up in the second event's window. 4. Having located the assassin, the assassin value is used as the input to the controller query, in this case locating Jack Ruby, the entry for whom happens to be the first object in our "conspiracy behind the JFK assassination" object in the database. The TV news scenes are the first thing found, so they come up in event 3. Now think about what happens when you select another head of state from the original list: you select Lincoln. Maybe you get a clip of some actor playing Lincoln, an engraving of John Wilkes Booth, and photograph of brothel where he met with his conspirators. You select Julius Caesar and get a picture of a Roman coin, and two different passages from the Shakespear play, etc.. Maybe we refine the system so that with each event you can select the different presentation objects associated with the anchor--you can probably think of other cool and interesting ways you might like the system to work. This is a pretty simple example, and neither the querying, in and of itself, nor the presentation are particularly unique or innovative, but I think the integration of the presentation definition with the queries in an abstract way that is tied to the relationships between objects and not the objects themselves is unique, or if not unique, at least pretty cool and very useful. What I find particularly interesting is the way this system stays organized into well-defined parts that can be implemented separately and integrated at a fairly high level through the event schedule, the location methods, and the ilink. The problem of presenting video or pictures in a window is easy to solve, the problem of doing queries is easy to solve, and the problem of generating user interface objects from lists of things is easy, all in isolation. The HyTime part of the system, the part that manages the coordinate space elements, the linking and location, is completely independent of the details of the presentation or user interface. Given a query system and a HyTime link and location manager, as well as basic multimedia functionality such as MMPM/2 or Windows Multimedia Extensions, or a system like ToolBook, it should not be too difficult to write the application-specific code to glue it all together, certainly no more difficult than writing a print composition application. Once you have a system like this, it becomes a very powerful information visualization tool, doing for amorphous information what spread sheets do for numbers. I'm imagining visualization systems where with a relatively simple authoring interface you define the queries and relationships to use, relate them to presentation spaces (windows on a screen, points on a graph, areas within a 3-D virtual space, whatever), select a few style options, and set the thing in motion. If the system is built correctly, if the style choices are reasonable but limited, if the user interface is truly usable, 90% of the effort in building a presentation should be thinking about the relationships and queries to apply against the database. And because the definition of the relationships is independent of the concrete presentation, it means you can derive a wide variety of presentations from the same queries, or share the definitions among disparate presentation systems or databases. If 90% of the effort goes into forming the queries and defining the relevant relationships, then you'd better make sure your investment in those is preserved. That is what HyTime promises, because it is a standard designed to provide just that sort of independence, and why a standard query notation, such as HyQ is important. If I build some queries, I better be able to through them at Lexus, Nexus, the Perseus system, my local body of data, my research notes, and so on, without ever changing the query itself. I find this sort of system very exciting. It seems to tie together all the different approaches to hypertext that various groups are working on, unifying them within the common framework of HyTime and exploiting the power of queries to resolve connections. -- Eliot Kimber Internet: drmacro@vnet.ibm.com Dept E14/B500 IBMMAIL: USIB2DK9@IBMMAIL Network Programs Information Development Phone: 1-919-254-5160 IBM Corporation Research Triangle Park, NC 27709 "But Ranger Doug, can't we just use some proprietary data format instead of this SGML stuff?" "Sure Slim, that would be the easy way, but it wouldn't be the Cowboy Way." </message> <message id="<1993Nov29.233940.20283@ctp.com>" date="2963605180"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 29 Nov 1993 23:39:40 UT From: "Eddy Wong" \<ewong@ctp.com> Organization: Cambridge Technology Partners Message-ID: <1993Nov29.233940.20283@ctp.com> Subject: Conversion tools from word processor formats to SGML Hi netters, I'm looking for conversion tools from word processor formats (RTF, Frame) to SGML. I'm looking at Avalanche's FastTag right now. Are there any other ones? I'm looking for tools as well as companies that can do this kind of job. Sorry if this a FAQ. Thanks in advance, Eddy. -- * Eddy Wong ewong@ctp.com * * Cambridge Technology Partners, Inc. (617) 374-8410 * * 304 Vassar St, Cambridge, MA 02139 (617) 374-8300 (fax) * </message> <message id="<2df0c4$4sm@klaava.Helsinki.FI>" date="2963637060"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 30 Nov 1993 08:31:00 UT From: "Patric M Stickler" \<stickler@klaava.Helsinki.FI> Organization: University of Helsinki Message-ID: <2df0c4$4sm@klaava.Helsinki.FI> Subject: Question regarding (erroneous?) interpretation of RS/RE ... I thought I understood well the somewhat "slippery" issues regarding RS/RE interpretation in mixed and non-mixed data content; however, I recently came across a problem that threw me. Since two unrelated (as far as I know) parsers behave the same way (Sgmls and Omnimark), I will assume that their interpretation is correct, and although I would perhaps like them to behave differently, I am more interested in refining my understanding of this issue. The problem involves the effect of a RE in the selection by the parser of two alternate content models. I.e., given the declarations \<!DOCTYPE Input [ \<!ELEMENT Input - - (Data+)> \<!ELEMENT Data - - (Text|#PCDATA)> \<!ELEMENT Text - - (#PCDATA)> ]> and then the input \<Input> \<Data> Here is some text. \</Data> \<Data> \<Text> Here is some text. \</Text> \</Data> \<Input> the first Data element, containing only PCDATA, is parsed with no problems; however, the second Data element, containing a single Text subelement, is flagged as erroneous, to the effect that the Text element is not permitted in this location. The output/error messages from Sgmls are (INPUT (DATA -Here is some text. )DATA (DATA sgmls: SGML error at test.sgml, line 12 at ">": DATA end-tag implied by TEXT start-tag; not minimizable )DATA sgmls: SGML error at test.sgml, line 12 at ">": Out-of-context TEXT start-tag ended INPUT document element (and parse) )INPUT If we modify the input data and remove the RE/RS preceeding the Text element \<Input> \<Data> Here is some text. \</Data> \<Data>\<Text> Here is some text. \</Text> \</Data> \</Input> then we get a second error, again from Sgmls (INPUT (DATA -Here is some text. )DATA (DATA (TEXT -Here is some text. )TEXT sgmls: SGML error at test.sgml, line 13 at record end: DATA end-tag implied by data; not minimizable )DATA sgmls: SGML error at test.sgml, line 13 at record end: Out-of-context data ended INPUT document element (and parse) )INPUT Only when we remove the RE/RS both from preceeding the Text element's start tag and following the Text element's end tag is the input is processed with no errors. Likewise, if the declaration of Data is changed to be mixed \<!ELEMENT Data -- ((Text|#PCDATA)+)> then either input example is processed with no errors, but the declaration fails to accurately describe the document structure as it would permit multiple Text elements and PCDATA, which is not acceptable. Apparently, the parser is interpreting the RE's preceeding and following the Text element as data. Yet according to my understanding of the Standard, the RS and RE both preceeding and following the Text element should be ignored, given their context. Is it perhaps a case where the RE occuring between the Data start tag (or perhaps the RS preceeding the Text start tag) is apparently leading the parser to select the content model option where the content of Data is only #PCDATA, in which case when the Text start tag is encountered, an error is (given the interpretation of the content model, correctly) flagged. Yet even this is suspect, because if only the RE/RS is removed preceeding the Text start tag, yet the RE/RS following the Text end tag remains, an error is still flagged, to the effect that the Data element end tag is not minimizable an is missing (which it is not). If the parser selects the alternative where the Data element contains a sinble Text subelement, then the RE/RS following the Text element should be ignored. All in all, it's very mysterious as to what the parser is expecting. It was my understanding that RS is always ignored (except in very rare cases where it is defined as markup, which it is not here, 7.6.1 #1), that "the first RE of an element is ignored if no RS, data, or proper subelement" preceeds it (7.6.1 #6), and that "the last RE in an element is ignored if no data or proper subelement follows it" (7.6.1 #8) which is the case in the first example input. Yet perhaps this does not apply to the effect of RE on the parsing of the DTD itself, or the resolution of alternative grammatical interpretations of the input structure? Nowhere in the standard (or Goldfarb's annotations) could I find reference to the effects of RS or RE on the parsing strategy taken in selecting alternate content models (except for a short blurb in Appendix F regarding record boundaries which I'm not sure if it is relevant or not); yet both Sgmls and Omnimark behave identically in their interpretation of the input data and their report of the apparent errors in the example inputs. Are they both erroneous, or is this yet another "gotcha" associated with the other linefeed complexities in SGML? Even if the parser considered the Data element to be mixed (which I don't, since the Text and #PCDATA alternatives are mutually exclusive), the RE/RS preceeding and following the Text start tag in the first example input should still be ignored. It appears to me that the neither parser is talented enough to take into account the fact that the first RE may or may *not* be significant, and thus is unable to provide the expected semantics for the defined content model. I'd very much appreciate any discussion that can shed some light on this issue, primarily so that I can avoid similar problems in the future. Please no discussion of "why" the elements are defined as they are. The data is coming from an external source, and it is significant whether or not the content of the the Data element is encapsulated in a Text element. The relevant issue here is the effect of RS/RE on parser behavior and content model semantics. Thanks in advance to all who reply. -- Patrick M. Stickler OH2LUV, KC4YYY The comments contained herein WSOY, Information Systems Division do not necessarily reflect the Helsinki, Finland - psti@wsoy.fi official views of my employer. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Don't put off for tomorrow what you can do today; because if you enjoy it today, you can do it again tomorrow... </message> <message id="<CHAr9v.9qL@exodus.iti.gov.sg>" date="2963638291"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 30 Nov 1993 08:51:31 UT From: "Edgar Teo" \<edgarteo@iti.gov.sg> Organization: Information Technology Institute, National Computer Board, S'pore Message-ID: \<CHAr9v.9qL@exodus.iti.gov.sg> Keywords: DSSSL, ISO Subject: Request for DSSSL update Hi all, Would appreciate it if someone could update me on the latest happenings in DSSSL? Has it been adopted as an ISO standard? Where can I get a copy of the specs? Thanks in advance. - Edgar </message> <message id="<JJC.93Nov30171006@jclark.jclark.com>" date="2963668205"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 30 Nov 1993 17:10:05 UT From: "James Clark" \<jjc@jclark.com> Organization: None, London, England Message-ID: \<JJC.93Nov30171006@jclark.jclark.com> References: <2df0c4$4sm@klaava.Helsinki.FI> Subject: Re: Question regarding (erroneous?) interpretation of RS/RE ... [Patric M Stickler] | The problem involves the effect of a RE in the selection by the parser | of two alternate content models. I.e., given the declarations | | \<!DOCTYPE Input [ | \<!ELEMENT Input - - (Data+)> | \<!ELEMENT Data - - (Text|#PCDATA)> | \<!ELEMENT Text - - (#PCDATA)> | ]> | | and then the input | | \<Input> | \<Data> | Here is some text. | \</Data> | \<Data> | \<Text> | Here is some text. | \</Text> | \</Data> | \<Input> | | the first Data element, containing only PCDATA, is parsed with no | problems; however, the second Data element, containing a single Text | subelement, is flagged as erroneous : | Apparently, the parser is interpreting the RE's preceeding and | following the Text element as data. Yet according to my understanding | of the Standard, the RS and RE both preceeding and following the Text | element should be ignored, given their context. The parser is correct to reject your example. The process of determining whether an RE can be ignored according to 7.6.1 happens after the process of checking whether the content of an element conforms to its content model. See the first note in clause 7.6.1 (starting at 322:12 in Goldfarb), and the second note in clause 11.2.4 (starting at 411:12). James Clark jjc@jclark.com </message>

\ In the subdocument document type declaration subset: \ \ \ \ \ \ The tradeoffs between these approaches become clearer when one considers reuse of information between different groups, each of which have their own local distinctions. When using element declarations on the main document only, it becomes increasingly more difficult to interchange information as more local elements are defined and interchanged. Reusing groups may not even be concerned with the distinction being made but have to add the appropriate coding to their document subsets to enable the SGML parser to properly parse the information being shared. In addition, to enable the use of this reused information but the information itself and the changes to the doc type declaration of the using document must be interchanged and they must be referencable separately. Eliot's idea of using subdocs to limit scope becomes important here since it then becomes possible to limit the definition of the new element to the reused portion (the subdocument entity) and to exchange this local definition with the reused portion (in the subdoc's doc type decl subset). This is workable as long as the information to be reused makes sense as a subdocument entity. Using the class definition mechanism also has merit in addressing this scenario, but only applies if the new 'element' is a true subclass of an existing element in the current document type defintion, taking the same content and attributes. I have heard it said that this approach leads to a DTD with only one element and a class attribute; the other two lead to each document having unique DTDs for every docuemnt, which suggests to me that all the approaches have merit in specific situations. It is also important to note that using unique local element declarations (whether in the main document or a subdocument DTD subset) works best (only?) if the underlying system supports architectural forms and the new element conforms to an existing supported architectural form. Otherwise, process specific support for each local element would also have to be shared with all reusing groups, in addition to the data and the declarations. The SUBDOC idea requires, of course, the support of the SUBDOC feature. The CLASS attribute depends on the ability of the processing system to distinguish elements in an instance by attribute value. All of these features or functions are important but are not all fully supported, yet. -- Wayne L. Wohler Internet: wohler@vnet.ibm.com Dept G82/025Z IBMMAIL: USIB29WX@IBMMAIL Publishing Solutions Development Phone: 1-303-924-5943 IBM Corporation PO Box 1900 Boulder, Colorado 80301-9191 Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 08 Nov 1993 07:12:22 UT From: "David Megginson" \ Message-ID: \ References: <9311080915.AA19795@ipsi.darmstadt.gmd.de> Subject: Re: SGML and Object-Orientation I find the whole idea of Object-Oriented SGML post-processing very interesting. Where would the inheritance come from -- parent elements in the parse tree, or logical classes and meta-classes? Would an element for an indented quotation, for example, inherit attributes (current font, etc) from the paragraph in which it occurs, from a "QUOTED MATERIAL" metaclass, or from both? If from both, then in what order? David M. Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 08 Nov 1993 09:15:10 UT From: Klemens Boehm \ Message-ID: <9311080915.AA19795@ipsi.darmstadt.gmd.de> Subject: SGML and Object-Orientation Hello, I am looking for (scientific publications on) object-oriented modellings of SGML or SGML document storage with object-oriented databases. Any hint is sincerely appreciated. Cheers, Klemens Boehm Newsgroups: comp.text.frame,comp.text.sgml Date: 08 Nov 1993 10:25:20 UT From: "Ashar Nisar" \ Organization: BTR Communications Company Message-ID: <2bl6qg$gbs@openlink.openlink.com> References: \ \ <19931107.195403.901@almaden.ibm.com> Subject: Re: Standards for tag names? [Tom Cloney] | One thing to consider in choosing tag names is that MML can't deal | with tagnames that contain spaces. ... [Wayne L. Wohler] | That's an interesting teaser ... define a concrete syntax which ALLOWS | spaces as part of a generic identifier. Just off hand my guess is that | it is not possible to have the same character be a name character and a ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ | separator or space character. It is entirely possible. Yes we may have different grammar and lookahead/context requirements, and probably very hard to write parsers, but it is possible (if somebody can come up with such a grammar where certain type of names in certain contexts can have spaces as valid name character (not delimeter)) -ashar Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 08 Nov 1993 12:46:30 UT From: "Hugh Stabler" \ Organization: Xerox Message-ID: <1993Nov8.124630.1813@spectrum.xerox.com> References: \ Subject: Re: Conversion of paper doc's to SGML. For the European Patent Office, Rank Xerox scan, OCR, SGML-encode then publish well over a million pages of patent applications a year. We have several hundred data capture operators working on patent application alone. Obviously with this sort of volume any reduction in capture time that can be achieved by automation leads to significant savings. We use the Kurzweil ICR from Xerox Imaging Systems. It generates quite a lot of hints as to how it believes the page to be structured in terms of centered headings, tables etc, but my finding has generally been that you can automatically mark up with a fair degree of accuracy those things that a data capture operator would find trivial (such as paragraphs, headings) whereas more complex structures such as footnotes, maths and tables must be marked up manually. A lot depends on the required accuracy of the end result. Our requirement is 100% accuracy, therefore operators must check all automatic encoding anyway. I've found it's as quick to get an operator to encode a page which contains only simple paragraphs from scratch as it is for him/her to check an automatically marked-up page and correct any mistakes. For a more complex page it is quicker to do it by hand. A lot also depends on the complexity of your DTD. It may be that an italic typeface can mean emphasis in a paragraph, a publication title in a bibliography entry, and a variable name in a maths formulae. I doubt that you can find a piece of software that can correctly differentiate cases such as these. It may be there are better products out there now for automatic markup. My personal feeling though is that we are a long way off from having software which can accurately make judgements about complex structure from analyzing the format. It is hard enough training data capture operators to perform this task with any sort of consistency. In terms of images, most quality OCR packages such as the Kurzweil OCR will automatically identify images on a scanned page with reasonable accuracy, and will have the option to extract them from the page bitmap and save them separately. For us, the accuracy is not quite good enough (we require precisely 5mm margins around each image, also textual annotations can be seen by the OCR as part of the surrounding text rather than as part of the image, plus we require to identify the type of each image) so we segment the images by hand, but for many applications automatic image segmentation would probably work fine. The only products I know which are specific to automatic SGML mark-up are Avalanche Development's tools FastTag and IMSYS. You might also want to look at Software Exoterica's XGML Translator and XGML OmniMark products. I hope you find some of this useful. Feel free to contact me if you want to discuss any of this further. - Hugh Stabler (Consultant) Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 08 Nov 1993 15:39:25 UT From: Lori Snyder \ Message-ID: <199311081605.IAA04086@mail.netcom.com> Subject: G4 Decompression Algorithms Does anyone know where I can find algorithms for CCITT G4 decompression for a Unix X-platform or any library routines or any conversion utilities to convert G4 to X11 bitmap? We are in the process of converting a hypertext product for a DOS platform to Unix. Any information would greatly be appreciated. \ -- Lori Snyder lsnyder@redstone-emh2.army.mil Systems Engineering Solutions, Inc. lsnyder@cs.uah.edu Huntsville, Alabama 35801 (205) 876-4562 Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 08 Nov 1993 16:28:30 UT From: "Gary Benson" \ Organization: Fluke Corporation, Everett, WA Message-ID: \ References: <9310281443.AA19372@netcomsv.netcom.com> <19931029.065225.214@almaden.ibm.com> <2b5rii$r9s@meaddata.meaddata.com> Subject: Re: MS fact sheet on SGML [Eliot Kimber] | While it's certainly encouraging to see Microsoft move toward SGML in | their products, it's somewhat frustrating to see yet another word | processor vendor promulgate what should now be a thoroughly discredited | idea that users can "simply construct their documents ... as they | normally would." Every experience I've had or seen with this sort of | approach suggests that it is almost impossible for writers, on their | own, to follow the SGML- imposed structural constraints sufficiently to | allow reliable transform out to SGML. I think that to suggest | otherwise demonstrates both a lack of understanding of the practical | and potential uses of SGML, and irresponsibly raises the expectation | level of people beyond what the tools can reasonably provide. [Lloyd Harding] | I agree. The concept of WYSIWYG is counter-productive if we hope to | get authors focused on content. I agree, too, but this has been the basis of a philosophical (or mayber better to say religious) debate here for a long time, and it is heating up. The WYSIWYG proponents' latest arguments are roughly as follows: "The presentation of this data requires a particular page appearance; certain information should appear on a single page, with the facing page containing an illustration which the text discusses. Writers must now "write to fit the page", something they cannot do unless they are at all times seeing the page as it will be in its final form". Slippery devils, arent't they? Indeed, the argument becomes even more robust, because it is claimed that without prior knowledge of how much room the information will take on the page, it is impossible for the writer to plan for translation into other languages. This means that he must write the English text so that about 20% of the page is left, permitting the French and German text to fit. -- Gary Benson-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-inc@tc.fluke.com_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_- Diligence is the mother of good luck. -Ben Franklin [Editor's note: This article was distributed only within the conterminous USA, and thus escaped the archive system, still based in Norway. \] Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 08 Nov 1993 17:06:04 UT From: "Gary Benson" \ Organization: Fluke Corporation, Everett, WA Message-ID: \ References: <19931029.065225.214@almaden.ibm.com> <2b5rii$r9s@meaddata.meaddata.com> \ Subject: Re: MS fact sheet on SGML [Lloyd Harding] | The concept of WYSIWYG is counter-productive if we hope to get authors | focused on content. [Gary Benson] | I agree, but this has been the basis of a philosophical (or maybe | better to say religious) debate here for a long time, and it is heating | up. On the other hand, I do not think that WYSIWYG and SGML are necessarily mutually exclusive. Considering that the promise of display PostScript is to give us true WYSIWYG, at least to resolution of the display, I can imagine an application that would at all times display a set of available objects that would change depending on the "current object", and yet also be capable of displaying one of several views of the emerging document. Each object on the display would be identified by tag, typographic properties, or both. Perhaps when "show properties" is enabled, the tags would change in text to single points on the line, and a window to the side could show in outline form the tag names, something like: Chapter First Order Heading Numeric List Alphabetic List \ \ \ END of Alphabetic List \ \ \] Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 08 Nov 1993 17:28:12 UT From: Lori Snyder \ Message-ID: <199311081746.JAA18601@mail.netcom.com> References: <2b8pcu$di1@pens-emh2.ncts.navy.mil> <2bbr9f$rur@elroy.jpl.nasa.gov> Subject: Re: Has anyone gotten IADS to load? I am a contractor supporting the US Army. One of our companies' functions is to maintain and enhance the IADS code. Once I learned of the problem a few people have had when trying to load IADS, I had to go through the appropriate channels before I could respond. Following is a response from the government point of contact for IADS: -------------------------------------------------------------------------- As the government point of contact for the Interactive Authoring and Display System (IADS), I apologize for the apparent difficulties that have been reported when people are trying to download the IADS installation files. We sent IADS version 1.2 to the International SGML User's Group to give people an opportunity to work with an SGML-based product without paying license fees. We will be forwarding IADS version 1.3 as soon as we clarify how best to configure the files so there will not be difficulties in the future. In the meantime, if you are working either for or with a government agency to produce an electronic document using CALS-standard text and graphics, please send me an email message at spape@redstone-emh1.army.mil and include telephone/fax number. I will send you the appropriate distribution form to receive installation disks from the US Army Missile Command. Susan Pape IADS POC Integrated Materiel Management Center US Army Missile Command (spape@redstone-emh1.army.mil) ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Sorry it took so long to get a response back to those who had a question regarding IADS. Oh, by the way, once you get IADS running your default login is 'guest'. Your login is case sensitive, so use all lower case. \ -- Lori Snyder lsnyder@redstone-emh2.army.mil Systems Engineering Solutions, Inc. lsnyder@cs.uah.edu Huntsville, AL 35801 (205) 876-4562 Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 08 Nov 1993 17:47:09 UT From: "Terry Smith" \ Organization: TANDEM Computers, Inc (Integrity Systems Division, MPD) Message-ID: <1993Nov8.174709.25528@integrity.uucp> Subject: re: Dynatext [Ronald Emrick] | I'm just wondering if anyone has ever asked for a demo disk from EBT | concerning their DynaText program and received it? I've been promised | a demos disk and still have not received it and it has been over a | month. Has it taken this long for anyone else to receive a demo disk | from them. I am greatly interested in their product and would love to | see what they can (and can't) do. | | I would appreciate it if anyone has any information on this matter and | for that matter, any information on DynaText. Dynatext didn't send me any demo products, but after a representative did an on-site demo for our tech pubs group, he left us with some sample Dynatext software. This includes the indexer, the insted style creation software, and the browser. Terry -- ------------------ NonStop-UX Documentation ---------------------- Terry Smith Tandem Computers Inc tsmith@mpd.tandem.com 14231 Tandem Blvd (512) 244-8871 Austin, TX 78728 Newsgroups: comp.text.frame,comp.text.sgml Date: 08 Nov 1993 18:19:04 UT From: "Wayne L. Wohler" \ Message-ID: <19931109.020211.658@almaden.ibm.com> References: \ \ <19931107.195403.901@almaden.ibm.com> <2bl6qg$gbs@openlink.openlink.com> Subject: Re: Standards for tag names? [Wayne L. Wohler] | Just off hand my guess is that it is not possible to have the same ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ | character be a name character and a separator or space character. [Ashar Nisar] | it is entirely possible. ... I'm sure there are many grammars where it is possible, I was saying that I don't believe it is possible to define such a thing within the rules for the definition of SGML concrete syntaxes, not as a general rule. -- Wayne L. Wohler Internet: wohler@vnet.ibm.com Dept G82/025Z IBMMAIL: USIB29WX@IBMMAIL Publishing Solutions Development Phone: 1-303-924-5943 IBM Corporation PO Box 1900 Boulder, Colorado 80301-9191 Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 08 Nov 1993 19:10:40 UT From: "Mark T. Jacobson" \ Message-ID: <20@markj.win.net> Subject: Evaluating SGML I am currently evaluating the advantages and disadvantages of converting our editorial system to SGML. We have been using an ``SGML-like'' format for several years now. The main advantages of this format are reduced cost of composition and the ability to reuse the files. We publish about 40 journals and more than 100 books a year using our existing system. The majority of our composition is done by various outside vendors. These vendors are trained to make use of our coding and they offer us substantial discounts. We have successfully published one CDROM title (also produced outside, using the same files that were sent for composition) and frequently supply authors with completed text for future editions. Our primary goal in considering a switch to SGML is to position ourselves to respond to the developing market for electronic delivery of professional journals and books, whether that be in the form of CDROM, online access, or something other. Of course we would still deliver our print products and would expect that the cost to do so would be maintained or reduced as would the length of the publishing cycle. I recently attended the GCA SGML tutorial (all 5 days) and feel that I have a workable understanding of the basic syntax. I have, however, a couple of questions regarding the selection or creation of a DTD. My questions are listed below. I welcome all replies. As I sidenote, this is my first time using the InterNet and I don't know how to get around very well. Please keep this in mind if you reference other files, systems, or newsgroups. 1) Are there any disadvantages to using a variant syntax? Because the system we currently use is ``SGML-like'', one of the options I am considering is developing our own DTD and making as few changes as possible to our existing coding structure. This would have the advantage of reducing the amount of training required to transition our editors to the new system. Our current system uses a long sequence of codes as open and close delimiters. For instance a start tag might look like the following: [md1]{tagname}[mdnm] and an end tag like: [md1]{/tagname}[mdnm] *NOTE* the [ and ] characters in the above syntax are ASCII characters 174 and 175. As I understand the SGML standard, it would be possible for me to continue using this structure if I define it in an SGML declaration. This would mean that our system would be based on a variant syntax. Are there any disadvantages to using a variant syntax? Is this supported by the available SGML software tools? Would I encounter problems delivering these files to other SGML systems? These files will be used for print composition on a variety of systems at outside vendors as well as in house. They will also be used for some form(s) of electronic delivery. 2) Apart from the development costs, are there any other disadvantages to creating my own DTD? If I create my own DTD, will I meet with problems delivering my files to other SGML systems? These files will be used for print composition on a variety of systems at outside vendors as well as in house. They will also be used for some form(s) of electronic delivery. If I create my own DTD will I reduce the reusability of my files as opposed to using an industry standard DTD such as the AAP's. Are there other DTDs I should consider? Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 08 Nov 1993 22:40:37 UT From: "Jann VanOver" \ Organization: Boeing Computer Services Message-ID: <108456@bcsaic.boeing.com> Keywords: double quotes, delimiters, attributes Subject: Can I "escape" delimiters in Attributes? Yes. We need to put a double quote inside an attribute whose contents are delimited by double quotes. Before you answer, let me delineate some of the restrictions: 1) we can NOT just use single quotes as delimiters. the attribute may also have a single quote in its content. 2) we can NOT make the attribute into an element. We are working on that, but the DTD is controlled by a standards organization (ATA) and it may take a year or more to get them to accept a change. 3) we can NOT use an alternate character as a delimiter because we have no way of knowing (or controlling) which characters may be included in the attribute in the future. SO - what I'd like to know is, is there any way to "escape" a character inside an attribute string. Like the standard \\ escape in unix? Is there some way to say: efftext="Here's a string which has a \\"double quote\\" inside it?" All responses are welcome! Respond via email or posting. If there is sufficient interest, I'll summarize email responses! Thanks! Jann "Desperate in Seattle" VanOver vanover@atc.boeing.com Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 08 Nov 1993 22:47:04 UT From: "Jann VanOver" \ Organization: Boeing Computer Services, Seattle Message-ID: <108459@bcsaic.boeing.com> References: <1993Nov4.194820.3596@sq.sq.com> Subject: Re: SGML '93 Conference Information [Yuri Rubinsky] | This is the first part of the text version of the brochure which was | published last month. | | The schedule itself will be posted in a couple of days to reflect some | last minute changes. | | | | CRANKING UP THE VOLUME ON THE QUIET REVOLUTION | | SGML '93 | | The Annual Conference of the SGML Technical Community | December 6-9, 1993 | Sheraton Boston Hotel and Towers | Boston, Massachusetts | USA | A LITTLE LATE, DON'T YOU THINK! In my company, we need more than ONE MONTH notice to plan a business trip. Budgets must be alotted and tickets need to be purchased soon enough to get a good rate. I am not able to go on this trip, SPECIFICALLY because I wasn't able to find out what the conference agenda would be until about two weeks ago. At that time, when I discovered there were some sessions that were VERY pertinent to the work I am doing, I couldn't get funding to go. PLEASE, GCA, get your act together and get conference details out sooner. Am I the only one in this situation? I hardly think so. Jann "SGML-less in Seattle" VanOver vanover@atc.boeing.com Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 09 Nov 1993 01:11:45 UT From: "Eliot Kimber" \ Message-ID: <19931108.173215.290@almaden.ibm.com> References: <9311080915.AA19795@ipsi.darmstadt.gmd.de> \ Subject: Re: SGML and Object-Orientation [David Megginson] | I find the whole idea of Object-Oriented SGML post-processing very | interesting. Where would the inheritance come from -- parent elements | in the parse tree, or logical classes and meta-classes? Would an | element for an indented quotation, for example, inherit attributes | (current font, etc) from the paragraph in which it occurs, from a | "QUOTED MATERIAL" metaclass, or from both? If from both, then in what | order? I think it depends on what's being inherited. As I've mentioned before, in IBMIDDoc, we define four basic classes of attributes: o Identificative properties (e.g., ID=, title, author) o Descriptive properties (language=, version=, GI, class=) o style properties (ideally held as LINK attributes) o Hyperlink references (linkend=, linkends=, refid=, etc.) Of the three property classes, only descriptive properties fully inherit in IBMIDDoc. It obviously doesn't make any sense for identificative properties to inherit. For style properties, it will depend on the nature of an individual property whether it makes sense to inherit it or not. Note that it IBMIDDoc, the descriptive property inheritance is strictly defined by the IBMIDDoc application definition, because those properties are independent of any down-stream processing, but style property inheritance is defined by the processing application (e.g., DynaText has its style inheritance rules, while a FOSI-based system might have its own, different rules). In IBMIDDoc, we have two trees for inheritance, the structure tree and the class tree, where the class tree is the hierarchy of user-defined element classes, although class-based inheritance is primarily intended for inheriting style properties (e.g., a phrase class of "CommandName" might have an defined style of "bold" that will be inherited by all phrases that use that class). When you think about the inheritance of more abstract semantic properties based on architectural forms, you realize that there is multiple inheritance where two different architectures are used to define a single concrete application, as in the case of IBMIDDoc, where HyTime and InfoMaster forms can both apply to a single element. -- Eliot Kimber Internet: drmacro@vnet.ibm.com Dept E14/B500 IBMMAIL: USIB2DK9@IBMMAIL Network Programs Information Development Phone: 1-919-254-5160 IBM Corporation Research Triangle Park, NC 27709 "But Ranger Doug, can't we just use some proprietary data format instead of this SGML stuff?" "Sure Slim, that would be the easy way, but it wouldn't be the Cowboy Way." Newsgroups: comp.text.frame,comp.text.sgml Date: 09 Nov 1993 05:06:24 UT From: Erik Naggum \ Message-ID: <19931109.003@sfo.naggum.no> References: \ <19931107.195403.901@almaden.ibm.com> <2bl6qg$gbs@openlink.openlink.com> Subject: Re: Standards for tag names? [Tom Cloney] | One thing to consider in choosing tag names is that MML can't deal | with tagnames that contain spaces. ... [Wayne L. Wohler] | That's an interesting teaser ... define a concrete syntax which ALLOWS | spaces as part of a generic identifier. Just off hand my guess is that | it is not possible to have the same character be a name character and a | separator or space character. [Ashar Nisar] | It is entirely possible. | | Yes we may have different grammar and lookahead/context requirements, | and probably very hard to write parsers, but it is possible (if somebody | can come up with such a grammar where certain type of names in certain | contexts can have spaces as valid name character (not delimeter)) This thread has been cross-posted to comp.text.sgml and comp.text.frame. I suspect that Tom and Ashar followed comp.text.frame, while Wayne read this thread in comp.text.sgml. According to Tom, MML tag names cannot contain SPACE. No names in SGML can contain SPACE, either. This is intuitively obvious if we remember that in all declarations where names can occur, a space is a separator and will terminate the name. SGML aficionados can look this up in clause 13.4.5 Naming Rules, [465:2] in [Goldfarb]. (This is not affected by which actual character plays the SPACE role if it has been changed from the usual SPACE character. See also 13.4.4 Function Character Identification, [462:1-2] in [Goldfarb] for how this would be done.) However, I believe Ashar refers to some hypothetical language neither SGML nor MML, and thus answers slightly outside the context in which I believe Wayne was trying to answer. So, yes, it is possible to have space in names, but not in SGML and not in MML, and the conditions under which it is possible in some hypothetical language may be as hard to deal with as Ashar says, so maybe it is not a good idea at all. SGML has recognized that it is not a good idea, and flat out disallows SPACE in names. Wayne is right, it is not possible to have the same character be a name character and a separator or space character. Best regards, \ -- Erik Naggum \ \ ISO 8879 SGML Chairman, SGML SIGhyper \ ISO 10744 HyTime "Memento, terrigena. Memento, vita brevis." ISO 10646 UCS Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 09 Nov 1993 07:52:42 UT From: Carsten Schiers \ Organization: University Hospital Eppendorf, Hamburg, Germany Message-ID: <2bni8a$and@rzsun02.rrz.uni-hamburg.de> References: <199311081605.IAA04086@mail.netcom.com> Subject: Re: G4 Decompression Algorithms [Lori Snyder] | Does anyone know where I can find algorithms for CCITT G4 decompression | for a Unix X-platform or any library routines or any conversion | utilities to convert G4 to X11 bitmap? | | We are in the process of converting a hypertext product for a DOS | platform to Unix. Any information would greatly be appreciated. Although I think you means _algorithm_, I want to tell you this, because you liked to have _any_ information. The method of G4 coding is described in the so called 'blue books' of CCITT. But you have to develop your algorithm for yourself then, as it only describes the bits. CU Carsten, schiers@uke.uni-hamburg.de Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 09 Nov 1993 08:37:28 UT From: "Tom Gordon" \ Organization: German National Research Center for Computer Science (GMD) Message-ID: \ References: <20@markj.win.net> Subject: Standard DTDs (was: Evaluating SGML) [Mark T. Jacobson] | If I create my own DTD will I reduce the reusablilty of my files as | opposed to using an industry standard DTD such as the AAP's. Are | there other DTDs I should consider? Yes! There will shortly be de jur standard DTDs for articles, books and serials, based on the AAP DTDs. I don't know if they have a catchy name, but the standard is ISO 12083. Let's hope these don't remain only de jure, but become widely accepted and used. For more information, you may want to contact the editor of the standard, Eric van Herwijnen, at ERIC@crnvma.cern.ch. The advantage of using standard DTDs is the advantage of using any standard: one can hope that a support industry will grow up around the standard. Tom Gordon p.s. I am in the process of porting my "qwertz" SGML to LaTeX system to use these ISO DTDs. The converter from qwertz to ISO is working, but I've yet to write the converter from ISO to LaTeX. -- Dr. Thomas F. Gordon GMD, FIT-KI; Schloss Birlinghoven 53757 Sankt Augustin / Germany email: thomas.gordon@gmd.de; phone: (+49 2241) 14-2665 Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 09 Nov 1993 09:27:14 UT From: "Peter Flynn" \ Organization: University College, Cork Message-ID: \ References: <20@markj.win.net> Subject: Re: Evaluating SGML [Mark T. Jacobson] | I am currently evaluating the advantages and disadvantages of | converting our editorial system to SGML. : | As I sidenote, this is my first time using the InterNet and I don't | know how to get around very well. Please keep this in mind if you | reference other files, systems, or newsgroups. One little tip which might help people with format-disadvantaged newsreaders is to make sure you type lines <80 chars in length :-) [Editor's note: Articles are reformatted for the archive. \[ | 1) Are there any disadvantages to using a variant syntax? | Because the system we currently use is ``SGML-like'', one of the | options I am considering is developing our own DTD and making as few | changes as possible to our existing coding structure. This would have | the advantage of reducing the amount of training required to transition | our editors to the new system. Our current system uses a long sequence | of codes as open and close delimiters. For instance a start tag might | look like the following: | | [md1]{tagname}[mdnm] This looks like Nota Bene to me. | As I understand the SGML standard, it would be possible for me to | continue using this structure if I define it in an SGML declaration. | This would mean that our system would be based on a variant syntax. | Are there any disadvantages to using a variant syntax? If you want to make your text available outside your own system, you need to use a syntax which is commonly recognised, just to avoid extra work. You certainly _can_ use guillemets (chevrons) as \&stago; and \&tagc: delimiters but my gut feeling says why be different? | Is this supported by the available SGML software tools? Should be. | Would I encounter problems delivering these files to other SGML systems? Only if you don't tell them how you do it. You'd have to give them the sgml.declaration, and don't forget, _their_ system may not be PC-based, or Mac-based, or whatever you use, so the symbols you use, while useable, may look a little silly on their screen if they're not using SGML-compliant s/w. | These files will be used for print composition on a variety of systems | at outside vendors as well as in house. They will also be used for | some form(s) of electronic delivery. If you are going to expect printers to handle your SGML, stick to the conventions. | 2) Apart from the development costs, are there any other disadvantages | to creating my own DTD? Not that I know of. | If I create my own DTD, will I meet with problems delivering my files | to other SGML systems? No, exactly the opposite. | If I create my own DTD will I reduce the reusablilty of my files as | opposed to using an industry standard DTD such as the AAP's. It depends who you want to give the text to. If a customer uses AAP, then you might make things easier for them by doing so yourself. The whole business of DTD-to-DTD translation is still up for grabs. | Are there other DTDs I should consider? O'Reilly Associates' DocBook.DTD? ///Peter, just my $0.02-worth, YMMV Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 09 Nov 1993 09:47:44 UT From: Erik Naggum \ Message-ID: <19931109.004@sfo.naggum.no> References: <20@markj.win.net> \ Subject: Re: Standard DTDs (was: Evaluating SGML) [Mark T. Jacobson] | If I create my own DTD will I reduce the reusablilty of my files as | opposed to using an industry standard DTD such as the AAP's. Are | there other DTDs I should consider? [Tom Gordon] | Yes! There will shortly be de jure standard DTDs for articles, books | and serials, based on the AAP DTDs. I don't know if they have a catchy | name, but the standard is ISO 12083. Let's hope these don't remain | only de jure, but become widely accepted and used. To say that ISO 12083 is based on the AAP DTDs is akin to consult the Devil about the Bible. ISO 12083 was voted on as the AAP DTDs in ISO's "fast- track" procedure, and thus people have reason to believe it will continue to be based on them. However, ISO 12083 has had all its GI's altered, much of the structure changed, and has numerous extra features compared to the original DTD's, many of them even useful. | The advantage of using standard DTDs is the advantage of using any | standard: one can hope that a support industry will grow up around the | standard. One can also regard standard DTDs as a complete waste of time and effort. DTDs should be defined within specific communities that expect to exchange information, as the AAP did among American Publishers. Elevating such particular communities and their interchange needs to the level and prestige of International Standard is to tell people who do not have those needs that they are not important and if an industry grows around ISO 12083 instead of ISO 8879, we will have lost 25 years of progress in information processing. Already, some people make editors for particular DTD's, quite contrary to the intent of the SGML standard and the raison d'etre for the whole language. Now, with this souped-up and rehashed AAP DTD set, they will have even less reason to do things right. ISO 12083 was accepted by the international standards community as quite a different standard than what will hit the streets. Regardless of whether this is politically correct or not, or whether the people who voted on this thing was just rubber-stamping it through ISO and didn't even look at the horribly ugle mess that the AAP DTD's were at that time, and it is a great service to Mankind to override their decision to accept the AAP DTD's, it still would have been polite, if not moral, to ask people to accept what will actually be published. Fair enough that a lot of the voting that goes on in ISO is done by people who don't even read the title of the drafts, but not letting those who might have cared comment on an _entirely_ _new_ _standard_ that differs not only in word, but in spirit, from the subject of the vote, rings all my alarm bells and spells disaster for the process of fast-tracking other standards. There is no telling _what_ ISO will publish after things are voted on and accepted. I have no doubt that ISO 12083 will be adopted, in whole or in part, by a large number of people, and that we will see several companies offering ISO�12083-compatible, ISO 8879-violating products in the near future. The marketdroids will no doubt be unable to distinguish between "SGML" and "ISO 12083" and the used car salesmen in the software market will lead unwary customers to buy Edsels labeled "SGML". This will hurt SGML in the short run, and the investment people make in their information in the long run. It was a mistake to accept ISO DIS 12083 because of its lack of quality and because DTDs simply are not standards material, and it will be a mistake to publish ISO 12083 as a completely different standard because of the procedural problems involved. The present ISO 12083 text may be useful and may even be good as an application, but it still should not be an ISO standard. That it became an ANSI standard in the first place is hard to believe. There are merits to providing commonly known generic identifiers for a number of commonly used element types, and the structure of some low-level element types can be hard to get right. This is akin to libraries that come with programming languages, most of whose routines are very hard to get right. But to standardize whole applications, whole programs, is just plain non-sense. If ISO 12083 is used as a library, as a resource, that is very good. If it is used by software developers to hard-wire semantics to particular generic identifiers, it is a disaster. This is just like conformance testing standards -- nice to have, but not as an international standard. Standards often increase their value beyond their technical merits because they are standards, but things do not become good just because they are standards. Some standards are really bad, such as ODA (T.410), OSI (X.200), and MHS (X.400), and they only get worse once the standards people start to "improve" it at the rate of several technical addenda and corrigenda a year. I suggest that organizations who consider using ISO 12083 take good, long look at it and see what they can use. Do not under any circumstance use it as a whole, and do not believe that there is anything more in a generic identifier in SGML than there was before this "standard" came about. Such special semantics should be expressed using architectural forms, and identified as such. HyTime got it right, and although HyTime is complex because of it, we are all much better off. Some of the stuff in ISO 12083, at least last time I saw it, used attributes where processing links would have been much, much better, as Steve Pepper demonstrated in his excellent article. There are many ways to standardize semantics and to allow people to share information in useful ways. Standardizing DTD's is not among them. Best regards, \ Sunnyvale, CA -- Erik Naggum \ \ ISO 8879 SGML Chairman, SGML SIGhyper \ ISO 10744 HyTime "Memento, terrigena. Memento, vita brevis." ISO 10646 UCS Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 09 Nov 1993 10:29:06 UT From: "Michael G. Popham" \ Organization: University of Exeter, UK. Message-ID: \ References: <2b8pcu$di1@pens-emh2.ncts.navy.mil> <2bbr9f$rur@elroy.jpl.nasa.gov> <199311081746.JAA18601@mail.netcom.com> Subject: Re: Has anyone gotten IADS to load? In a vain(?) attempt to forestall any further postings, and as a follow-up to recent postings in this group, I suspect that many IADS installation problems that people have experienced is *NOTHING* to do with the IADS distribution itself (which appears to install just fine). I received the IADS distribution on 3 floppy disks from the International SGML Users' Group, and arranged with ISUG to put the stuff up on the net via our FTP server. The files on the disks were "zipped" for distribution over the net, and it is this phase which seems to have caused problems for some people. Depending on your point of view (and the unzipping utility you use!) either we didn't zip them quite right, or some users aren't unzipping them quite right. For example, if you unzip the files with something like PKUNZIP you *MUST* use the -d switch to ensure that the original directory structures are re-created (our unzip utility does this by default, so we didn't appreciate that there might be a problem for other people. Now we know better). If you do *not* re-create the original directory structures, you will get messages prompting you to provide disk 1 etc. of the type reported by some people. Of the cases reported to me, ALL BUT ONE has been resolved by correctly unzipping the files. Moreover, when you consider that within the first four days of putting it up for ftp, 421 people downloaded IADS but only about a dozen reported installation problems, the installation success rate doesn't seem too bad. Detailed instructions on unpacking and installing IADS were posted to this group within two days of the software's release on the net. The same information is also now included in the README file I put up with the files. I can email them directly to anyone who missed them, just drop me a line. Neither ISUG nor the SGML Project offer to provide support for the IADS distribution in *any*way*. That being said, if someone knows of a better way to zip future releases of IADS, I would welcome any helpful suggestions. Also, don't forget that you can order copies of the distribution disks and/or documentation from Gaynor West at ISUG for a piffling sum! Apologies to anyone who has had installation problems as a result of the zipping method used, and to the IADS developers who were probably wondering what the hell was going on. Michael Popham -- SGML Project - C.D.O Email:M.G.Popham@exeter.ac.uk Computer Unit - Laver Building Phone:+44-(0)392-263946 North Park Road, University of Exeter Fax: +44-(0)392-211630 Exeter EX4 4QE, United Kingdom Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 09 Nov 1993 12:40:20 UT From: "Francis Cave" \ Organization: Pira International Message-ID: <752848820snz@pira2.demon.co.uk> References: \ Subject: Re: Standard DTDs (was: Evaluating SGML) [Mark T. Jacobson] | If I create my own DTD will I reduce the reusablilty of my files as | opposed to using an industry standard DTD such as the AAP's. Are | there other DTDs I should consider? [Thomas Gordon] | Yes! There will shortly be de jur standard DTDs for articles, books | and serials, based on the AAP DTDs. I don't know if they have a | catchy name, but the standard is ISO 12083. Let's hope these don't | remain only de jur, but become widely accepted and used. Publishers in Europe have at least three choices, all more or less based upon the original AAP standard. These are ISO 12083 as mentioned, the DTD drafted by the European Workgroup for SGML (EWS) - not yet complete, and a DTD developed by the Elsevier Science Publishing Group. It's anyone's guess as to which one will "win" in the end. What is certain is that publishers will win when they make a choice ... any of these three would be OK. If they don't already know about it, European followers of this news group may be interested in a two-day workshop in Luxembourg, 2-3 December 1993. This is being organized as part of the CEC's Open Information Interchange (OII) initiative. Day 2 is entitled "Standardization of SGML DTDs". I will try to have the programme posted here. | The advantage of using standard DTDs is the advantage of using any | standard: one can hope that a support industry will grow up around the | standard. Yes, but publishers still have to decide why they want a common DTD. If it is purely for interchange, a fairly tight DTD is appropriate - tighter than the AAP/ISO DTD, which is too flexible about things like headings, but in this case publishers would need their own internal DTDs with some tools for transforming to the interchange format. If publishers want a common DTD that is good for internal purposes as well, it will have to include all the various ways that different publishers work (or publishers will have to conform more in their ways of working - which I know they won't agree to), in which case the standard becomes even more flexible in its interpretation and use, which to my mind makes it far less useful. On balance I'm in favour of publishers agreeing a common DTD for interchange but developing their own DTD - closely related to the common DTD, of course - to satisfy internal idiosyncrasies. -- Francis Cave Pira International Randalls Road Leatherhead KT22 7RU United Kingdom Tel +44 372 376161 Fax +44 376 377526 email cave@pira2.demon.co.uk Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 09 Nov 1993 13:26:06 UT From: "Tom Gordon" \ Organization: German National Research Center for Computer Science (GMD) Message-ID: \ References: <20@markj.win.net> \ <19931109.004@sfo.naggum.no> Subject: Re: Standard DTDs (was: Evaluating SGML) [Erik Naggun] | One can also regard standard DTDs as a complete waste of time and | effort. ... : | It was a mistake to accept ISO DIS 12083 because of its lack of quality | and because DTDs simply are not standards material, ... : | I suggest that organizations who consider using ISO 12083 take good, | long look at it and see what they can use. Do not under any | circumstance use it as a whole, and do not believe that there is | anything more in a generic identifier in SGML than there was before | this "standard" came about. ... There are many ways to standardize | semantics and to allow people to share information in useful ways. | Standardizing DTD's is not among them. Before reading my reply, you may want to reread all of Erik's message. I've only quoted a small part of it here. I don't have much to say about whether or not the procedure by which ISO 12083 is coming about was proper or desirable. I'm just a user and have had no involment in the standardization process. I also do not feel particularly competent to judge its technical merits as a general purpose DTD for articles, books and serials. My only previous experience in this area is as the author of the qwertz DTD, which was intended to be a reconstruction of LaTeX in SGML. In this reply I just want to defend the *idea* of a standard, general purpose DTD for articles and books. In my community, which is academic computer science, (in particular artificial intelligence), LaTeX is the de facto standard document exchange format. It is far from uncommon for authors to work together on an article or book, using LaTeX and electronic mail. For *my* purposes, the main problem with LaTeX is that there is no nice structure editor for it, let alone WYSIWYG editor, along the lines of Author/Editor for SGML. I created the qwertz system so as to be able to use Author/Editor. But LaTeX, not SGML, remained the document exchange format of choice. It may not be a de jure standard, but is what (most) people in my community want and expect. The qwertz system makes it possible to use SGML editors to create LaTeX documents, but so long as LaTeX remains the accepted exchange format, there is a natural tendency to remain tied to TeX for formatting and printing. Whatever TeX's merits, and they are numerous, this is unnecessarily restrictive. It should be possible, even easy, to format documents marked up in a descriptive markup language using just about any formatting system, such as troff, lout, Framemaker or even Word. This is where I would hope that a set of standard DTDs, like ISO 12083, would have its merit. I agree completely with Eric that no DTD is suitable for every task, but presumably a DTD with comparable expressiveness to LaTeX could be as useful to the same community which now regularly uses LaTeX. Despite what I said about not wanting to defend ISO 12083 in particular, there is at least some anecdotal evidence that it would be suitable as a de jur functional equivalent to LaTeX: I wrote a translator from the qwertz DTD -- which again is modelled after LaTeX, into ISO 12083 and then used this to translate my dissertation. There are few (see below) LaTeX constructs in my qwertz reconstruction which cannot be adequately modelled by ISO 12083. This said, it remains to see whether being official, ISO standard DTDs will do much to help SGML compete with LaTeX in my community. The AAP DTDs, despite their technical limitations, would also have done the job, but have not caught on. The main reasons that neither the AAP DTDs nor SGML in general have caught on in my community are, I believe: 1) The lack of a standard DTD comparable to LaTeX, and 2) The lack of free and widely available and supported systems for formatting and printing SGML documents. There are a few systems, like qwertz, which address point 2, but both points have to be addressed before SGML stands a chance to displace LaTeX. Therefore, as an SGML fan, I hope that Erik is wrong about ISO 12083. One more thing: I implied above that there were indeed a few LaTeX constructs I needed with no equivalent in ISO 12083. These are the various kinds of "theorem environments" for definitions, theorems, corollaries, etc. In such cases, my suggestion is to *extend* ISO 12083 with custom elements for your application. This is much easier than starting from scratch, and your documents will be fail to conform to the standard only in minor and well-documented ways. -- Dr. Thomas F. Gordon GMD, FIT-KI; Schloss Birlinghoven 53757 Sankt Augustin / Germany email: thomas.gordon@gmd.de; phone: (+49 2241) 14-2665 Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 09 Nov 1993 14:10:53 UT From: "Peter Flynn" \ Organization: University College, Cork Message-ID: \ References: <108459@bcsaic.boeing.com> Subject: Re: SGML '93 Conference Information [Yuri Rubinsky] | The Annual Conference of the SGML Technical Community | December 6-9, 1993 [Jann VanOver] | A LITTLE LATE, DON'T YOU THINK! | | In my company, we need more than ONE MONTH notice to plan a business | trip. Budgets must be alotted and tickets need to be purchased soon | enough to get a good rate. Then your company is going to miss out on a lot of business. Maybe Boeing can afford to. Most companies can't: any company I have worked for was able to give me authorization to travel at zero notice if it was important enough (i.e., if there was business to be had or something seriously conducive to it). | I am not able to go on this trip, SPECIFICALLY because I wasn't able to | find out what the conference agenda would be until about two weeks ago. | At that time, when I discovered there were some sessions that were VERY | pertinent to the work I am doing, I couldn't get funding to go. | | PLEASE, GCA, get your act together and get conference details out | sooner. But they were. I had a flyer for it early this year. Not program details, sure, and I agree these are a bit late. How serious is Boeing about SGML? The people in your office here seem to take it very seriously. ///Peter Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 09 Nov 1993 14:40:32 UT From: "Eliot Kimber" \ Message-ID: <19931109.064032.489@almaden.ibm.com> References: <9310281443.AA19372@netcomsv.netcom.com> <19931029.065225.214@almaden.ibm.com> <2b5rii$r9s@meaddata.meaddata.com> \ Subject: Re: MS fact sheet on SGML [Gary Benson] | I agree, too, but this has been the basis of a philosophical (or mayber | better to say religious) debate here for a long time, and it is heating | up. The WYSIWYG proponents' latest arguments are roughly as follows: | "The presentation of this data requires a particular page appearance; | certain information should appear on a single page, with the facing | page containing an illustration which the text discusses. Writers must | know "write to fit the page", something they cannot do unless they are | at all times seeing the page as it will be in its final form". At the risk of sparking a Jihad, I will claim that this argument is entirely specious because it assumes that only a human can create such a presentation, when in fact, if a clear relationship is established between the text and illustration, there is no reason a composition system can't produce the desired result automatically -- the key requirement is that the relationship between the text and the illustration be expressed in such a way that a computer can understand it, e.g., as a hyperlink, for example: \ ]> \ \ \

All About Blue Bonnets \ \

The Blue Bonnet is the state flower of Texas... \

... \ \

\The Blue Bonnet \ \ \

Here, the hyperlink attribute Illustration= establishes a clear relationship between the paragraph block and the figure, namely "figure illustrates paragraphs" (note that this relationship could have been expressed structurally by containing the figure within the parablock). Because the relationship is defined using an explicit ID reference, the processing application knows about it and can act on it, e.g., apply the style "when there exists the relationship 'figure illustrates paragraphs' between a figure and a paragraph block, place the figure on the page opposite the start of the block." All the writer needs to do is establish the relationship and the style, and need worry no more about the presentation, because it will always be correct. Note that if there is no well-defined relationship between the paragraphs and the figure, then the writer must manage the placement by hand, which is difficult, tedious, and wasteful when there is a way for the computer to do it automatically. After all, the purpose of computers is to do the difficult and tedious for us, not provide more difficult and tedious things for us to do. | Indeed, the argument becomes even more robust, because it is claimed | that without prior knowledge of how much room the information will take | on the page, it is impossible for the writer to plan for translation | into other languages. This means that he must write the English text | so that about 20% of the page is left, permitting the French and German | text to fit. This is only a robust argument to the degree that the previous argument is valid, which it's not. If you don't have to hand-tune the pages, then room for translation is a moot point. Another thing to think about is that any information for which the visual presentation is more complex than flowing headings and paragraphs probably represents and reflects real-world objects. This suggests that if your SGML data reflects these real-world objects, then deriving the desired presentations of those objects becomes easy, because the relationships between the parts are well defined and therefore can be used to control the presentation. For example, in IBMIDDoc, we have a set of elements for expressing procedures, with elements like ProcEntry, ProcStep, ProcExit, and so on (nothing new to the CALS folks). I was able to easily provide three different presentation styles for procedures (tabular, plain text, and ordered list) because the relationships were so clear that mapping the structures to simple formatting elements (paragraphs, headings, ordered lists) in BookMaster was completely automatable. All a writer has to do is indicate which style they want and the computer does the rest. In my test document, I use precisely the same markup three times (via entity reference) and apply each style to it. Because there is no presentation information in the base SGML data (but rich content and structure identification), I am completely free to apply a wide variety of presentation styles to the data automatically. I could not do this if the same procedure data was marked up as simply divisions and paragraphs, because the objects and relationships would not be clear to the computer (or even, necessarily to humans). -- Eliot Kimber Internet: drmacro@vnet.ibm.com Dept E14/B500 IBMMAIL: USIB2DK9@IBMMAIL Network Programs Information Development Phone: 1-919-254-5160 IBM Corporation Research Triangle Park, NC 27709 "But Ranger Doug, can't we just use some proprietary data format instead of this SGML stuff?" "Sure Slim, that would be the easy way, but it wouldn't be the Cowboy Way." Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 09 Nov 1993 15:59:36 UT From: "Francis Cave" \ Organization: Pira International Message-ID: <752860776snz@pira2.demon.co.uk> References: <108456@bcsaic.boeing.com> Subject: Re: Can I "escape" delimiters in Attributes? [Jann VanOver] | SO - what I'd like to know is, is there any way to "escape" a character | inside an attribute string. Like the standard \\ escape in unix? Is | there some way to say: | | efftext="Here's a string which has a \\"double quote\\" inside it?" The LIT character will always be recognized within a literal as marking the end of the literal, regardless of what characters precede it. So I think you will have to replace each LIT with something else. One way of achieving this would be to define what looks like an escape sequence \\" as a short reference to a general entity such as \&dblquote; which could then be resolved as something other than LIT. Another - more drastic - approach would be to declare \\ to be the markup- scan-suppress character (MSSCHAR) in the FUNCTION parameter of an SGML Declaration. This would I think be an allowable abuse of a feature of SGML that was added late in the day to cope with the use of multiple character sets in SGML documents. This approach is no good if you want to stick to the reference concrete syntax. -- Francis Cave Pira International Randalls Road Leatherhead KT22 7RU United Kingdom Tel +44 372 376161 Fax +44 376 377526 email cave@pira2.demon.co.uk Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 09 Nov 1993 16:42:30 UT From: "Peter Flynn" \ Organization: University College, Cork Message-ID: \ References: <752860776snz@pira2.demon.co.uk> Keywords: sgml tei p2 a/e mkrls Summary: Apparent missing elements Subject: Errors compiling TEI2.DTD with Author/Editor's mkrls I just downloaded all the P2 dtds etc from sgml1.ex.ac.uk and ran mkrls over them (this compiles a binary "rules" file for use with Author/Editor). 1. had to bodge ":" to "-" in the sgmldecl.tei because mkrls is out of date :-( but that's not important 2. it gagged on SUBDOC YES 10 in the FEATURES declaration: curia% mkrls -S sgmldecl.tei tei2.dtd Compiling tei2.dtd into tei2.rls. Error at offset 2471 of the input stream, on line 91 of the SGML Declaration: Bad Feature Use specification. Bad or missing number specification for open subdocument entities. curia% so I changed it to SUBDOC NO for the moment. Is this another outdatedness? 3. Then it gets as far as: curia% mkrls -S sgmldecl.tei tei2.dtd Compiling tei2.dtd into tei2.rls. The following elements are undefined: TEXT ABBR EXPAN PERSON MDASH CORRESP CORRESPGRP LINK XPTR XREF ATT GI TAG VAL CAMERA CAPTION MOVE SOUND TECH VIEW CASTLIST TEXTDESC PARTICDESC SETTINGDESC PERSNAME ORGNAME LOCNAME APTPOS STNUM STNAME PLACENAME TRAILER SEG Error in Document Type Declaration at offset 6781 of the input stream, on line 170 of the document: Element used but not defined. curia% Anyone got any pointers? ///Peter Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 09 Nov 1993 22:58:10 UT From: "Joe Cascio" \ Organization: Cadre Technologies Inc. Message-ID: <1993Nov9.225810.25034@fripp.ri.cadre.com> Subject: C++ Class Library for SGML?? Please pardon if this is a FAQ. I am trying to find out if there are any C++ libraries available for free or for sale which present an API to SGML documents and abstractions. Such an API/Library would allow you to parse an SGML file, and be delivered a network of class or struct instances linked together with pointers that represent the semantic elements in the document. For instance, you might get an instance of "SgmlElementDefn" that represented the content description of the element (say "Chapter") that's found in the DTD. You would also get multiple instances of "SgmlElementInstance" for each Chapter in the document. The instance would point to it's element defn, and have a collection of pointers to the element instances composing the Chapter. -JC --- * Joe Cascio u----wm- * Cadre Technologies Inc. /\\ * 222 Richmond St. 0_/ "$@@#!$#@$^&" * Providence, RI 02903 USA \\ * phone: 401-351-5950 | . . * FAX : 401-455-6800 /| . . . . * email: jc@cadre.com / | . . . . . . ^ ^ . . . .... Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 10 Nov 1993 03:27:11 UT From: "Terje Norderhaug" \ Organization: Dept. of Informatics, University of Oslo, Norway Message-ID: <2bpn2f$4tm@sognsvann.ifi.uio.no> Subject: Parser I am currently working on a project in which we use SGML-based pedagogical markup in order to produce university-level courseware for World Wide Web. So far we have used an ad-hoc SGML-parser, but are now looking for the real thing: A public available SGML parser. Please inform me if you have any suggestions. -- -- Terje Norderhaug (terjenor@math.uio.no) -- -- terje Norderhaug (terjen@ifi.uio.no) Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 10 Nov 1993 05:52:36 UT From: Erik Naggum \ Message-ID: <19931110.006@sfo.naggum.no> References: <108456@bcsaic.boeing.com> <752860776snz@pira2.demon.co.uk> Summary: Use character references (\") or entity references (\"e) Subject: Re: Can I "escape" delimiters in Attributes? [Jann VanOver] | SO - what I'd like to know is, is there any way to "escape" a character | inside an attribute string. Like the standard \\ escape in unix? Is | there some way to say: | | efftext="Here's a string which has a \\"double quote\\" inside it?" [Francis Cave] | The LIT character will always be recognized within a literal as marking | the end of the literal, regardless of what characters precede it. So I | think you will have to replace each LIT with something else. One way | of achieving this would be to define what looks like an escape sequence | \\" as a short reference to a general entity such as \&dblquote; which | could then be resolved as something other than LIT. Unfortunately, short reference delimiters are not recognized as such in attribute value literals, only in content. | Another - more drastic - approach would be to declare \\ to be the | markup-scan-suppress character (MSSCHAR) in the FUNCTION parameter of | an SGML Declaration. This would I think be an allowable abuse of a | feature of SGML that was added late in the day to cope with the use of | multiple character sets in SGML documents. This approach is no good if | you want to stick to the reference concrete syntax. There is abuse and there is creative use. The "multi-code" mechanisms in ISO 8879 are not sufficient to handle ISO 2022 code extension except in very simple cases, and whoever required their presence was clearly not intending to use them seriously, or they would also have required a better specification. As a result, they are up for grabs, and MSSCHAR could certainly be used for the purpose of an "escape character". The most serious question with these "markup-scan-characters" is whether they are eaten by the parser or are passed to the application. If they were to be used for ISO 2022 or so-called "multi-code" support, they would have to be passed as data characters, since their function is to call in a different character set. If they were just added to the language to pacify those who pretended that they needed "multi-code" support, they could be eaten by the parser or handed to the application as equally valid options. The application is the best source for this decision, so the conclusion must be that they should be passed to the application (a "mode bit" is a dangerous thing). In other words, the application must be prepared to process these "control characters" when it receives them as data in literals and everywhere else. This does not rhyme with the "escape character" model that we try to mimic, and this also means that a data character must be doubled to represent itself. I don't know how well other people like having to treat all kinds of characters specially all over the place, but it tends to get on my nerve, and it is the single most important reason I do not think TeX is a good language. Having eight different mechanisms to obtain a character that you just type in on the keyboard is an indication that the language design was driven by ease of implementation, as opposed to the principle of the least surprise. Troff also has this backslash-mania, but it is less hard to deal with. SGML (or, rather the reference concrete syntax) is very unintrusive in this regard, but it does incur a small penalty in some cases. The need for an escape character arises from other needs, as well, such as the lack of any other means to refer to special characters, and sometimes line breaks actually break up data and cause errors if not escaped. None of these problems occur in SGML, where it is a trivial matter to refer to the QUOTATION MARK with the character reference "\"", and to the APOSTROPHE with "\'". Francis is correct on pointing out that an entity reference can be used, but it has to be an explicit entity reference, not a short reference. Best regards, \ -- Erik Naggum \ \ ISO 8879 SGML Chairman, SGML SIGhyper \ ISO 10744 HyTime "Memento, terrigena. Memento, vita brevis." ISO 10646 UCS Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 10 Nov 1993 18:13:30 UT From: "Jann VanOver" \ Organization: Boeing Computer Services, Seattle Message-ID: <108667@bcsaic.boeing.com> References: <108459@bcsaic.boeing.com> \ Subject: Re: SGML '93 Conference Information [Yuri Rubinsky] | The Annual Conference of the SGML Technical Community | December 6-9, 1993 [Jann VanOver] | A LITTLE LATE, DON'T YOU THINK! Sorry, I shouldn't have shouted. I think I'm just very disappointed that I didn't know who the speakers would be any sooner. Yes, I DO receive the GCA mailings, but really, the conference program didn't arrive until two weeks ago. [Jann VanOver] | In my company, we need more than ONE MONTH notice to plan a business | trip. Budgets must be alotted and tickets need to be purchased soon | enough to get a good rate. [Peter Flynn] | Then your company is going to miss out on a lot of business. Maybe | Boeing can afford to. Most companies can't: any company I have worked | for was able to give me authorisation to travel at zero notice if it | was important enough (ie if there was business to be had or something | seriously conducive to it). A company which makes airplanes is NOT going to "miss out on" business if their computing analysts can't make an East Coast conference on "last minute" notice. Of course, when it comes to selling airplanes, there are different rules for justifying business trips. However, in the last few years, less and less trips to computing conferences have been authorized. This is a budget necessity. Without a clear and definite justification for a trip, it is often (usually) not authorized. There's just nobody to pay for it. [Jann VanOver] | PLEASE, GCA, get your act together and get conference details out | sooner. [Peter Flynn] | But they were. I had a flyer for it early this year. Not program | details, sure, and I agree these are a bit late. Yes, I got that flyer too. It was actually a "Request for Participation." There was a list of subjects they were asking for people to speak about, but no concrete information about the subject and speakers which would be present. | How serious is Boeing about SGML? The people in your office here seem | to take it very seriously. So are the people from THERE going to SGML '93? Will you give them my name so they can forward their trip reports to me? Boeing is serious about supporting its customers. And a big part of that seriousness is keeping costs down. Part of keeping costs down is to reduce unnecessary travel. Do you see where I'm going with this? When it's a choice between cutting travel budget and laying people off, I guess I prefer a tighter travel budget. Again, I'm sorry I had to yell. So -- What do we know about SGML '94? I hear there's a West Coast (USA) conference in the Spring/Summer. Any idea when/where that will be? Jann VanOver Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 10 Nov 1993 19:29:04 UT From: "Eliot Kimber" \ Message-ID: <19931110.113336.247@almaden.ibm.com> References: <752860776snz@pira2.demon.co.uk> \ Subject: Re: Errors compiling TEI2.DTD with Author/Editor's mkrls [Peter Flynn] | 2. it gagged on SUBDOC YES 10 in the FEATURES declaration: | | curia% mkrls -S sgmldecl.tei tei2.dtd | Compiling tei2.dtd into tei2.rls. | Error at offset 2471 of the input stream, on line 91 of the SGML | Declaration: Bad Feature Use specification. | Bad or missing number specification for open subdocument entities. | curia% | | So I changed it to SUBDOC NO for the moment. Is this another | outdatedness? No, this is a documented restriction of Author/Editor. I wish it wasn't, now that we've seen the light about SUBDOC. | 3. Then it gets as far as: | | curia% mkrls -S sgmldecl.tei tei2.dtd | Compiling tei2.dtd into tei2.rls. | The following elements are undefined: I've found that mkrls is very picky and won't build if you either have undeclared elements or elements that are declared but not used in any content models. Mkrls is also very unsporting about & content models. I would like to see a version of mkrls that is a little more forgiving and a little friendlier. I'd also like SUBDOC support under A/E. -- Eliot Kimber Internet: drmacro@vnet.ibm.com Dept E14/B500 IBMMAIL: USIB2DK9@IBMMAIL Network Programs Information Development Phone: 1-919-254-5160 IBM Corporation Research Triangle Park, NC 27709 "But Ranger Doug, can't we just use some proprietary data format instead of this SGML stuff?" "Sure Slim, that would be the easy way, but it wouldn't be the Cowboy Way." Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 10 Nov 1993 20:42:32 UT From: "Larry Beck" \ Organization: Grumman Data Systems-Bethpage NY Message-ID: <1993Nov10.204232.27285@gdstech.grumman.com> References: <19931029.065225.214@almaden.ibm.com> <2b5rii$r9s@meaddata.meaddata.com> \ Subject: Re: MS fact sheet on SGML [Lloyd Harding] | I agree. The concept of WYSIWYG is counter-productive if we hope to get | authors focused on content. [Gary Benson] | I agree, too, but this has been the basis of a philosophical (or mayber | better to say religious) debate here for a long time, and it is heating | up. The WYSIWYG proponents' latest arguments are roughly as follows: | "The presentation of this data requires a particular page appearance; | certain information should appear on a single page, with the facing | page containing an illustration which the text discusses. Writers must | now "write to fit the page", something they cannot do unless they are | at all times seeing the page as it will be in its final form". | | Slippery devils, arent't they? | | Indeed, the argument becomes even more robust, because it is claimed | that without prior knowledge of how much room the information will take | on the page, it is impossible for the writer to plan for translation | into other languages. This means that he must write the English text | so that about 20% of the page is left, permitting the French and German | text to fit. I agree also. I've always felt that we pay authors to author, not format. If you give a writer a tool that lets him play with format, that's just what he'll do. Totally a waste of time. It's more important that the author get the content right and let someone else worry about the format. I think the word processing guys are seeing a bit of a threat to they`re existence and are getting worried. They see products like ArborText and Author/Editor and are afraid they'll lose market share. So they come out with products like Intellitag (which kinda sucks) and try to push 'em as the greatest thing since sliced bread. LAB Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 10 Nov 1993 20:48:42 UT From: "Larry Beck" \ Organization: Grumman Data Systems-Bethpage NY Message-ID: <1993Nov10.204842.27564@gdstech.grumman.com> References: <2b8pcu$di1@pens-emh2.ncts.navy.mil> <2bbr9f$rur@elroy.jpl.nasa.gov> <199311081746.JAA18601@mail.netcom.com> Subject: Re: Has anyone gotten IADS to load? [Lori Snyder] | I am a contractor supporting the US Army. One of our companies' | functions is to maintain and enhance the IADS code. Once I learned of | the problem a few people have had when trying to load IADS, I had to go | through the appropriate channels before I could respond. | | Following is a response from the government point of contact for IADS: : | In the meantime, if you are working either for or with a government | agency to produce an electronic document using CALS-standard text and | graphics, please send me an email message at | spape@redstone-emh1.army.mil and include telephone/fax number. I will | send you the appropriate distribution form to receive installation | disks from the US Army Missile Command. How can you say that IADS will handle "CALS-standard text?" When I looked at this product The first thing that I say was that all names were restricted to eight characters. The "CALS SGML Declaration" provides for 32 character names. Does the next release of the product address this issue? LAB Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 10 Nov 1993 21:04:27 UT From: "C. M. Sperberg-McQueen" \ Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago, ADN Computer Center Message-ID: <93314.150427U35395@uicvm.uic.edu> References: <108456@bcsaic.boeing.com> Subject: Re: Can I "escape" delimiters in Attributes? To include both single and double quotes in an attribute value, just use entity references. Here's a demonstration file, which both Mark-It and sgmls say is all right. \ \ \ \ ]> \ \ \ \ I agree with Erik that the slight ugliness here is a very small price to pay for having so few magic characters in SGML. Using MSSCHAR for this purpose has the charm of the unexpected, but very little charm beyond that, IMHO. -- -C. M. Sperberg-McQueen ACH / ACL / ALLC Text Encoding Initiative University of Illinois at Chicago Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 10 Nov 1993 21:38:57 UT From: "C. M. Sperberg-McQueen" \ Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago, ADN Computer Center Message-ID: <93314.153857U35395@uicvm.uic.edu> References: <752860776snz@pira2.demon.co.uk> \ Subject: Re: Errors compiling TEI2.DTD with Author/Editor's mkrls [Peter Flynn] | 2. it gagged on SUBDOC YES 10 in the FEATURES declaration: | ... | so I changed it to SUBDOC NO for the moment. Is this another | outdatedness? No. It's just that mkrls doesn't support SUBDOC, so it won't accept an SGML declaration which says the document may use it. The TEI SGML declaration says SUBDOC is allowed, because the TEI does not forbid or recommend against its use. | 3. Then it gets as far as: | | curia% mkrls -S sgmldecl.tei tei2.dtd | Compiling tei2.dtd into tei2.rls. | The following elements are undefined: | ... [long list of things you do *not* want undefined...] If I had to guess, I would guess that either mkrls is not succeeding in finding the various external files the DTD is in (but then why didn't you get error messages?) or else perhaps that you forgot to indicate which base tag set you are using. See chapter 3 of the TEI Guidelines on the structure of the TEI DTDs for a discussion of how to select a given base tag set. Or just insert this into your doctype declaration: \ | Error in Document Type Declaration at offset 6781 of the input | stream, on line 170 of the document: Element used but not defined. | curia% This ought to be a warning, not an error message, I think: SGML specifically allows elements to be referred to but not defined (clause 11.2.4). -- -C. M. Sperberg-McQueen ACH / ACL / ALLC Text Encoding Initiative University of Illinois at Chicago Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 10 Nov 1993 21:39:31 UT From: Erik Naggum \ Message-ID: <19931110.018@sfo.naggum.no> References: <20@markj.win.net> \ <19931109.004@sfo.naggum.no> \ Subject: Re: Standard DTDs (was: Evaluating SGML) [ Apologies in advance for the length. I do not have time to shorten it. ] [Tom Gordon] | In this reply I just want to defend the *idea* of a standard, general | purpose DTD for articles and books. In my community, which is academic | computer science, (in particular artificial intelligence), LaTeX is the | de facto standard document exchange format. It is far from uncommon | for authors to work together on an article or book, using LaTeX and | electronic mail. It seems that you are just stressing my point, namely that communities not only should, but in fact will, develop common document applications. LaTeX came about because one man (Les Lamport) decided to build this system. It is great, it is free (and so is TeX, also one man's work), and it is so widespread as to be ubiquitous, but _only_ in the academic world. It is not a commercially supported product, and all the support tools I have seen (only a few) for LaTeX are also free and are mainly used in Academia. Publishers who accept LaTeX documents are usually in or around Academia, too, or they would much rather accept PostScript pages. I do not use LaTeX myself, so I do not know too much about it, but what I do know is that "LaTeX" is not an unambiguous term -- lots of local variations exist, and not infrequently, the latex.tex file has to be included for things to work properly. LaTeX is not a standard defined and agreed upon by an international community as an independent third party, but a tool offered to this community by its designer, and that continues to evolve and minor changes are communicated among those who use it. This is the "community spirit" that makes community-wide standards such a brilliant idea. However, my point is to argue that the whole wide world is not a single community with any common "community spirit", that when the system takes years to absorb desirable changes, deviations will supplant the standard, that when users are faced with hard-wired semantics and little or no ability to make the small changes that have made LaTeX so able to survive, we are _worse_ off with an international standard than if the same thing were just a commonly used tool in a (large) community. | But LaTeX, not SGML, remained the document exchange format of choice. | It may not be a de jure standard, but is what (most) people in my | community want and expect. Precisely! LaTeX is a community standard, and this is great (although not as great as if it were SGML :-), but whether it is de facto or de jure has no influence on this. Academicians tend to want more than de jure standards can give them, anyway. That is how the Internet and USENET became so popular. Now the U.S. has formally proposed that X.400 MHS use Internet-style addresses, too. Good ideas are used whether they are international standards or not, and the prestige and force behind international standards should be used for things that are enhanced by them, not by things that are hampered by them. Languages are typically good candidates to become standards, likewise protocols, connectors and interfaces, physical storage formats, etc. Things that can be mass-produced and that are not likely to be customizable beyond what the specification allows. For inherently customizable things, such as user applications, standards are just plain bad ideas. Look at OSI, and how convoluted all their standards at the application level have become. I contend that applications are hampered by being standardized. The market can handle applications, but standards should handle all the bits and pieces that go into them, so the prices can fall, repair can be much cheaper, etc. That is what happened when the U.S. car industry adopted standard nuts, bolts and screws instead of having engineers design their own for each new car model. A standard _car_, however, is not a good idea. Also keep in mind that the "International Standard" label tends to focus on what is useful _internationally_. Does ISO 12083 qualify? As far as I have seen, the AAP DTD's were barely acceptable as _American_ standards. | I agree completely with Erik that no DTD is suitable for every task, | but presumably a DTD with comparable expressiveness to LaTeX could be | as useful to the same community which now regularly uses LaTeX. Agreed, but you do not need an international standard to accomplish this, and what about the other communities? Remember that Academia is used to research tools, normally available for free within the community, and there is not going to be any "industry" growing up around free research tools. Admittedly, graduate students are turning to Word, WordPerfect, Framemaker, etc, to produce their theses, because LaTeX is so much harder to use. Of course, the advisors who allow that must not think very highly of their students work to let their work go down the drain instead of requiring an electronic document format searchable by their peers and the next generation of students. | The main reasons that neither the AAP DTDs nor SGML in general have | caught on in my community are, I believe: | | 1) The lack of a standard DTD comparable to LaTeX, and | 2) The lack of free and widely available and supported systems for | formatting and printing SGML documents. | | There are a few systems, like qwertz, which address point 2, but both | points have to be addressed before SGML stands a chance to displace | LaTeX. At the time when troff was king, there were several communities that used different macro packages. LaTeX is not at all the be-all and end-all of document systems, it just happens to be more widely used than others. The same can be said of WordPerfect in the general market, yet Emacs is a much more powerful editor than this puny little word processor. I disagree strongly with the requirement that things be "standard" and "free" in order to succeed. MS Windows is neither. Windows is technically inferior to an ant hill, and almost as full of bugs, yet it is out-selling the proverbial hotcakes, even in academic circles. I think your work with qwertz is a good idea, and I applaud it, but I am not so happy with the arguments that you propose for it. SGML cannot compete with LaTeX on LaTeX's terms and expect to win. For SGML to win, _more_ than what LaTeX provides must be accessible, and ready to use. The University of Oslo is now working on a project "UNIPUB" to aid production and demand-printing of academic literature using SGML, and LaTeX would not stand a chance competing on this ground. I think it is things like this that will bring SGML to the academic community, not LaTeX-vs-SGML fights. | Therefore, as an SGML fan, I hope that Erik is wrong about ISO 12083. But, don't you see? There is nothing in ISO 12083 that will magically turn it into a success. There is nothing in being an international standard that guarantees success, either. There is a continuous fight for SGML going on all over the place, and some places SGML wins, and others SGML loses to some proprietary format. I want to clip from an article posted to the ISO 10646 mailing list by Alain LaBonte (who will be angry that I omitted the acute accent in his name) to show you just how sad the case is. Alain has an idea about the portability of source code using rich character sets, and here is how he argues: This measure is not so revolutionary when one thinks that for text, street people are used to exchange WP documents in an user-unreadable format such as WordPerfect format, MS-Word format and so on. So why not for program texts? (Note: "street people" means "the man in the street", not the homeless.) No comment required. What I am most concerned about is that ISO 12083 will be viewed as _the_ SGML application, that everybody should use, and the demerits of having _one_ SGML application be an international standard are numerous and very significant. If ISO 12083 is any good, it should catch on without the ISO imprimatur. | One more thing: I implied above that there were indeed a few LaTeX | constructs I needed with no equivalent in ISO 12083. These are the | various kinds of "theorem environments" for definitions, theorems, | corollaries, etc. In such cases, my suggestion is to *extend* ISO | 12083 with custom elements for your application. This is much easier | than starting from scratch, and your documents will be fail to conform | to the standard only in minor and well-documented ways. ... which will break the blind interchange principle, and will force small communities to come up with their own conventions for breaking the standard. Presto! You have community standards for each community, and the value of ISO 12083 has been reduced to a resource from which people can pick and choose, rather than an actual standard. Quad erat demonstrandum. Best regards, \ -- Erik Naggum \ \ ISO 8879 SGML Chairman, SGML SIGhyper \ ISO 10744 HyTime "Memento, terrigena. Memento, vita brevis." ISO 10646 UCS Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 11 Nov 1993 00:07:10 UT From: "Yuri Rubinsky" \ Reply-To: mern@well.sf.ca.us Organization: SoftQuad Inc., Toronto, Canada Message-ID: <1993Nov11.000710.14606@sq.sq.com> Keywords: conference, agenda, SGML implementations, SGML issues Summary: agenda and detailed descriptions for SGML technical conference Subject: Schedule for SGML '93 This is the second part of the posting of the text version of the schedule part of the brochure which was published last month. The contact information has been repeated at the end just in case someone sees this message but didn't see the first one. Although the presentations portion is up-to-date as of today, there are more poster presentations than are listed here. All parts of this schedule are subject to change of course. Additional poster presentations are still welcome. CRANKING UP THE VOLUME ON THE QUIET REVOLUTION SGML '93 The Annual Conference of the SGML Technical Community December 6-9, 1993 Sheraton Boston Hotel and Towers Boston, Massachusetts USA Chair: Yuri Rubinsky, SoftQuad Co-Chairs: Tommie Usdin & Debbie Lapeyre, ATLIS Consulting Group Implementation of SGML systems - part art, part science - ranges from simple to difficult, from commonplace to revolutionary. The program listings in this brochure - the speakers, the poster sessions, the tutorials, and ancillary events - eloquently establish the scope and variety of issues and accomplishments. The SGML Conference series, grown now to include both Novice and Expert tracks, continues to reflect the SGML community back to itself, enabling the sharing of approaches, experiences and solutions. PRECONFERENCE TUTORIAL SUNDAY, DECEMBER 5, 1993 9:00 am - Noon SGML Database Migration Tutorial Dale Waldt, Research Institute of America, division of Thomson Professional Publishing and Brian Travis, Information Architects L.L.C 1:00 - 5:00 pm Just Enough SGML Tutorial Yuri Rubinsky and Marcy Thompson, SoftQuad, Tommie Usdin and Debbie Lapeyre, ATLIS Consulting 5:00 - 7:00 pm Registration 5:00 - 7:00 pm Reception Co-Sponsored by the GCA and the OmniMark Users Group --------------------------------------------------------------------- Monday, December 6, 1993 9:00 am Conference Overview Yuri Rubinsky, Conference Chair Vendor Welcome Tommie Usdin, Conference Co-Chair Poster Session Overview Debbie Lapeyre, Poster Session Chair 9:15 am "The SGML Year in Review" Yuri Rubinsky, Tommie Usdin and Debbie Lapeyre 9:45 am Keynote Address: "TEI Vision, Answers and Questions: SGML for the Rest of Us" Lou Burnard, Text Encoding Initiative 10:15 am - Break 10:30 am - Poster Session Noon - Lunch 1:15 pm Reports from the Front: ATA/AIA, CALS, CApH (Conventions for the Application of HyTime), Davenport Group, J2008 (Automotive), ISO 12083 (AAP), Pharmaceutical Industry, SGML/Open, etc. 2:15 pm "Multi-company SGML Application Standard Development Process" Bob Yencha, National Semiconductor, Patricia O'Sullivan, Intel Corporation, Jeff Barton, Texas Instruments, Tom Jeffery, Hitachi Micro Systems, Inc., Alfred Elkerbout, Philips Semiconductors 3:00 pm - Break 3:15 pm "Archetypal Early Adopters? Documentation of the Computer industry" Eve Maler, Digital Equipment Corporation, Eliot Kimber and Wayne Wohler, IBM Corporation, Beth Micksch, Intergraph, Jon Bosak, Novell 5:00 pm - Adjourn 8:00 pm - 10:00 pm International SGML Users' Group Meeting ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Tuesday, December 7, 1993 General Session 9:00 am "Real World Publishing with SGML" Terry Allen, Digital Media Group, O'Reilly & Associates, Inc. 9:45 am "HyTime Developments and Strategies" Dr. Charles Goldfarb, IBM 10:30 am - Break START OF NOVICE AND EXPERT TRACKS (Novice Track schedule listed first followed by schedule of Expert Track) NOVICE TRACK 10:45 am "Welcome to the Burning Issues" Ludo van Vooren and Eric Severson, Avalanche Development Co. 12:15 pm - Lunch 1:15 pm - Poster Session 2:30 pm - Break 2:45 pm "How to Save Time, Reduce Costs, Increase Performance, and Look Like a Hero Through SGML Documentation" Debbie Lapeyre, ATLIS Consulting Group 3:30 pm "SGML System Evaluation and Selection" Dale Waldt, Thomson Professional Publishing 4:15 pm "Looseleaf and Structured Text" Charlie Halpern-Hamu, InfoDesign Corporation; Michael Metz, Thomson Professional Publishing 5:15 pm - Adjourn Evening Session 7:00 pm Vendor Overview: Meet the Products -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Wednesday, December 8, 1993 NOVICE TRACK 9:00 am "Is There an Economical Way to SGML?" Irina Golfman, JIB Associates, and Gabriel Lanyi, Characters Corp. 9:45 am "SGML and the Technical Publications within Aerospatiale" H. Herbault and S. Deldon, Aerospatiale 10:30 am - Break 10:45 am "IEE Electronic Letters Project" Neil Bradley, Pindar Infotek 11:15 am "Building a Document Database with Sadlier's General Motors Language" Terrence P. Sadlier, General Motors 12:00 pm - Lunch 1:15 pm "Development Approaches in Implementing SGML Systems" John Dick, Intergraph Corporation 2:00 pm "The Whirlwind Guide to SGML Tools" Dianne Kennedy, Consultant (Invited) 2:45 pm - Break 3:00 pm - New Product Announcements (General Session) 3:45 pm - 9:00 pm - Product Table Top Demonstrations ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Thursday, December 9, 1993 NOVICE TRACK 9:00 am - Poster Session 10:30 am - Break 10:45 am "Harmonizing Multiple DTDs for Libraries of Information" Bob Barlow, Publishing Information Management 11:30 am "Database Models for Managing SGML" Pat Byrne, Xyvision, Inc. 12:15 pm "What Just Happened? Novice Question and Answer Session" 1:00 pm Lunch and Closing Keynote, Michael Sperberg-McQueen Text Encoding Initiative (General Session) 3:00pm - Adjourn 4:00 pm SGML Open General Membership Meeting/Cocktail Party ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Friday, December 10, 1993 9:00 am to 3:00 pm SGML Open Technical and Marketing Groups ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Tuesday, December 7, 1993 EXPERT TRACK (Novice Track schedule listed above) 10:45 am "HyTime: Today's Toolset" Dr. Charles Goldfarb, IBM 11:30 am "Charles Goldfarb, Please Come Home: SGML, the Law, and the Public Interest" Ina P. Schiff, attorney, and Allen H. Renear, Brown University 12:15 - Lunch 1:15 pm - Poster Session 2:30 pm - Break 2:45 pm "A New Semantic Delivery Language" Dave Hollander, Hewlett Packard 3:30 pm "XHELP: What? Why? How? Who?" Kent Summers, Electronic Book Technologies 4:00 pm "Digital Publications Standards Development: A Modular Approach" Horace Layton, CSC 4:30 pm "A Practical Introduction to SGML Document Transformation" David Sklar, Electronic Book Technologies 5:15 pm Adjourn Evening Session 7:00 pm SGML Transformers: Five Ways Pam Gennusa, Database Publishing Systems Limited --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Wednesday, December 8, 1993 9:00 am "Scribner's Writers on CD- ROM: From a Great Pile of Paper to SGML and Hypertext on a Platter" Harry I. Summerfield, Zandar Corporation and Anna Sebastianski, Macmillan New Media 9:45 am "The Attachment of Processing Information to SGML Data in Large Systems" Lloyd Harding, Mead Data Central 10:30 am - Break 10:45 am "ISO 12083 Announcement" Beth Micksch, Intergraph Corp. 11:15 am Reports from the SGML Open Technical Committees 12:00 noon - Lunch 1:15 pm "A Technical Look at Authoring in SGML" Paul Grosso, ArborText 1:45 pm "Implementing an Interactive Electronic Technical Manual" Geoffrey von Limbach and Bill Kirk, InfoAccess Inc. 2:15 pm "The Conversion of Legacy Technical Documents into Interactive Electronic Technical Manuals: A NAVAIR Phase II SBIR Status Report" Robert F. Fye, Timothy Billington, Aquidneck Management Associates, Ltd. 2:45 pm - Break 3:00 pm - New Product Announcements (General Session) 3:45 pm - 9:00 pm Product Table Top Demonstrations -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Thursday, December 9, 1993 EXPERT TRACK 10:45 am "Implementing SGML Structures in the Real World" Tim Bray, Open Text Corp. 11:30 am "User Requirements for SGML Data Management" Paula Angerstein, Texcel 12:15 pm "A Document Query Language for SGML Databases" Pang Ping Li, Bernd Nordhausen, Lim Jyh Jang, Desai Narasimhalu, Institute of Systems Science, National University of Singapore GENERAL SESSION 1:00 pm Lunch and Closing Keynote, Michael Sperberg-McQueen Text Encoding Initiative 3:00pm - Adjourn 4:00 pm SGML Open General Membership Meeting/Cocktail Party ------------------------------------------------------------------- Friday, December 10, 1993 9:00 am - 3:00 pm SGML Open Technical and Marketing Working Groups ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- DETAILED DESCRIPTIONS GENERAL PRESENTATIONS Sunday, December 5, 1993 "SGML Database Migration Tutorial" (9:00 am - 12:00 noon) Instructors: Dale Waldt, Data Development Manager, Research Institute of America, a division of Thomson Professional Publishing; Brian Travis, Information Architects L.L.C. The hardest part of implementing SGML is managing and executing the migration of a family of products to an SGML database. Not only does a DTD need to be written, but data must be converted, system tools developed and/or configured, publication applications developed, and users and developers trained. Each of these activities is a project in itself. A methodology for the overall migration will be provided as well as strategies for each of these critical activities. This tutorial will provide guidelines for successful completion of each activity and several case studies from different industry segments. Attendees should include managers and technical personnel who are considering migrating to an SGML publishing system. SGML design experience is useful but not necessary. "Just Enough Tutorial" (1:00 pm - 5:00 pm) Instructors: Yuri Rubinsky, President, SoftQuad; Marcy Thompson, Manager of Training, SoftQuad; Tommie Usdin, Consultant, ATLIS Consulting Group; Debbie Lapeyre, Consultant, ATLIS Consulting Group This four hour tutorial provides a basic overview of SGML, its concepts, terminology and current usage. It is recommended that all novices attend in order to get the most out of the conference. As the name implies, the tutorial will provide sufficient background so that a novice will be able to enjoy the rest of the conference, particularly sessions in the Novice Track. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Monday, December 6, 1993 "TEI: Vision, Answers and Questions: SGML for the Rest of Us" Lou Burnard, Oxford University Computing Services, European Editor, Text Encoding Initiative (9:45 am) After four years of toiling in the academic vineyards, the TEI has now begun publication of its "Guidelines" for the encoding of electronic texts, of all kinds, in every language. These "Guidelines" are intended to enable researchers in any discipline to interchange texts and datasets in machine readable form, independently of the software or hardware in use, and also independently of the particular application for which such electronic resources are used. They include tagsets for commonly occurring elements, for the bibliographic description of electronic texts and for highly specialized application areas, ranging from text-criticism to linguistics, transcribed speech, dictionaries and terminology. Amongst specific technical problems addressed are multiple hierarchies, hypertextual linkage, interpretative analyses and vagueness. These are all held together in one protean document type definition, which (it is claimed) can be extended simply and effectively to encode types of text as yet unidentified, for applications as yet unimagined. Burnard's presentation will try to substantiate these grand claims. It will also ask (and maybe answer) the rather more interesting question: why should the TEI Guidelines be of any interest outside the academic community? "Reports from the Front", Various Speakers (1:15 pm) The combined efforts of industry initiatives, voluntary standards activity, formal and loose consortia together channel vast energy into raising the level of SGML awareness and acceptance. This session, a mainstay of the SGML Conference series, presents succinct news and analysis from the automotive and aerospace industries, from CALS, the CaPH (Conventions for the Application of HyTime), Davenport, SGML Open and any others that may come along. "Multi-company SGML Application Standard Development Process", Bob Yencha, Senior Systems Analyst, National Semiconductor; Patricia O'Sullivan, Technical Literature Program Manager, Intel Corporation.; Jeff Barton, Information Systems Manager, Texas Instruments; Tom Jeffery, Principal Technical Writer, Hitachi Micro Systems Inc.; Alfred Elkerbout, Publishing Technical Consultant, Philips Semiconductors (2:15 pm) Five major corporations will talk about the unique approach they took to develop an industry SGML application standard. Operating as the Pinnacles Group, representatives from each of these companies will discuss the serial analysis approach they are using to create an electronics component industry SGML application standard for the exchange of technical information. Areas such as selling a joint development effort, logistics, pre-analysis of documentation, vendor selection, training, and standards organizations will be highlighted. "Archetypal Early Adopters? Documentation of the Computer Industry" Eve Maler, Principle Software Editor, Digital Equipment Corporation; Eliot Kimber, Staff Information Developer, and Wayne Wohler, Advisory Engineer, IBM; Beth Micksch, Senior Systems Consultant, Intergraph; Jon Bosak, Information Architect, Novell (3:15 pm) Yet another significant indication that SGML is here to stay, as major computer suppliers adopt it as part of their corporate documentation solutions. Leading computer suppliers are their own customers as they develop internal SGML-based systems to solve problems facing them in today's competitive business environment. In this session, a panel of companies will discuss technical methods they have incorporated in designing their SGML-based corporate documentation systems. Specific solutions and design concepts will be discussed. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Tuesday, December 7, 1993 General Session "Real World Publishing with SGML", Terry Allen, Editor, Digital Media Group, O'Reilly & Associates, Inc. (9:00 am) O'Reilly & Associates has used SGML as part of a new publishing system that can produce both print and on-line versions of its books on UNIX and the X Window System. This paper will review the place of SGML in this system, other tools required to make the system complete, and the problems with and limitations of SGML encountered during the project. "HyTime Developments and Strategies", Dr. Charles Goldfarb, Sr. Technical Staff Member, IBM (9:45 am) In this overview, Dr. Goldfarb chairs a panel devoted to making the key concepts of HyTime accessible to people with little or no experience in this crucial and exciting area. Through examples and descriptions of specific strategies, the session will highlight practical short-term ways to begin using HyTime. Novice Track "Welcome to the Burning Issues", Ludo Van Vooren, Director of Customer Solutions and Eric Severson, Executive Vice President, Avalanche Development Company (10:45 am) To bring novices up to speed on the hot topics of SGML implementation, this session will summarize the state of some SGML issues from a practical standpoint. The session provides an overview of hypertext and hypermedia conversion to SGML, SGML query languages, tables, graphics, math and equations, and much more. "How to Save Time, Reduce Costs, Increase Performance, and Look Like a Hero through SGML Documentation", Debbie Lapeyre, Consultant, ATLIS Consulting Group (2:45 pm) Just as the cobbler's children often go barefoot, most SGML (documentation) systems are inadequately documented. Lack of documentation leads to muddled development objectives, sloppy use of the system, increased maintenance and training costs, and frustrated users, maintainers, and managers. In this talk, the many documents that should be produced during the development and use of an SGML application will be discussed. For each, the uses, users, and content are outlined. "SGML System Evaluation and Selection", Dale Waldt, Data Development Manager, Research Institute of America, Division of Thomson Professional Publishing (3:30 pm) This presentation will provide a framework for analyzing and evaluating systems to be used when implementing an SGML database environment. This discussion will cover the following processes and how they relate specifically to SGML implementation: requirements analysis, system evaluation, implementation planning, and resource management. "Looseleaf and Structured Text", Charlie Halpern-Hamu, SGML Systems Analyst, InfoDesign Corporation and Michael Metz, Thomson Professional Publishing (4:15 pm) Some documents are published looseleaf so that when the document is revised, only the pages that have changed need to be reissued. For looseleaf publishing, pagination is important information that needs to be tracked between revisions. Keeping track of page breaks can pose both philosophical and practical difficulties in an SGML environment. This presentation will discuss the need for looseleaf, problems with tracking pagination, and several solutions. Expert Track "HyTime: Today's ToolSet", Dr. Charles Goldfarb, Sr. Technical Staff Member, IBM. (10:45 am) This expert HyTime session acts as the technical foundation for the general session which precedes it, focussing on the technical aspects of getting going with available and newly-announced HyTime tools. "Charles Goldfarb, Please Come Home: SGML, the Law, and the Public Interest" Ina P. Schiff, attorney, and Allen H. Renear, Brown University (11:30 am) SGML originated from Charles Goldfarb's efforts to develop a legal research and writing support system, but, with one notable exception, the legal community has taken little notice of it. Schiff and Renear will discuss their views that SGML represents the future of legal research, writing, and litigation support systems. SGML offers significant opportunities for lawyers to increase productivity while containing costs; to create and maintain competitive advantage for law firms; and to increase public access to high-quality legal representation. Other text processing systems merely emulate typewriters; maintain traditional partner-associate-paralegal- secretary working units; and employ a narrow, production-oriented view of document development. By its powerful data organization capabilities, SGML empowers lawyers to research and acquire information; to accumulate it in retrieveable and useful form; to recycle research, other information, and their own work product; and to provide better service to clients. Equally importantly, personal productivity enhancements made possible by SGML enable lawyers and law firms to meet client demands for increased productivity and cost controls. Finally, SGML provides an opportunity to bring computerized legal research and and access to judicial information within the economic reach of average citizens and public interest groups. "A New Semantic Delivery Language", Dave Hollander, Engineer/ Scientist, Hewlett Packard (2:45 pm) A new Semantic Delivery Language (SDL) has been developed to address source inconsistency, duplicated effort and data interchange problems in online information delivery. The delivery language is defined by a DTD. The language uses generalized presentation-oriented markup and excludes typical SGML features that may prevent performance-oriented online delivery systems from using SGML directly as the information distribution format. By extending the application of SGML to online information delivery, the benefits of protecting and leveraging investment in published online documents, online delivery programs, and production tools can be seen. "Xhelp: a Standard Online Help Solution for the X Platform", Kent Summers, Director, Electronic Book Technologies (3:30 pm) Many different solutions to a single problem - online application support - has given rise to unnecessary and avoidable expenses across the X computing environment. A standard online help approach which is platform-, application-, and document-independent provides important benefits to Unix system providers, independent software vendors,and end-user alike. This presentation will cover the Xhelp architecture and how it relates to SGML. "Digital Publications Standards Development: A Modular Approach", Horace Layton, Computer Sciences Corporation (4:00 pm) The U.S. Army Publications and Printing Command (USAPPC) is developing a military standard that will allow the preparation and delivery of technical information in digital form. USAPPC's effort will support major Department of Defense (DOD) and Army developmental efforts designed to enhance the combat soldiers' performance by providing information required for mission performance in digital form. The underlying concept of the USAPPC effort is the structuring of technical information into functional modules that will allow electronic access to specific pieces of information rather than to complete technical manuals or field manuals. "A Practical Introduction to SGML Document Transformation", David Sklar, Senior GUI Software Administration, Electronic Book Technologies (4:30 pm) The GLTP specification, part of the emerging DSSSL standard, has been discussed in recent conferences only in a theoretical manner, largely because no GLTP system exists at this time. Mr. Sklar is working on a demo GLTP engine that allows one to create small GLTP applications on any PC or UNIX workstation. This presentation will demonstrate the utility of document transformations, show how transformations can be performed with products that are already available, and demonstrate the use of his demo GLTP engine. Wednesday, December 8, 1993 Novice Track "Is There an Economical Way To SGML?", Irina Golfman, Principal, JIB Associates and Gabriel Lanyi, President, Characters Corporation (9:00 am) This presentation will explore the issues that are encountered when a small to midsize company makes the decision to implement an SGML based publishing system. The initial implementation of this "economical" solution involves the conversion of the entire user documentation of the Foxboro Company. "SGML and the Technical Publications within Aerospatiale", H. Herbault and S. Deldon, Aerospatiale (9:45 am) The Aircraft division of Aerospatiale has been involved for five years in the process of standardization for electronic exchange of technical publications. Activities have been launched to define standards, to produce data, and to help airline companies use this data. This presentation will describe the reasons and impacts of choosing SGML, the problems of the introduction of SGML in the production process for technical publications and the solutions adopted, the consequences of the delivery of SGML documents to the airline companies and how Aerospatiale fulfil airlines requirements. "IEE Electronic Letters Project", Neil Bradley, Technical Manager, Pindar Infotek (10:45 am) This presentation will discuss the IEE Electronic Letters project that involves the creation of both an electronic document and a printed journal from typewritten source material. Drawings and complex tables are scanned at 800 dpi for use in the Journal, and then reduced to 300 dpi and 100 dpi for electronic publishing purposes. Math formulae are coded to the TeX format for the remaining text, OCR systems and enhancement software are utilized to produce a "raw" data file, which is then edited and coded to the SGML standard. The electronic data file is delivered to the customer via Internet. "Building a Document Database with Sadlier's General Motors Language", Terrence P. Sadlier, Technical Manager, System Engineering, General Motors (11:15 am) For many of General Motors technical publications, SGML is the corporate Data Exchange Standard. With the absence of a commercially available industrial strength document database, GM built its own in 1989. For GM, SGML facilitates the integration of tools for authoring composition and distribution with GM's DocuBase system. This presentation will discuss the architecture implemented at GM to support a wide variety of document types. DocuBase allows for the sharing of data authored by many users. Individual documents are constructed by merging an authors copy of data objects contributed by other Subject Experts. The system allows for inclusion of data without taking ownership or replicating data. Data created by an author and merged into a document is merely a live link or pointer to that data. As Subject Experts update their data objects, documents which include live links to data objects automatically reflect the latest changes. The strength of the system is that it allows for the creation or collaborative works by managing documents as a collection of objects supporting the structure defined by an applications DTD. "Development Approaches in Implementing SGML Systems", John Dick, Senior Staff Consultant, Intergraph Corporation (1:15 pm) This session will explore different development approaches that have been used in implementing real-time SGML-based systems. Definition and requirements of the individual systems will be presented, and development approaches which were utilized to provide required system functionality will be detailed. Specific problems which will be discussed include: interchange requirements between customers and suppliers, security and protection of information, multiple platform requirements and controlling the process based on SGML data. System requirements such as foreign language and sharing of SGML-tagged data among a large group of users will also be included in the discussion. "The Whirlwind Guide to SGML Tools", Dianne Kennedy, Consultant (2:00 pm) This presentation will discuss the SGML tools needed to complete document analysis, DTD writing, translation, retrofitting, editing, down translation, and page layout. Expert Track "Scribner's Writers on CD-ROM: From A Great Pile of Paper to SGML and Hypertext on a Platter", Harry I. Summerfield, Ph.D., President, ZANDAR Corporation and Anna Sebastianski, Director of Production, Macmillan New Media (9:00 am) SGML is not intended to be a styling, publishing tool, but the close relationship between structural tagging of data and traditional document formatting makes SGML a kind of universal solvent for the publishing industry. Scribner's Writers is a well established library reference known to most freshman English students as the means to easy familiarity with writers of the Western World from Aristotle to Maya Angeleau. The reference book has long existed in heavy volume, hard copy, but, given the relatively short run of the massive work, a new edition in hard copy was not seen as a sustainable market product. The decision was made to create an electronic book. This presentation will discuss that process and the advantages that using SGML allowed. "The Attachment of Processing Information to SGML Data in Large Systems", Lloyd Harding, Architect, Mead Data Central (9:45 pm) Large data fabrication and delivery systems place specific requirements on the method and timing of the attachment of processing information. This presentation provides an overview of large data processing system features and requirements, including a survey of SGML concepts (Markup Standardization, the Architectural Form, Link, FOSI, and DSSSL) as they apply to the attachment of processing information in large scale systems. An architecture for the attachment of processing information within large fabrication systems is proposed. Finally, future directions are suggested in the areas of standardization and application development useful for large systems. "ISO 12083 Announcement", Beth Micksch, Senior Systems Consultant, Intergraph (10:45 am) The new ISO 12083 standard replaces ANSI Z.39.59 (AAP/Electronic Manuscript Preparation and Markup). The standard was significantly improved to include new functionality and enhanced usability. This presentation will include a discussion of the standard's scope and objectives, a description of the standard's contents, and application examples. "A Technical Look at Authoring in SGML", Paul Grosso, V.P. of Technology, ArborText (1:15 pm) This presentation will discuss what it means to author in SGML, how one measures an SGML editor's conformance to 8879, how an SGML authoring system handles non-ESIS constructs such as comments, ignored marked sections, and internal general text entities. It will also discuss what it means to have a non-ASCII interface for editing an SGML document and what kinds of interfaces are possible/appropriate to marked sections,s hortrefs, subdocs, and concur. "Implementing an Interactive Electronic Technical Manual", Geoff Limbach, Systems Engineer, and Bill Kirk, Engineer, InfoAccess (1:45 pm) Recently, in conjunction with the David Taylor Research Center (DTRC), InfoAccess implemented an Interactive Electronic Technical Manual (IETM). This implementation was based on a CALS DTD that incorporated IETMDB and HyTime extensions. While this was a prototype project, production software was used for the implementation. This presentation will explain the IETMDB and HyTime tag extensions used in the project and indicate how these tags were implemented in accordance with the IETM standards (MIL-M-87268). The resulting interactive technical document will be demonstrated. "The Conversion of Legacy Technical Documents into Interactive Electronic Technical Manuals: A NAVAIR Phase II SBIR Status Report", Robert F. Fye, V.P. and General Manager, and Tim Billington, Senior Information Engineer, Aquidneck Management Associates, Ltd. (2:15 pm) Aquidneck Management Associates (AMA) per award of a second phase Small Business Innovative Research (SBIR) contract is developing processes and procedures for the transition of legacy technical manuals into Interactive Electronic Technical Manuals (IETMs). This presentation will address the proliferation of SGML-based IETM tools readily available to render sequential SGML data streams, as opposed to the lack of IETM software required to render an IETM SGML-logic-enhanced data stream. The paper will also address legacy document conversion processes, the use of SGML databases, lessons learned, and software integration required. Thursday, December 9, 1993 Novice Track "Harmonizing Multiple DTDs for Libraries of Information", Bob Barlow, Publishing Information Management (10:45 am) Often users require SGML applications for multiple types of documents which make up their "libraries" of information. In the data analysis one not only creates an SGML Tagset to support the information, but must determine "how many DTDs do I need" and "how do I harmonize these DTDs?" This session will discuss those issues, giving guidelines and pointers on how to make those decisions. "Database Models for Managing SGML", Pat Byrne, Director of Marketing, Xyvision, Inc. (11:30 am) This presentation will discuss the different ways that one can work with SGML in a document database. Four different models for managing SGML document content will be compared, their advantages and disadvantages covered. Expert Track "Implementing SGML Structures In the Real World", Tim Bray, Senior V.P., Open Text Corporation (10:45 am) SGML markup in documents describes a structure like that of a hierarchical tree, and with the addition of new technologies like HyTime, a network of hyperlinks. This structure, which is further complicated by the use of entities, has proven to be very good at modelling the kinds of structures we want to work with in real-world documents. Unfortunately, in the real world, computer memory is linear; that is to say, all you can store or retrieve directly is a bunch of bytes in a row. This presentation will introduce this problem and analyze what should be concluded from the solution. Some important issues are openness of access, ability to support upcoming standards like DSSSL and HyQ, database problems like update and versioning, and maintainability. The talk will then examine a few approaches that have been proposed and actually used, and try to characterize their relative strengths and weaknesses. The goal is to establish a common set of principles on which to talk about different approaches for fitting SGML into ordinary computer systems. "User Requirements for SGML Data Management", Paula Angerstein, Director of Product Development, Texcel (11:30 am) In business organizations today, efforts to improve quality and reduce costs focus on ways to track and share information, where much of this information is created and used in the form of documents. SGML provides the mechanism to exploit the richness of information represented by a document, making document-oriented information available for automated processing in much the same way as traditional "data" is processed. This session explores the user requirements for document oriented services that can be provided around an SGML-based information repository. "A Document Query Language for SGML Databases", Pang Ping Li, Bernd Nordhausen, Lim Jyh Jang, Desai Narasimhalu, Institute of Systems Science, National University of Singapore (12:15 pm) As SGML is going beyond the original goal of mere document interchange, users demand sophisticated support for the maintenance of SGML documents. One of the fundamental parts for storage of a large collection of documents is an SGML database. Such a database must allow for the efficient storage and retrieval of documents and parts of them. This presentation will discuss a Document Query Language (DQL) that is being developed to support the goal of efficient retrieval. The primary strength of DQL is the seamless integration of structural and free text queries. Poster Sessions from the Published Brochure: "Producing a CALS-Compliant Technical Mannual", Karen Hall, RJO Enterprises "SGML Support for Software Reuse", John Shockro, CEA, Inc. "Digital Signatures Using SGML", Bernd Nordhausen, Che Yeow Meng, Roland Yeo, Daneel Pang Swee Chee, National Computer Board of Sinapore "How to Make Your Regular DTDs ICADD-Compatible", David Slocombe, SoftQuad "HyTime Application at the University of MA at Lowell", Lloyd Rutledge "Ensuring a Successful Transition to SGML", Robert Glushko, Passage Systems "Creating Modular SGML Structures", Bryan Caporlette, Passage Systems "Integrating SGML Into On-Line Component Information Delivery", Anne Price Schaller, and Javier Romeu, INFO Enterprises "The Commercialization of SGML", Steve Kiser, XSoft "Converting Tables to SGML", Brian Travis, Information Architects L.L.C. "Use of SGML to Model Semiconductor Documents", Pinnacles Group "Using SGML to Address the 'Real' Problems in Electronic Publishing", Barry Schaeffer, Information Strategies, Inc. "From SGML to Acrobat Using Shrink-Wrapped Tools", Sam Hunting, Boston Computer Society Magazine "Translation of Files into an Object Network and the Export of SGML Files from the Object Oriented Editing Environment", M. Wiebke Moehr and Lother Rostek, GMD-IPSI "Tag Set for On-Line Research", K. Elisabeth Brooke Jackson, Consultant "Data Conversion Mappings", David Silverman, Data Conversion Laboratory "Pre-Fab Documents: Modularization in DTD Design", Michael Hahn, ATLIS Consulting Group "A document Manipulation Sytem Based on Natural Semantics", Dennis S. Arnon, Xerox PARC, Isabelle Attali, INRIA; and Paul Frachi-Zammerracci, University of Nice "Why Object Oriented Database Technology Is/Isn't Good for SGML Data Management", Paula Angerstein, Texcel "Active Information Sharing Systems (AISS) SGML Database API", Fujitsu (Japan),Institute of Systems Science (Singapore), and Information Technology Institute (Singapore) "AISS Document Query API (DQL)", Fujitsu and Institute of Science Systems "AISS Document Formatting API", Fujitsu and NIHON UNITEC. "SGML and Natural Language Text Processing of Wire Service Articles", John D. Burger, MITRE Corporation "Communicating Table Structures Using Wordprocessor Ruler Lines", Gary Benson, Fluke Corporation REGISTRATION INFORMATION Hotel Information The Sheraton Boston Hotel and Towers is located at the Prudential Center near Boston's scenic and historic Back Bay neighborhood and the shopping extravaganza of Copley Place. There are many fine restaurants within walking distance of the hotel as well as several in the Sheraton. The hotel is equipped with modern amenities such as a pool, health club, voice mail messaging, 24-hour room service, video express check-out, valet and laundry service, and currency exchange. The Graphic Communications Association has negotiated a special conference rate of $90 single/$118 double. To make reservations, call the hotel directly at (617) 236-2000 and identify yourself as a GCA SGML '93 conference registrant no later than November 16, 1993 to be eligible for the special rate. After this date reservations can be made only on a space/available basis. To Register Complete the registration form and return to GCA. Make necessary reservations with the hotel. All fees, check and/or credit card information must accompany registration. Mail registration and payment to GCA, 100 Daingerfield Rd., Alexandria, VA 22314-2888. E-mail: mern@well.sf.ca.us Phone (703) 519-8162 or Fax (703) 548-2867 with credit card information. To cancel: For full or partial refund, cancellations must be received in writing or by fax (no e-mail cancellation will be accepted) before noon on November 23, 1993. I am attending: ____ Just Enough SGML Tutorial Dec. 5, 1993 ____ SGML Database Migration Tutorial Dec. 5, 1993 Registration fee one tutorial: ___ GCA member discount $50. ___ Nonmember $85. Registration fee both tutorials: ___ GCA member $90 ___ Nonmember $160 SGML '93 Conference Registration ___ GCA member discount $590 ___ Nonmember $795 ___ Educatnl Institution 40% Discount (of conference nonmbr rate) $477 ___ Data enclosed detailing special needs for disabled attendee Organization Type: ___ CG-Corporate Graphic Services ___ GE-Graphic Educational Inst. ___ IM-Industry Media ___ ME-Manufacturer/Equipment ___ MM-Manufacturer/Material ___ MS-Manufacturer/Systems & Services ___ OS-Overseas Firm ___ PB-Publisher ___ PT-Printer ___ RP-Reference Publisher ___ Other______________ Indicate name as it will appear on badge: Name:_______________________________________________________ Title:_______________________________________________________ Company/Institution:_________________________________________ Address:_____________________________________________________ City:____________________________State:______________________ Postal Code:______________ Country:__________________________ Area Code/Phone:______________________ Date:_________________ Billing Information: ___ Check enclosed (Make checks payable to Graphic Communications Association) (If form is faxed or e-mailed, registration will not be processed until payment is received, with credit card information registration will be processed immediately) ___ Credit Card: ___ Visa ___ Mastercard ___ AmEx Card Number:________________________ Expiration Date:_______ Signature:__________________________________________________ Graphic Communications Association 100 Daingerfield Rd. Alexandria VA 22314-2888 FOR MORE INFORMATION CALL GCA (703) 519-8160! ICO93D1 --------------------------------------------------------------------- Yuri Rubinsky +1 416 239-4801 President, SoftQuad Inc. (800) 387-2777 (from US only) Chairman, SGML '93 uucp: {uunet,utzoo}!sq!yuri Suite 810 56 Aberfoyle Crescent Internet: yuri@sq.com Toronto, Ontario, Canada M8X 2W4 Fax: +1 416 239-7105 Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 11 Nov 1993 08:57:22 UT From: "Tom Gordon" \ Organization: German National Research Center for Computer Science (GMD) Message-ID: \ References: <20@markj.win.net> \ <19931109.004@sfo.naggum.no> \ <19931110.018@sfo.naggum.no> Subject: Re: Standard DTDs (was: Evaluating SGML) Just a couple of follow-up points to Erik Naggum's reply to my message about the ISO 12083 DTDs: 1. I actually agree strongly that one should be very careful before enacting an international standard. My main experience here is in the area of programming languages. The lesson I've learned is that a language is ripe for de jure standarization by some standards body like ISO *only* after it has become a widely accepted de facto standard. Positive examples include ANSI C and IEEE Scheme. Negative examples include, above all, Ada. A de facto standard has proven its value. A de jure standard which is *only* a de jure standard has been approved only by the standards committee, but not yet by its intended users community. 2. Erik writes that "SGML cannot compete with LaTeX on LaTeX's terms and expect to win." Agreed, but we can agree, I suppose, that an SGML-based functional equivalent to LaTeX offers significant advantages, such as (text) editor, company and formatter independence. I do not really care so much whether the DTD which competes successfully with LaTeX is an ISO standard or not. I would just like to see *some* DTD comparable to LaTeX become widely used by *my* community. The question is, which one? How does one get the ball rolling? Starting at the top, with an ISO standard, instead of from the initiative of users, is surely not the *best* way to proceed, but it is arguably better than not proceeding at all. 3. I am not in favor of the "blind interchange principle". Again, I would encourage users, or groups of users, to modify and extend ISO 12083 to suit their needs. There are precedents for this. Just about every producer of a compiler for some standard programming language or operating system offers their own extensions. That's it for now. Tom Gordon -- Dr. Thomas F. Gordon GMD, FIT-KI; Schloss Birlinghoven 53757 Sankt Augustin / Germany email: thomas.gordon@gmd.de; phone: (+49 2241) 14-2665 Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 11 Nov 1993 10:01:36 UT From: "Peter Flynn" \ Organization: University College, Cork Message-ID: \ References: <93314.150427U35395@uicvm.uic.edu> Subject: Re: Can I "escape" delimiters in Attributes [C. M. Sperberg-McQueen] | To include both single and double quotes in an attribute value, just | use entity references. Here's a demonstration file, which both Mark-It | and sgmls say is all right. | | \ | \ | \ | \ | ]> | \ | \ | \ | \ | Tut, tut, Mike. This is a little naughty, I think :-) �Whatever happened to logical markup: this is all visual stuff here. Try something more like This value\'s got \safe\ spelling ///Peter Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 11 Nov 1993 10:05:22 UT From: "Peter Flynn" \ Organization: University College, Cork Message-ID: \ References: <19931110.113336.247@almaden.ibm.com> Subject: Re: Errors compiling TEI2.DTD with Author/E I should point out that my recent post about the TEI DTD was not intended as a gripe about Author/Editor or mkrls, but a query about the P2 DTD code. [Eliot Kimber] [SUBDOC] | No, this is a documented restriction of Author/Editor. I wish it | wasn't, now that we've seen the light about SUBDOC. SQ tell me this is now fixed in the latest version, which is what I thought I had, but I was wrong. [Undefined elements] | I've found that mkrls is very picky and won't build if you either have | undeclared elements or elements that are declared but not used in any | content models. Mkrls is also very unsporting about & content models. I've found that it certainly complains about them but it hadn't so far refused to build a rules file because of elements declared but not used. I would tend to agree that if elements are undeclared, then the DTD should not compile, though. | I would like to see a version of mkrls that is a little more forgiving | and a little friendlier. I'd also like SUBDOC support under A/E. Friendlier, certainly. ///Peter Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 11 Nov 1993 10:16:16 UT From: "Peter Flynn" \ Organization: University College, Cork Message-ID: \ References: <93314.153857U35395@uicvm.uic.edu> Subject: Re: Errors compiling TEI2.DTD with Author/E [Peter Flynn] | curia% mkrls -S sgmldecl.tei tei2.dtd | Compiling tei2.dtd into tei2.rls. | The following elements are undefined: | ... [long list of things you do *not* want undefined...] [C. M. Sperberg-McQueen] | If I had to guess, I would guess that either mkrls is not succeeding in | finding the various external files the DTD is in (but then why didn't | you get error messages?) SQ's support suggested this as a possibility. I know I had serious problems with P1 in that the external files were referenced differently in the DTD code in respect of upper- and lowercase. However, SQ also say they didn't get this error from the version on ifi.uio.no (mine came from sgml1.ex.ac.uk): are there variants around? | or else perhaps that you forgot to indicate which base tag set you are | using. See chapter 3 of the TEI Guidelines on the structure of the TEI | DTDs for a discussion of how to select a given base tag set. Or just | insert this into your doctype declaration: | | \ I'd better re-read the documentation... [Peter Flynn] | Error in Document Type Declaration at offset 6781 of the input stream, | on line 170 of the document: Element used but not defined. | curia% [C. M. Sperberg-McQueen] | This ought to be a warning, not an error message, I think: SGML | specifically allows elements to be referred to but not defined (clause | 11.2.4). I know it permits it, but that is a theoretical problem. A/E is a practical application, and my feeling is that mkrls is right to reject the DTD on this basis, otherwise users would be left with a partial DTD. ///Peter Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 11 Nov 1993 10:18:07 UT From: "Francis Cave" \ Organization: Pira International Message-ID: <753013087snz@pira2.demon.co.uk> References: <93314.150427U35395@uicvm.uic.edu> Subject: Re: Can I "escape" delimiters in Attributes? [C. M. Sperberg-McQueen] | To include both single and double quotes in an attribute value, just | use entity references. Here's a demonstration file, which both Mark-It | and sgmls say is all right. | | \ | \ | \ | \ | ]> | \ | \ | \ | \ My understanding is that this won't work, as the replacement text of any entity with replacement text " other than a character entity will be treated as parsable data, not CDATA, and so will in this context will be recognized as LIT. The only way is to have as replacement text something that isn't " but will be presented by the application as ". -- Francis Cave Pira International Randalls Road Leatherhead KT22 7RU United Kingdom Tel +44 372 376161 Fax +44 376 377526 email cave@pira2.demon.co.uk Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 11 Nov 1993 10:27:49 UT From: "Peter Flynn" \ Organization: University College, Cork Message-ID: \ References: <108667@bcsaic.boeing.com> Subject: Re: SGML '93 Conference Information [Peter Flynn] | How serious is Boeing about SGML? The people in your office here seem | to take it very seriously. [Jann VanOver] | So are the people from THERE going to SGML '93? Will you give them my | name so they can forward their trip reports to me? No, I didn't say that. All I know is that in occasional discussions with them, there has been support for the concept of using SGML. I may have been unintentionally misled: I was under the impression that Boeing was already a heavy user of SGML. | Boeing is serious about supporting its customers. And a big part of | that seriousness is keeping costs down. Part of keeping costs down is | to reduce unnecessary travel. Do you see where I'm going with this? | When it's a choice between cutting travel budget and laying people off, | I guess I prefer a tighter travel budget. Sure, I wasn't trying to imply otherwise. I guess I was just overreacting a little: here we tend to assume American companies can afford this kind of thing without too much trouble. It's different with an academic budget: this trip had to be planned a year in advance because it's extremely expensive (nearly $500) and it's still going to cost me a lot of my own money for the extra days I have to stay to make up to the 7-day restriction on the airfare. ///Peter Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 11 Nov 1993 12:50:02 UT From: "James Clark" \ Organization: None, London, England Message-ID: \ References: <93314.150427U35395@uicvm.uic.edu> <753013087snz@pira2.demon.co.uk> Subject: Re: Can I "escape" delimiters in Attributes? [C. M. Sperberg-McQueen] | To include both single and double quotes in an attribute value, just | use entity references. Here's a demonstration file, which both Mark-It | and sgmls say is all right. | | \ | \ | \ | \ | ]> | \ | \ | \ | \ | [Francis Cave] | My understanding is that this won't work, as the replacement text of | any entity with replacement text " other than a character entity will | be treated as parsable data, not CDATA, and so will in this context | will be recognized as LIT. The only way is to have as replacement text | something that isn't " but will be presented by the application as ". No. See clause 9.1: Markup that would terminate replaceable character data is not recognized in an entity that was referenced from within the same replaceable character data. Attribute value literals contain replaceable character data (production 34). James Clark jjc@jclark.com Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 11 Nov 1993 13:44:42 UT From: "Larry Beck" \ Organization: Grumman Data Systems-Bethpage NY Message-ID: <1993Nov11.134442.25810@gdstech.grumman.com> References: <19931109.004@sfo.naggum.no> \ <19931110.018@sfo.naggum.no> Subject: Re: Standard DTDs (was: Evaluating SGML) [Erik Naggum] | What I am most concerned about is that ISO 12083 will be viewed as | _the_ SGML application that everybody should use, and the demerits of | having _one_ SGML application be an international standard are numerous | and very significant. If ISO 12083 is any good, it should catch on | without the ISO imprimatur. | | ... which will break the blind interchange principle, and will force | small communities to come up with their own conventions for breaking | the standard. Presto! You have community standards for each | community, and the value of ISO 12083 has been reduced to a resource | from which people can pick and choose, rather than an actual standard. | Quad erat demonstrandum. You're absolutely right. I think ISO blew it big time when agreeing to to accept the AAP stuff as an international standard. At the most, they should have been made a part of a Technical Report (Techniques for using SGML). I'm curious to know if the US and UK voted in favor of this standard. If they did, they should've known better. What very well could happen is what's happening in the US with the CALS standards (MIL-M-28001). It's being cited all over the place and in many cases it doesn't apply. I can see this happening with ISO 12083. I wonder if there's a way to get an ISO standard withdrawn?? LAB Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 11 Nov 1993 14:33:00 UT From: "Hans Granqvist" \ Organization: VolvoData Message-ID: \ Subject: FAQ? Basic questions follow... (Not having been able to find an FAQ for comp.text.sgml I venture to ask these very basic questions. Please bear with me...) I have recently begun looking into this thing called SGML by reading the Text Encoding Initiative's `Gentle Guide To SGML' at sgml1.ex.ac.uk (filename tei/p2/drafts/p2sg.doc) and feel I have got the basic ideas straight. Nonetheless, a few things puzzle me. First things first, the reason for my looking at SGML in the first place is that the current bulk of our documentation is in the traditional paper format (MS Word on Mac) and that has semi-sufficed up until now when we are in the process of really rethinking our entire documentation line, as it were. Not only do we want a coherent look and feel of the documentation (we get that already by using predefined formats in Word) but also a superordinate semantical checking of documents (`Is this a legal User's Guide? Does it contain all the necessary sections?' etc) In the future, we would like, in an ideal world, to be able to maintain a `documentation server' where customers could connect their `browsers' and always be sure to find the most current info. One demand that must be fulfilled is that they should be able to browse using only a simple text-terminal (as well as a graphical one, of cours), this despite the fact that the documentation contains numerous pictures and tables. (Naturally, it would not be possible to view the pictures on a text terminal but the underlying software should be `smart' enough to filter these things out.) And then there is SGML, which, to me, albeit a novice, is no more than some souped-up TeX, and there is that ever-present problem of graphics in TeX that I have encountered: `How do I get my pictures into a marked-up text document?' So there we are, the main core problem being the following: How do we convert our existing documents into some SGML format? Is it at all feasible to think of SGML? What are the options? The writers are the programmers and must be able to use a WYSIWYG input machine, everything else, as they say, sucks. We have some Macs which would be nice to continue to use, but Unix-based software would be considered too. What `front-ends' are there? For the next step, what would be needed for the `hyper text' thing of a totally electronical environment (the `documentation server' above)? Any help/pointers greatly appreciated -- Hans Granqvist, hansg@vd.volvo.se, VOL.VD.HANSG quam maximum credula postero Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 11 Nov 1993 16:29:33 UT From: "Keith McAlpine" \ Organization: Aston University (Comp Sci) Message-ID: <1993Nov11.162933.5112@aston.ac.uk> Subject: PD SGML Parser Hello. I'm looking for a PD SGML parser for my PhD research on collaborative writing. Does anybody know where I can FTP one from to run on SUN Sparcstations? Cheers Keith McAlpine (mcalpink@cs.aston.ac.uk) Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 11 Nov 1993 16:44:09 UT From: "Robin Cover" \ Organization: UT Arlington Message-ID: \ Subject: SUBDOC and (SGMLS) ESIS I think I'm having trouble understanding details of SGML subdocument, or ESIS, or perhaps both. SGMLS seems to output a different result, depending upon whether a subdocument is called using a general entity reference or whether it's called using a general entity name as an attribute value. (The alternative methods are described in Goldfarb \Handbook</>, page 90.) Using the former alternative, SGMLS outputs the ESIS (?) of the subdocument when parsing the SGML document entity, while it does not (?) using the second alternative. Anyone who wants to supply a bit of tutorial on SUBDOC beyond what's found in Goldfarb 89-90 (Eliot?) will be counted blessed. Thanks in advance. Robin </message> <message id="<199311111914.LAA01206@netcomsv.netcom.com>" date="2962033771"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 11 Nov 1993 19:09:31 UT From: Chet Ensign \<DOCCOE@IBIVM.IBMMAIL.COM> Message-ID: <199311111914.LAA01206@netcomsv.netcom.com> References: <9310281443.AA19372@netcomsv.netcom.com> <19931029.065225.214@almaden.ibm.com> <2b5rii$r9s@meaddata.meaddata.com> \<CG6Lrq.8Es@tc.fluke.COM> <19931109.064032.489@almaden.ibm.com> Subject: MS fact sheet on SGML [Eliot Kimber] | At the risk of sparking a Jihad, I will claim that this argument is | entirely specious because it assumes that only a human can create such | a presentation... Jihad, yes! I love it. Well, to have a Jihad, you've got to have an infidel, so why don't I volunteer. Not that I disagree with a bit of what's been writ, which I'll summarize. To whit: * Arguing that authors need to "see the page" in order to write makes no sense once you replace the axiom "writers create pages" with the new axiom "writers create information." * Pages (or panels, pop-ups or, for that matter, paper airplanes) can be deduced from the structure and relationships of the information if they are sufficiently richly described. But all this assumes an environment -- that is to say, an organization or enterprise -- that truly recognizes the value of information and so supports pure, formal use of SGML. I'd like to live and work in such a world. Sadly, I live in a world that rejects pure and formal in favor of expedient and ad hoc. From that point of view, I'd like to argue that there is a spectrum of SGML use where products like "SGML Author" or "Intellitag" may serve a useful purpose. My department writes technical manuals. We need a pure, formal SGML-based system that replaces physical access to files and markup with logical access to documents and structure. Nothing less than pure and formal will do. However, there is a wider world around us, where product managers, technical contacts, programmers, etc., write stuff that we can use. Sometimes it's little things like release notes. Sometimes it is very big things like whole books they want us to publish. It is all valuable but, of course, it is coming to us in wildly different formats. Most of these people are using Word or Wordperfect. They are -- and this is key -- happy to do anything I recommend to help ease the transition from the stuff on their desktop to our files **except** buy expensive new products that they'll have to learn from scratch. They have even gone so far as to say; "You give us the style sheet and we'll use it." They're cooperative, they're beginning to understand some of issues involved, and they're willing to try anything within reason that will reduce the small fortune we charge them every time we have to wrestle their stuff to the ground. Here, I can see the WP add-ons working quite well. It may be asking too much of "SGML Author for Word" to provide a robustly tagged SGML instance. But if it gives us a file that is modestly tagged and valid for our DTD, we'll still make enormous strides in improving inter- enterprise productivity. The SGML-disciplined writer in our department can take it from there; put it out in the pasture, feed it growth hormones, etc., until it is fat and ripe with semantic possibilities. In the meantime, these other writers, scattered about the company, will begin to learn and appreciate the difference between format and structure, the necessary first step if they are to eventually embrace SGML as a corporate solution. /chet -- Chet Ensign Information Builders, Inc. 212-736-6250 X4349 internet: doccoe@ibivm.ibmmail.com ibmmail: USUBUVMV@IBMMAIL compuserve: 73163,1414 </message> <message id="<1993Nov11.234140.20466@ncsu.edu>" date="2962050100"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 11 Nov 1993 23:41:40 UT From: "Jennifer Barlow" \<barlow@unity.ncsu.edu> Organization: NCSU Campus Computing Message-ID: <1993Nov11.234140.20466@ncsu.edu> Subject: Getting started with SGML Jennifer Barlow jennifer_barlow@ncsu.edu </message> <message id="<1993Nov12.131640.27032@news.lrz-muenchen.de>" date="2962099000"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 12 Nov 1993 13:16:40 UT From: "Martin Josko" \<martin@pollux.edv.agrar.tu-muenchen.de> Organization: Leibniz-Rechenzentrum, Muenchen (Germany) Message-ID: <1993Nov12.131640.27032@news.lrz-muenchen.de> Subject: Storing SGMLS output in database I'm developing an application which stores the SGMLS output in a relational database structure (in about 15 relations). Does somebody have any experience with this theme ? -- Martin Josko Technical University Munich TU-Muenchen Department of Mathematics DVS-Weihenstephan Statistics and Data Processing D-85350 Freising Freising Germany email: martin@pollux.edv.agrar.tu-muenchen.de phone: +49-(0)8161-71-4506 fax: +49-(0)8161-71-4409 </message> <message id="<JJC.93Nov12142849@jclark.jclark.com>" date="2962103329"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 12 Nov 1993 14:28:49 UT From: "James Clark" \<jjc@jclark.com> Organization: None, London, England Message-ID: \<JJC.93Nov12142849@jclark.jclark.com> References: \<ROBIN.93Nov11104409@utafll.utafll.uta.edu> Subject: Re: SUBDOC and (SGMLS) ESIS [Robin Cover] | I think I'm having trouble understanding details of SGML subdocument, | or ESIS, or perhaps both. | | SGMLS seems to output a different result, depending upon whether a | subdocument is called using a general entity reference or whether it's | called using a general entity name as an attribute value. (The | alternative methods are described in Goldfarb \<title>Handbook</>, page | 90) Using the former alternative, SGMLS outputs the ESIS (?) of the | subdocument when parsing the SGML document entity, while it does not | (?) using the second alternative. The difference between the two alternatives is that in the former case the entity is referenced but in the latter case it is not. The ESIS specification says (Handbook, pp 591-3): i) Attribute information ... General entity name attribute values include the entity name and entity text. The entities themselves are not treated as having been referenced. NOTE - An application can use system services to parse the entities, but such parsing is outside the context of the current document. ... k) References to external entities ... - For SUBDOC entities, the entity name and entity text and passed. The application can require that the subdocument entity be parsed at the point at which the reference occurred. NOTE - Parsing of the subdocument entity can result in other ESIS information being passed. ... One question is: why does sgmls always output ESIS for referenced subdocument entities? My view is that the ESIS specification is wrong and that ISO 8879 requires that a validating parser always parse a referenced subdocument entity. Firstly I would claim that if a SGML document references a subdocument, then that subdocument is as much a part of the SGML document as as a referenced SGML text entity, and if the subdocument is not conforming then the document as a whole is not conforming, and a validating parser must detect this. See clause 6.1. Secondly clause 9.4.2 states that `the number of open SGML subdocument entities cannot exceed the quantity specified on the "SUBDOC" parameter of the SGML declaration.' Clause 4.221 defines `open entity' as `an entity that has been referenced but whose entity end has not yet occurred.' A validating parser must detect whether this restriction has been violated, and to do so it must parse any referenced subdocument entity. Thirdly clause 9.8 on capacities states that points are counted for `the set of open subdocument entities and SGML text entities referenced from them that would require the largest capacity'. This calculation makes no sense unless referenced subdocument entities are parsed. Another question is: why does sgmls not output ESIS information for subdocument entities that occur as names in general entity name attribute values and are not referenced? None of the points listed above apply to such entities and I haven't been able to find anything in the standard that requires that such entities be parsed. Furthermore I think there are applications where it would not be desirable to parse some such entities. For example, you might have an element that represented a reference to an ID in a subdocument by having a NAME attribute giving the name of the ID and an ENTITY attribute giving the name of the subdocument. So it seems to me that it must be for the application to determine whether such entities are parsed, as the ESIS specification says. How can an application parse such entities using sgmls? Sgmls gives you the names of the files containing the subdocument entity, so you can just fork off an sgmls process to parse the subdocument. Somehow, however, you must get a file containing the SGML declaration and add its name as an argument to sgmls before the names of the files containing the subdocument entity. This is not really satisfactory: the output of sgmls should contain sufficient information to allow the application to create such a file. James Clark jjc@jclark.com </message> <message id="<memo.957294@cix.compulink.co.uk>" date="2962104935"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 12 Nov 1993 14:55:35 UT From: "Richard Parker" \<pindar3@cix.compulink.co.uk> Organization: Pindar Infotek Ltd Message-ID: \<memo.957294@cix.compulink.co.uk> Subject: Arbortext on the Mac Hi, Entities Can anyone out there enlighten me as to whether we can run ArborText on a Macintosh? Has anyone ported it? Excuse my ignorance, just a humble programmer... Reply to mail address or here, Thanx in advance, Rich --- Please make 'Attn:\<space>Richard Parker' the first line of your reply (not thesubject) to ensure automatic forwarding to the correct Pindar user. </message> <message id="<19931112.102615.443@almaden.ibm.com>" date="2962114021"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 12 Nov 1993 17:27:01 UT From: "Eliot Kimber" \<drmacro@vnet.IBM.COM> Message-ID: <19931112.102615.443@almaden.ibm.com> References: \<ROBIN.93Nov11104409@utafll.utafll.uta.edu> Subject: Re: SUBDOC and (SGMLS) ESIS [Robin Cover] | I think I'm having trouble understanding details of SGML subdocument, | or ESIS, or perhaps both. | | SGMLS seems to output a different result, depending upon whether a | subdocument is called using a general entity reference or whether it's | called using a general entity name as an attribute value. (The | alternative methods are described in Goldfarb \<title>Handbook</>, page | 90) Using the former alternative, SGMLS outputs the ESIS (?) of the | subdocument when parsing the SGML document entity, while it does not | (?) using the second alternative. | | Anyone who wants to supply a bit of tutorial on SUBDOC beyond what's | found in Goldfarb 89-90 (Eliot?) will be counted blessed. Thanks in | advance. Subdocuments are a special case of data entity. Like other data entities, they can be referred to either using a normal entity reference (\&mysubdoc;) anywhere that data is valid, or via an entity attribute or, in HyTime, from a nmlist element, or via any other application-defined reference mechanism. The reference to data entities from ENTITY attributes (attributes with a declared datatype of entity, e.g.: \<!ATTLIST MultiMediaObject object ENTITY #REQUIRED -- name of data entity -- > must be handled by the processing application in all cases -- the parser will not normally handle it, because the processing that is to be done for data entities is not defined by ISO 8879, not even for subdocument entities. You can think of a subdocument entity as a data entity with a notation of SGML. ISO 8879 defines the constraint that subdocument entities must conform to the SGML declaration of the document from which they are referred. Just as for any other notation, it is up to the processing application to define and implement processing for the SUBDOC. Of course, in the case of sub documents, since the notation is SGML, it might be reasonable to assume that a parser could provide this service for us automatically. However, I think that it would be presumptuous for a parser to this, because the application may have a specific behavior in mind for subdoc references that may not involve the use of the current parser--who's to say other than the application designers themselves? Thus, a system that supports SUBDOC needs to do the following things: 1. Report a reference to subdoc entity as it would report a reference to any other data entity, indicating that it is a SUBDOC entity. 2. Provide an application API by which the *application* can request processing of the subdocument entity. This could be a recursive call to the parser or it could start a new instance of the parser in a separate thread. Without these functions, it is impossible for an application to implement subdoc references, especially from ENTITY attributes. Also, we must have function 2, because there may be situations where a subdocument entity is referred to other than an ENTITY attribute, such as in the HyTime NMList case. Neither ISO 8879 nor *The SGML Handbook* give much guidance about how one might use SUBDOC or what the intent was. It's my understanding that SUBDOC was intended to solve the ID and entity name space scoping problem, and that seems to be the most compelling use of SUBDOC, and is certainly an elegant solution to the problem. One of the interesting things about SUBDOC is that you can define SUBDOC document types derived from a superset DTD at will because SGML allows the declaration of elements in a DTD that are not used in any active content models. This means, for example, that you can use the same DTD for a complete "logical document" and proper subset document types without modifying the base DTD itself. Consider this very simple public DTD fragment: \ \<!ELEMENT SIMPDOC - - (section+) > \<!ELEMENT Section - O (p*, subsection*) > \<!ELEMENT Subsection - O (p*) > \<!ELEMENT P - O (#PCDATA) > For a complete "logical document", where by logical document I mean a document that represents the content that would be required by the application to create a complete output instance, e.g., a printed book. I use logical document to contrast with "syntactic document", which is "document" as defined by ISO 8879, namely a document type declaration and a document instance, where the document instance consists of the "document element" (that element whose GI is the same as the document type name), and any valid content of the document element. I have to make this distinction because subdocuments are complete syntactic documents, but are incomplete logical documents (at least for this use of SUBDOC). A complete SIMPDOC document would look like this: \<!DOCTYPE SIMPDOC SYSTEM "simpdoc.dtd" > \<simpdoc> ... \</simpdoc> Now, say I want to use SUBDOCs to create blindly-reusable sections, I need do only this: \<!DOCTYPE SECTION SYSTEM "simpdoc.dtd"> \<section> ... \</simpdoc> Note that the document type name is "section", but the dtd is still the same simpdoc.dtd (and the document element is now section, by the rules of SGML). My parser may issue informational messages to the effect that SIMPDOC is declared but not used in any content models, but that is not an error and will not affect the parsing or validity of the DTD. With this DTD, I must use an ENTITY attribute to refer to a subdoc from within a SIMPDOC instance for "meaningful" uses of subdoc (e.g. a use where the content of the subdoc makes sense in the current context--it probably wouldn't make sense to refer to a Section subdoc from within the content of a paragraph, although there's no way to prevent it by the rules of SGML). The reason I must use an entity attribute is that direct data entity references are only valid where character data is valid (#PCDATA or mixed content), but the SIMPDOC content model is element content, allowing only elements. Therefore, a data entity reference is not valid within the direct content of a SIMPDOC element. For this application, I can define an entity attribute for section that will allow a subdoc reference, say: \<!ATTLIST section contentref ENTITY #CONREF > Now I can use a Section element to refer to a subdoc entity. SGML imposes no constraints on the content of that SUBDOC, but you could define constraints in your application, such as the constraint that the document type of the subdoc must be the same as the GI of element doing the referencing, e.g., Section can only refer to subdocs of document type Section. It would be up to the processing application to validate that constraint--no rule of SGML provides a way to impose that constraint. The subdoc reference would look like this: \<!DOCTYPE simpdoc SYSTEM "simpdoc.dtd" [ \<!ENTITY sec1 SYSTEM "sec1.section" SUBDOC > ]> \<simpdoc> \<section contentref=sec1>\ \<section> ... Inline section for contrast ... \</section> \</simpdoc> As explained above, to process this reference, the application has to interpret the ContentRef= attribute value, get the declaration information from the parser, and actually process the subdocument, for example, recursively call the parser to parse it. It could process the data therein as though it had occurred inline since it has imposed a constraint that makes that possible, or it could do something different, depending on the function being performed and the precise design of the application. The sub document, because it is a syntactically-complete SGML document, has its own ID and entity name space, which means it can be used within the context of a larger document without the need to worry about conflicts between ID or entity values in the referencing document. Also, because it has a document type declaration, it could have its own element declarations local to it and tightly bound to the data that use those declarations. This use of SUBDOC to re-use proper subsets of a larger document type has some interesting properties: 1. Blind re-use of logical document fragments is enabled because of the name space isolation. 2. If the GI/doctype match constraint is imposed, structural validation is maintained because it becomes impossible to create references to elements that are not meaningful 3. If you use HyTime's unified ID/entity name space, it is not necessary for the reference to a subdoc to change if the subdoc becomes part of the larger document, or if a part of the document already referred to via a content reference link is made into a subdoc, because the form of reference will be identical in both cases. 4. Complete logical documents may be used as subdocuments by a yet larger document. For example, say I have all these SIMPDOCs, and I want to create a single SGML document that represents a multi-volume collection, I need only do this: \<!DOCTYPE MultDoc &#DSO; \<!ELEMENT MultDoc - - (Simpdoc+) > \<!ENTITY % simpdoc SYSTEM "simpdoc.dtd"> %simpdoc; \ \<!ELEMENT doc1 SYSTEM "doc1.simpdoc" SUBDOC > \<!ELEMENT doc2 SYSTEM "doc2.simpdoc" SUBDOC > \<multdoc> \<simpdoc contentref=doc1> \<simpdoc contentref=doc2> \</multdoc> Pretty cool, I think. Note that this mechanism scales in both directions with equal utility. Speaking personally, I would have to look pretty hard at any use of SUBDOC that did follow the above model, although I certainly wouldn't preclude the existence of other uses of SUBDOC. It might be useful for some standard application architecture, possibly HyTime, to codify this use of SUBDOC explicitly. We're almost certainly going to define IBMIDDoc and the InfoMaster Architecture in this way. -- Eliot Kimber Internet: drmacro@vnet.ibm.com Dept E14/B500 IBMMAIL: USIB2DK9@IBMMAIL Network Programs Information Development Phone: 1-919-254-5160 IBM Corporation Research Triangle Park, NC 27709 "But Ranger Doug, can't we just use some proprietary data format instead of this SGML stuff?" "Sure Slim, that would be the easy way, but it wouldn't be the Cowboy Way." </message> <message id="<19931112.130136.243@almaden.ibm.com>" date="2962126401"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 12 Nov 1993 20:53:21 UT From: "Eliot Kimber" \<drmacro@vnet.IBM.COM> Message-ID: <19931112.130136.243@almaden.ibm.com> References: <9310281443.AA19372@netcomsv.netcom.com> <19931029.065225.214@almaden.ibm.com> <2b5rii$r9s@meaddata.meaddata.com> <199311111914.LAA01206@netcomsv.netcom.com> Subject: Re: MS fact sheet on SGML [Eliot Kimber] | At the risk of sparking a Jihad, I will claim that this argument is | entirely specious because it assumes that only a human can create such | a presentation... [Chet Ensign] | However, there is a wider world around us, where product managers, | technical contacts, programmers, etc., write stuff that we can use. | Sometimes it's little things like release notes. Sometimes it is very | big things like whole books they want us to publish. It is all | valuable but, of course, it is coming to us in wildly different | formats. I think Chet is completely correct -- there is a need to bridge between the world of high-function technical information and more ad-hoc ways of creating documents. One solution I'd like to see pursued more is one that Wayne Wohler first proposed while we were developing the IBMIDDoc language, which is to define a minimal subset language, which Wayne calls "CasualDoc" that would conform to our InfoMaster Architecture, but would be as simple as possible and still be usefully functional. This would be a very small language, about 40 elements or so (not counting structured stuff like name and address, which might retain their IBMIDDoc complexity because of their utility). It would not require the same capacities as a larger language, (apart from the name length), and as it conforms to the same architecture, could be processed by the same InfoMaster-based processors as IBMIDDoc. The key to making this work is the common underlying architecture, and supporting tools. We haven't explored this idea within IBM to date because we simply haven't had the resources and it's not a priority. -- Eliot Kimber Internet: drmacro@vnet.ibm.com Dept E14/B500 IBMMAIL: USIB2DK9@IBMMAIL Network Programs Information Development Phone: 1-919-254-5160 IBM Corporation Research Triangle Park, NC 27709 "But Ranger Doug, can't we just use some proprietary data format instead of this SGML stuff?" "Sure Slim, that would be the easy way, but it wouldn't be the Cowboy Way." </message> <message id="<CGEH2A.7yF@caracara.cdev.com>" date="2962132065"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 12 Nov 1993 22:27:45 UT From: "Jon C. Stonecash" \<jcs0ka15@redstart.cdev.com> Organization: Computing Devices International Message-ID: \<CGEH2A.7yF@caracara.cdev.com> Summary: Need to know about opportunities Subject: Research possibilities wrt SGML My company is interested in document management. We are positioning ourselves as systems integrators in this area. I am the chief technologist in this area. I am also involved in my company's pursuit of customer funded research where the customer defines the subject area and we do the research on their nickle. We get a leg up on the technology and the customer (typically a government lab) advances the state-of-the-art in an area of interest to them. My questions to this newsgroup are: Is anybody doing research of this type in areas related to SGML? If SO, what is the research and who is doing it? Does anyone have some research ideas that we might pitch to whomever pops out as a result of the answers to the first question? -- Jon C. Stonecash Phone: (612) 921-7356 Computing Devices International Fax: (612) 921-6552 8800 Queen Avenue South Internet: stonecash@cdev.com Bloomington, Minnesota, USA 55431 Mailstop: BLCN2C </message> <message id="<2c1ecs$o0d@samba.oit.unc.edu>" date="2962144092"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 13 Nov 1993 01:48:12 UT From: "Simon E Spero" \<ses@tipper.oit.unc.edu> Organization: University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill Message-ID: <2c1ecs$o0d@samba.oit.unc.edu> References: <19931109.004@sfo.naggum.no> \<THOMAS.93Nov9142606@noosa.gmd.de> <19931110.018@sfo.naggum.no> <1993Nov11.134442.25810@gdstech.grumman.com> Subject: Re: Standard DTDs (was: Evaluating SGML) [Larry Beck] | I wonder if there's a way to get an ISO standard withdrawn?? Can't this happen during the review cycle? I can't find my I-SPY book of ISO anywhere. If other standards start referencing it then withdrawl would cause a lot of dangling references. I think a far more productive activity would be to work on standardising a few general purpose DTD fragments. For example, I have a chunk o' DTD for references which is more or less a naive encoding of MARC. Something like that would be very useful to standardise; processing it nicely takes some fairly complicated code; however that code can be reused whenever I use it with a different DTD. The chances of me getting my personal report DTD accepted by NISO are not too good, and quite rightly so. However a standard way of handling bibliographies would be much more useful and generally applicable. Hmmm - Quick question; could a parameter entity reference expanding into several ELEMENT defines occur in a DOCTYPE ? Simon -- Hackers Local 42- National Union of Computer Operatives, Chapel Hill section ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Tar Heel Information Services - Nothing but net! | WAIS/Z39.50 spoken here North Carolina - First in Usenet | DoD #612 | Tel: +1-919-962-9107 </message> <message id="<1993Nov13.154817.5269@falch.no>" date="2962194497"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 13 Nov 1993 15:48:17 UT From: Steve Pepper \<pepper@falch.no> Organization: Falch Hurtigtrykk as, Oslo, Norway Message-ID: <1993Nov13.154817.5269@falch.no> Subject: SGML tools I am compiling a list of SGML-aware software tools in connection with a presentation called "The Whirlwind Guide to SGML Tools" and would appreciate help from readers of this group. While I would like the list to be as comprehensive as possible, I am not interested in every piece of software that claims "SGML compatibility". My main criterion for inclusion in the list is that the software incorporates some kind of SGML parsing capability, or that it is in some way specifically geared to handling SGML documents. The products in the list are arranged in a set of very broad categories that no doubt could become the subject of heated disputes, but that's a chance I have to take... I am appending a (very) preliminary version of the list and would like to appeal to anyone (particularly vendors) who have comments, corrections or additions to contact me at pepper@falch.no. Please DO NOT post comments to this newsgroup. I will post an updated version of the list at a later date if people are interested. The information below is taken from Robin Cover's SGML Bibliography and GCA's SGML Source Guide. If anyone knows of other publicly available product listings, please let me know. Thanks for your help. Best regards, Steve -- </(pepper)steve> pepper@falch.no ------------------------------------------------------------------ falch hurtigtrykk a.s, postboks 130 kalbakken, n-0902 oslo, norway tel +47 2216 3040 fax +47 2216 2350 ========================= cut here =============================== \<sgmltools> SGML tools (list generated 13 November 93) ========================================================== 1. By product category ---------------------- Supported platforms (where known) are shown in brackets as U = UNIX D = MS-DOS W = MS-Windows M = Macintosh O = OS/2 Browsers - DynaText [U,W,M] Electronic Book Technology - Lector [U,W] Open Text Corp. - Pathways [U] Westinghouse Electric Corp. Conversion software - Balise [U,D] MID Information Logistics Group - FastTAG [U,W] Avalanche Development Co. - qwertz/FORMAT [U] PD - SGML Hammer [U,W] Avalanche Development Co. - SGML Translator [ ] Shaffstall Corp. - SGML Translator [ ] DCF Edition IBM Corp. - TableTAG [U,D] Unifilt Co. Databases - PAT [U] Open Text Corp. - SGML Darc [U,W] Synex Information AB - SGML/DB [U] AIS Berger-Levrault - SGML/Search [U] AIS Berger-Levrault Editors - ADEPT Editor [U,W] ArborText Inc. - Author/Editor [U,W,M] SoftQuad, Inc. - EASE (E2S Advanced SGML Editor [D] E2S - GRIF SGML Editor [U] Grif S.A. - Intellitag [U,D] WordPerfect Corp. - SGML Smart Editor [D] Auto-Graphics, Inc. - TextWrite [O] IBM Corp. - Write-It [D] SEMA Group - WriterStation [D] Datalogics, Inc. - XGML CheckMark [M] Exoterica Corp. HyTime engines - HyMinder [U,D] TechnoTeacher, Inc. Page layout software - ADEPT Publisher [U,W] ArborText Inc. - DL Composer [U] Datalogics, Inc. - FrameBuilder [U,W] Frame Technology Corp. Parsers - Amsterdam Parser [U] PD - ARC-SGML [D] PD - Mark-It [U,D] SEMA Group - MarkMinder [U,D] TechnoTeacher, Inc. - sgmls [U] PD - XGML OmniMark [U,D,M] Exoterica Corp. - XGML Validator [U,D,M] Exoterica Corp. Various - Near & Far [ ] Microstar Software Ltd. - SGML DTD Viewer [ ] ZIFTech Computer Systems, Inc. 2. By vendor ------------ Application category is shown in brackets as B = Browser C = Conversion software D = Database E = Editor H = HyTime engine L = Page layout software P = Parser V = Various AIS Berger-Levrault - SGML/DB \<D> - SGML/Search \<D> ArborText Inc. - ADEPT Editor \<E> - ADEPT Publisher \<L> Auto-Graphics, Inc. - SGML Smart Editor \<E> Avalanche Development Co. - FastTAG \<C> - SGML Hammer \<C> Datalogics, Inc. - DL Composer \<L> - WriterStation \<E> E2S - EASE (E2S Advanced SGML Editor \<E> Electronic Book Technology - DynaText \<B> Exoterica Corp. - XGML CheckMark \<E> - XGML OmniMark \<P> - XGML Validator \<P> Frame Technology Corp. - FrameBuilder \<L> Grif S.A. - GRIF SGML Editor \<E> IBM Corp. - SGML Translator DCF Edition \<C> - TextWrite \<E> Microstar Software Ltd. - Near & Far \<V> MID Information Logistics Group - Balise \<C> Open Text Corp. - Lector \<B> - PAT \<D> PD - Amsterdam Parser \<P> - ARC-SGML \<P> - qwertz/FORMAT \<C> - sgmls \<P> SEMA Group - Mark-It \<P> - Write-It \<E> Shaffstall Corp. - SGML Translator \<C> SoftQuad, Inc. - Author/Editor \<E> Synex Information AB - SGML Darc \<D> TechnoTeacher, Inc. - HyMinder \<H> - MarkMinder \<P> Unifilt Co. - TableTAG \<C> Westinghouse Electric Corp. - Pathways \<B> WordPerfect Corp. - Intellitag \<E> ZIFTech Computer Systems, Inc. - SGML DTD Viewer \<V> \</sgmltools> </message> <message id="<93317.133429U35395@uicvm.uic.edu>" date="2962208069"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 13 Nov 1993 19:34:29 UT From: C. M. Sperberg-McQueen \<U35395@uicvm.uic.edu> Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago, ADN Computer Center Message-ID: <93317.133429U35395@uicvm.uic.edu> Subject: references to undeclared elements [C. M. Sperberg-McQueen] | This ought to be a warning, not an error message, I think: SGML | specifically allows elements to be referred to but not defined (clause | 11.2.4). [Peter Flynn] | I know it permits it, but that is a theoretical problem. A/E is a | practical application, and my feeling is that mkrls is right to reject | the DTD on this basis, otherwise users would be left with a partial | DTD. Hmm. I guess all I can say is that it becomes a practical problem if you work with the TEI DTDs (and, I daresay, many others): the TEI DTDs rely on being able to refer to elements whether they are declared or not. Many TEI content models, for example, refer to parameter entities like %phrase, the class of phrase-level elements, which includes both phrase-level elements defined in the core tag set and also phrase-level elements defined by optional additional tag sets. The ones in the additional tag sets, however, won't be declared unless the tag set which declares them is selected. But it is not an error not to have selected that tag set: that tag set is *optional*. That is, the TEI *relies* on clause 11.2.4, for the same reason that Goldfarb says the clause was included: it makes life much easier for those who define large public element sets which may reasonably be subsetted, and also for those who use those large public element sets. The alternative would be a somewhat hairier scheme to ensure that elements in an optional tag set get included in the declaration of %phrase (and the various other element classes!) only if the optional tag set is actually selected by the user -- as if the guts of the TEI's driver file weren't hairy enough as it is. (And note that even such a hairier scheme would not work, if you were to suppress one of the TEI elements; at least, not without adding complexity all out of proportion to what would be gained.) I agree that clause 11.2.4 makes it harder to distinguish between a DTD like the TEI DTD, behaving as designed, and a DTD which has lost some of its element declarations owing to errors in transmission. But I have no idea how to reconcile the desire for enforcement of a 'clean' document grammar with the need for convenient subsetting of large element sets, and given the conflict, I think the design of 8879 makes the right choice. -C. M. Sperberg-McQueen ACH/ALLC/ACL Text Encoding Initiative P.S. You ask about the TEI DTDs on the various servers; these are still being checked and fixed periodically, and so are subject to change without notice. Those who are working with them (and finding bugs) have our thanks, and an invitation to report problems directly to me or to Lou Burnard (lou@vax.ox.ac.uk), or preferably to both of us. Those who don't want to be pioneers should wait a few weeks, for an announcement that the DTDs are all there and clean enough for use by those who are not SGML hackers. [Apologies to those who get this twice, or who were confused by the garbling of the first version posted.] </message> <message id="<1993Nov14.032534.7945@stats.govt.nz>" date="2962236334"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 14 Nov 1993 03:25:34 UT From: "Gary Houston" \<ghouston@stats.govt.nz> Organization: Statistics New Zealand Message-ID: <1993Nov14.032534.7945@stats.govt.nz> References: <19931109.004@sfo.naggum.no> <19931110.018@sfo.naggum.no> <1993Nov11.134442.25810@gdstech.grumman.com> <2c1ecs$o0d@samba.oit.unc.edu> Subject: "was: Standard DTDs" \<Bibliographies> [Simon E Spero] | I think a far more productive activity would be to work on | standardising a few general purpose DTD fragments. For example, I have | a chunk o' DTD for references which is more or less a naive encoding of | MARC. Something like that would be very useful to standardise; | processing it nicely takes some fairly complicated code; however that | code can be reused whenever I use it with a different DTD. | | The chances of me getting my personal report DTD accepted by NISO are | not too good, and quite rightly so. However a standard way of handling | bibliographies would be much more useful and generally applicable. I've been thinking about this recently, in the quest for a bibliographic system for my own DTD. Some experimentation with the TEI method (from P2CO) has suggested that it would do the job, perhaps with some minor modifications (perhaps to mine, not TEI) during the shoehorning process It makes an interesting change from the Scribe/BiBTeX type systems. I'm not sure that I have completely recovered yet from the last contact I had with MARC, but I would still be interested in taking a look at how such an implementation would look (posting a chunk o' DTD to comp.text.sgml should be seen as the first step on the road to becoming one of the standards :-) A big problem with DTD fragments is going to be name-space collisions. I find this with the TEI fragment: my DTD already has \<title> and \<author> elements, and a system of phrases etc. The way in which bibliographic information is to be encoded can have ramifications elsewhere in the DTD. I hereby reserve the name "Snafu" for my DTD, unless a popular movement arises to make it a synonym for DTD in general :-) A question about the TEI DTD, just in case the relevant authorities are reading: Why is the biblScope attribute not permitted at the analytic level? It seems like a logical place to put the page numbers of an extract, rather than at the monograph level as suggested. Also a note, in case this has not already been fixed (is there a recent DTD fragment around somewhere? I am still missing several parameter entities): There are a few typos in the P2CO document. \<publ> is used instead of \<publisher> in one example. \<individual> is used in several places where \<indiv> is presumably intended. The content model for monogr has (edition, (editor | resp)*) where (edition, (editor | resp))* would be more reasonable (cf. examples which otherwise fail). Gary </message> <message id="<bosakCGHzCn.2HE@netcom.com>" date="2962295735"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml,alt.hypertext Date: 14 Nov 1993 19:55:35 UT From: "Jon Bosak" \<bosak@netcom.com> Message-ID: \<bosakCGHzCn.2HE@netcom.com> Subject: SGML/hypertext example available Persons looking for examples of commercial hypertext applications based on SGML may be interested in the following announcement, which was posted recently in comp.sys.novell. The NetWare 3.12 document set described below is freely available and demonstrates how basic hypertext concepts can be applied to existing printed materials. The electronic version contains all of the text and illustrations in the printed NetWare 3.12 manual set, which runs about 5000 pages. All of the books in the set were originally authored in FrameMaker and then converted to SGML using Avalanche FastTAG. After validation with the sgmls parser, the SGML was indexed using DynaText 1.5 from Electronic Book Technologies. The "ElectroText" viewer included with the set is a customized version of the DynaText 1.5 viewer for MS-Windows. We are currently in the process of converting from our old "homemade" DTD to the industry-standard DocBook DTD and from the old DynaText 1.5 environment to the current DynaText 2.x. We plan to make available revised versions of our manual sets using new viewers running across multiple platforms sometime in the first quarter of 1994. Jon Bosak Novell Corporate Publications ================================================ NETWARE 3.12 ELECTRONIC MANUALS AVAILABLE BY FTP ================================================ The ElectroText online documentation set for NetWare 3.12 is now available for download via anonymous ftp from ftp.novell.com in the directory /pub/documentation/corppubs/nw312. This release corrects a file-naming error in the collection provided on the NetWare 3.12 CD. It may be downloaded and used by anyone needing information about NetWare 3.12. Contents -------- This release includes both the electronic version of the NetWare 3.12 manual set and the ElectroText viewer for Windows. The complete set occupies about 41 MB of disk space and can be installed on either a NetWare server or a standalone workstation. Obtaining the manual set ------------------------ Download the set as follows: 1. ftp ftp.novell.com (or ftp 137.65.1.1) 2. Give your name as "ftp" and enter your email address when prompted for a password. 3. Enter the following commands at the ftp prompt: bin hash cd /pub/documentation/corppubs/nw312 4. Download directions for installing the manual set with the command get README 5. The manual set itself is available in two forms: a large compressed file named nw312d8.zip created with pkzip 2.04g and another large compressed file named nw312d8.tar.Z created with the Unix tar and compress utilities. Choose one of these two files depending on whether you wish to install the set using pkunzip running under DOS or uncompress and tar running under Unix. ElectroText currently runs only under Windows, so most users will want to download nw312d8.zip. The file nw312d8.tar.Z is provided for system administrators who wish to install the document set from a Unix system for network access from Windows workstations. Download one of the two large compressed files by entering either get nw312d8.zip or get nw312d8.tar.Z Make sure that you have previously entered the hash command to keep your connection from timing out during the download. 6. If you do not already have a copy of pkunzip, download it with the command get pkunzip.exe 7. Enter bye to close the connection. 8. Follow the directions in the README file to install the manual set. Note: Some sites will experience problems in downloading the manual set due to the large size of the compressed file. If you have set "bin" and "hash" according to the directions above and you still can't transfer the file successfully, then there is something wrong with your system configuration. Contact your system administrator for assistance in adjusting your system's spool size or timeout parameters. Novell cannot assist you in troubleshooting ftp transfer problems, and the complexity of the manual set's directory structure prevents us from providing its components in separate files. If you cannot download the manual set, it can be ordered on CD. See the ordering information included with your copy of NetWare 3.12 or contact your Novell distributor for details. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Jon Bosak -*- Information Architect -*- Novell Corporate Publications ---------------------------------------------------------------------- </message> <message id="<2c6dhj$bj6@frame.frame.com>" date="2962307059"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 14 Nov 1993 23:04:19 UT From: "Lynne Price" \<lprice@frame.com> Organization: Frame Technology Corporation Message-ID: <2c6dhj$bj6@frame.frame.com> References: <93314.150427U35395@uicvm.uic.edu> <753013087snz@pira2.demon.co.uk> \<JJC.93Nov11125002@jclark.jclark.com> Subject: Re: Can I "escape" delimiters in Attributes? James Clark correctly observes that general entity references can be used to enter the character strings used as the LIT and LITA delimiters into attribute values: [James Clark] | Markup that would terminate replaceable character data is not | recognized in an entity that was referenced from within the same | replaceable character data. | | Attribute value literals contain replaceable character data (production | 34). Numeric character references can also be used. See clause 9.5: A replacement character is treated as though it were entered directly except that the replacement for a numeric character reference is always treated as data in the context in which the replacement occurs. --Lynne </message> <message id="<ricko.753357516@ee.uts.EDU.AU>" date="2962346316"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 15 Nov 1993 09:58:36 UT From: "Rick Jelliffe" \<ricko@ee.uts.edu.au> Organization: University of Technology, Sydney Message-ID: \<ricko.753357516@ee.uts.EDU.AU> Keywords: SGML, OS/2 Summary: Request for OS/2 SGML applications Subject: SGML on OS/2 I am interested to know what SGML programs are available to run on OS/2 2.1. I can run: * X's Omnimark (omnic & omnir) * SQ's Author/Editor & RulesBuilder Rules Builder needed to have the correct DOS version passed to it. Author/Editor froze once: I don't know if that is an OS/2 thing or an A/E thing, or what yet. Does anyone else have anything else up? -ricko -- Rick Jelliffe Allette Systems and University of Technology, Sydney </message> <message id="<19931115.064609.134@almaden.ibm.com>" date="2962363271"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 15 Nov 1993 14:41:11 UT From: "Eliot Kimber" \<drmacro@vnet.IBM.COM> Message-ID: <19931115.064609.134@almaden.ibm.com> References: \<ricko.753357516@ee.uts.EDU.AU> Subject: Re: SGML on OS/2 [Rick Jelliffe] | I am interested to know what SGML programs are available to run on OS/2 | 2.1. I can run: | | * X's Omnimark (omnic & omnir) | * SQ's Author/Editor & RulesBuilder | | Rules Builder needed to have the correct DOS version passed to it. | Author/Editor froze once: I don't know if that is an OS/2 thing or an | A/E thing, or what yet. | | Does anyone else have anything else up? Datalogics sells the WriterStation/PM SGML editor for OS/2. It is rougly comparable to Author/Editor in function and price (more or less). WS/PM does some things A/E doesn't, doesn't do others. -- Eliot Kimber Internet: drmacro@vnet.ibm.com Dept E14/B500 IBMMAIL: USIB2DK9@IBMMAIL Network Programs Information Development Phone: 1-919-254-5160 IBM Corporation Research Triangle Park, NC 27709 "But Ranger Doug, can't we just use some proprietary data format instead of this SGML stuff?" "Sure Slim, that would be the easy way, but it wouldn't be the Cowboy Way." </message> <message id="<93319.170820U35395@uicvm.uic.edu>" date="2962393700"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 15 Nov 1993 23:08:20 UT From: "C. M. Sperberg-McQueen" \<U35395@uicvm.uic.edu> Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago, ADN Computer Center Message-ID: <93319.170820U35395@uicvm.uic.edu> References: <19931109.004@sfo.naggum.no> <19931110.018@sfo.naggum.no> <1993Nov11.134442.25810@gdstech.grumman.com> <2c1ecs$o0d@samba.oit.unc.edu> <1993Nov14.032534.7945@stats.govt.nz> Subject: Re: Bibliographies (was: Standard DTDs) [Gary Houston] | A big problem with DTD fragments is going to be name-space collisions. | I find this with the TEI fragment: my DTD already has \<title> and | \<author> elements, and a system of phrases etc. The way in which | bibliographic information is to be encoded can have ramifications | elsewhere in the DTD. I hereby reserve the name "Snafu" for my DTD, | unless a popular movement arises to make it a synonym for DTD in | general :-) Of course, the TEI DTD does allow elements to be renamed. If, for example, you want to use 'bibTitle' and 'bibAuthor' inside bibliographies (because, say, your 'title' and 'author' refer to the title and author of the document being encoded), this will do it; put it in your DTD subset: \<!ENTITY % n.title 'bibTitle' > \<!ENTITY % n.author 'bibAuthor' > (This also makes it easier to use DTDs in a language other than English; unfortunately, you have to put up with English in the attribute names or make somewhat more serious changes.) I should note in passing that the choice to use the shorter GI 'title' for bibliographic references rather than for the title of the document is an instance of a general design principle which the TEI attempts to apply, and which I recommend to everyone: use the shorter name for the more common element, and qualify the other one. Hence in the TEI DTD, 'title' refers to the title of a work being mentioned, and 'docTitle' to the title of the work being created, because the latter typically appears just once, on the title page, while there may be *lots* of bibligraphic references. | A question about the TEI DTD, just in case the relevant authorities are | reading: | | Why is the biblScope attribute not permitted at the analytic level? It | seems like a logical place to put the page numbers of an extract, | rather than at the monograph level as suggested. Hmm. good question. It's allowed at the monographic level since so many of (though not all of) the bibliographic styles want page numbers to follow the monographic information; I don't know that there is a good reason *not* to allow it at the analytic level, unless it's to prevent even the possibility of conflict with a biblScope at the monographic level (and that argument is a non-starter for something as vague as biblScope anyway). | Also a note, in case this has not already been fixed (is there a recent | DTD fragment around somewhere? I am still missing several parameter | entities): ... I think the most recent, cleanest DTDs are those on the sgml1.ex.ac.uk server. Thanks for the list of errors. -C. M. Sperberg-McQueen ACH / ACL / ALLC Text Encoding Initiative University of Illinois at Chicago </message> <message id="<2caa79$4ut@figment.dircon.co.uk>" date="2962437759"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 16 Nov 1993 11:22:39 UT From: Bruce Hunter \<bruce@sgml.dircon.co.uk> Message-ID: <2caa79$4ut@figment.dircon.co.uk> Subject: Release of Ox I've cross-posted this from comp.compilers, as I thought it might also be of interest to some folks here. I haven't tried it yet, but I plan to. This announces the first general release of Ox: An Attribute Grammar Compiling System based on Yacc, Lex, and C Ox generalizes the function of Yacc in the way that attribute grammars generalize context-free grammars. Ordinary Yacc and Lex specifications may be augmented with definitions of synthesized and inherited attributes written in C syntax. Ox checks these specifications for consistency and completeness, and generates from them a program that builds and decorates attributed parse trees. Ox accepts a most general class of attribute grammars. The user may specify postdecoration traversals for easy ordering of side effects such as code generation. Ox handles the tedious and error-prone details of writing code for parse-tree management, so its use eases problems of security and maintainability associated with that aspect of translator development. Ox is a Yacc/Lex/C preprocessor, and is designed to bring attribute grammars to the mainstream of Unix-based language development. Ox inherits all of the familiar syntax and semantics of Yacc, Lex, and C, so it is a good choice for language designers, experimenters, and developers familiar with those tools. It is relatively easy to convert programs between Ox code and "pure Yacc/Lex/C" code. Ox is carefully engineered for reliability, portability, compatibility, simplicity, and efficiency. Ox can be used with Bison, Flex, and C++. Use of Ox is free. Code generated by Ox is the property of the Ox user. The distribution is available by anonymous ftp from the directory `/pub/ox' on: ftp.cs.iastate.edu The Ox G1.01 distribution includes: * source code (Ox is written in Yacc, Lex, and C) * tutorial introduction (new, informal, 19 pages). This emphasizes examples and helps you cover the main points quickly. If you already know Yacc, Lex, and AGs, you are soon ready to begin using Ox with your favorite Yacc/Lex parser. * user reference manual (indexed, up-to-date, 57 pages) * on-line manual * small examples (files containing all of the examples from the user reference manual and the tutorial introduction) * Ox-ready Yacc/Lex parsers for C, C++, Pascal, Ada, and FORTRAN * a large example (block-structured imperative-language compiler suitable for instruction and experimentation) with documentation Ox is designed and implemented by Kurt Bischoff, in association with Kelvin Nilsen, Department of Computer Science, Iowa State University. Questions about Ox should be sent to: ox-request@cs.iastate.edu -- Kurt Bischoff, bischoff@cs.iastate.edu -- Send compilers articles to compilers@iecc.com or {ima | spdcc | world}!iecc!compilers. Meta-mail to compilers-request@iecc.com. </message> <message id="<19931116.061326.666@almaden.ibm.com>" date="2962447465"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 16 Nov 1993 14:04:25 UT From: "Eliot Kimber" \<drmacro@vnet.IBM.COM> Message-ID: <19931116.061326.666@almaden.ibm.com> References: <19931109.004@sfo.naggum.no> <19931110.018@sfo.naggum.no> <1993Nov11.134442.25810@gdstech.grumman.com> <1993Nov14.032534.7945@stats.govt.nz> Subject: Re: Bibliographies (was: Standard DTDs) [Gary Houston] | A big problem with DTD fragments is going to be name-space collisions. | I find this with the TEI fragment: my DTD already has \<title> and | \<author> elements, and a system of phrases etc. The way in which | bibliographic information is to be encoded can have ramifications | elsewhere in the DTD. I hereby reserve the name "Snafu" for my DTD, | unless a popular movement arises to make it a synonym for DTD in | general :-) The way to avoid name space collisions is to define architectures, not DTDs (although the architecture may be defined as a DTD "template", as HyTime is). In the simple case, the concrete instantiation of the architecture uses the architectural form names as the actual element GIs (e.g., nameloc GI used for instances of Nameloc architectural forms), but concrete DTDs can also uses other GIs as well, since the architecture-level processing only looks at the architectural form name. Name conflict between archtectures is avoided because each architecture has its own "architectural form declaration attribute", e.g. HyTime= for the HyTime architecture, InfoMaster= for the InfoMaster Architecture, TEI= for the TEI architecture. -- Eliot Kimber Internet: drmacro@vnet.ibm.com Dept E14/B500 IBMMAIL: USIB2DK9@IBMMAIL Network Programs Information Development Phone: 1-919-254-5160 IBM Corporation Research Triangle Park, NC 27709 "But Ranger Doug, can't we just use some proprietary data format instead of this SGML stuff?" "Sure Slim, that would be the easy way, but it wouldn't be the Cowboy Way." </message> <message id="<2cbekb$s14@dr-pepper.East.Sun.COM>" date="2962472011"> Newsgroups: comp.infosystems.www,comp.lang.postscript,comp.text.sgml,comp.text.desktop,comp.unix.solaris Followup-To: comp.infosystems.www Date: 16 Nov 1993 20:53:31 UT From: "Gary Adams" \<Gary.Adams@East.Sun.COM> Organization: Sun Microsystems Laboratories, Inc. Message-ID: <2cbekb$s14@dr-pepper.East.Sun.COM> Keywords: pdf viewer html hypertext links ghostview Subject: PDF viewer or pdf2html filter ? Does anyone have a viewer for Adobe's PDF files? My initial thoughts are to modify a copy of ghostview to "do the right thing" for the basic PostScript capabilities. Another approach might be to create a PDF to HTML filter and use a standard web client for viewing. Would it be possible to extend the PDF definition to include URL links? A simple commenting convention like the links in AnswerBook documents for hypertext links might go a long way for interoperability. e.g. %%HTML \<a href="foo"> bar \</a> or %%Link ... Thanks for any pointers or "land mine" warnings. -- Gary R. Adams Email: Gary.Adams@East.Sun.COM Sun Microsystems Laboratories, Inc. Tel: (508) 442-0416 Two Elizabeth Drive Fax: (508) 250-5067 Chelmsford MA 01824-4195 USA (Sun mail stop: UCHL03-207) </message> <message id="<FUCHS.93Nov17002840@aye.nyu.edu>" date="2962484920"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 17 Nov 1993 00:28:40 UT From: "Matthew Fuchs" \<fuchs@graphics.cs.nyu.edu> Organization: Courant Institute of Mathematical Sciences Message-ID: \<FUCHS.93Nov17002840@aye.nyu.edu> References: <19931109.004@sfo.naggum.no> <19931110.018@sfo.naggum.no> <1993Nov11.134442.25810@gdstech.grumman.com> <1993Nov14.032534.7945@stats.govt.nz> <19931116.061326.666@almaden.ibm.com> Subject: Re: Bibliographies (was: Standard DTDs) I understand DTDs, etc., but might someone give some pointers to what an "architecture" is? The term is starting to show up often in this group. Thanks, Matthew [Editor's note: This is in reply to Eliot Kimber's article. \</E>] </message> <message id="<1993Nov17.091007.1446@edf.fr>" date="2962516207"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 17 Nov 1993 09:10:07 UT From: "Christophe Espert" \<espert@edf.fr> Organization: EDF Direction des Etudes et Recherches Message-ID: <1993Nov17.091007.1446@edf.fr> References: <1993Nov9.225810.25034@fripp.ri.cadre.com> Subject: Re: C++ Class Library for SGML?? [Joe Cascio] | Please pardon if this is a FAQ. I am trying to find out if there are | any C++ libraries available for free or for sale which present an API | to SGML documents and abstractions. Such an API/Library would allow | you to parse an SGML file, and be delivered a network of class or | struct instances linked together with pointers that represent the | semantic elements in the document. For instance, you might get an | instance of "SgmlElementDefn" that represented the content description | of the element (say "Chapter") that's found in the DTD. | | You would also get multiple instances of "SgmlElementInstance" for each | Chapter in the document. The instance would point to it's element | defn, and have a collection of pointers to the element instances | composing the Chapter. Such a thing exists today. It is called MarkMinder/HyMinder and can be purchased from TechnoTeacher, Inc. 1810 High Road Tallahassee. FL 32303-4408 USA Tel: 904-422-3574 Fax: 904 386 2562 You can also contact Dr. Steven R. Newcomb, TechnoTeacher's President by e-mail: srn@techno.com. MarkMinder is a set of C++ libraries to build SGML applications. It is beautifully designed and represents from my point of view a REAL SGML parsing system. You can of course do usual things such as validation, but MarkMinder allows you to do much more. MarkMinder will also represent the SGML substrate for TechnoTeacher's HyTime engine, HyMinder. I suggest you contact Steve Newcomb for more information, especially prices. (As I can remember the product is cheap.) I can also tell you that something big is going to come out in the public domain by the end of this year hopefully and it might be of interest for you. Regards, Chris -- Christophe Espert Electricite De France | Direction Etudes et Recherches | 1, Avenue du General de Gaulle | ISO/IEC 8879:1986 - SGML 92141 Clamart CEDEX - FRANCE | ISO/IEC 10744:1992 - HyTime Tel: 33.1.47.65.43.21 ext. 6635 | ISO/DIS 10179 - DSSSL Fax: 33.1.47.65.50.07 | E-mail:espert@cln46fw.der.edf.fr | </message> <message id="<2cdbda$dhd@figment.dircon.co.uk>" date="2962534250"> Newsgroups: comp.text,comp.text.desktop,comp.text.sgml Date: 17 Nov 1993 14:10:50 UT From: "Bruce Hunter" \<bruce@sgml.dircon.co.uk> Organization: SGML Systems Engineering Message-ID: <2cdbda$dhd@figment.dircon.co.uk> Subject: Quark Xpress Tags format Does anyone know where there is description of the Quark Xpress Tags form at for Version 3.11? The description of this format in the Reference Manual bears no relation to what is actually found in the files. Any help greatly appreciated. Thanks. Best wishes, -- Bruce Hunter SGML Systems Engineering bruce@sgml.dircon.co.uk </message> <message id="<199311171810.KAA24311@netcomsv.netcom.com>" date="2962538755"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 17 Nov 1993 15:25:55 UT From: Chet Ensign \<DOCCOE@IBIVM.IBMMAIL.COM> Message-ID: <199311171810.KAA24311@netcomsv.netcom.com> Subject: SGML Forum of NY Presents Peter Jerrum of Novell ANNOUNCEMENT: SGML FORUM OF NEW YORK The SGML Forum of New York invites you to attend Novell's Integrated Publishing System: an SGML Case Study Date: Tuesday, November 30, 1993, 5:30 p.m. Place: McGraw-Hill, Inc. 2nd Floor Conference Center 1221 Avenue of the Americas (lobby entrance off 49th Street) Agenda: 5:30 Registration and Opening Remarks 5:45 Keynote Speaker: Peter Jerrum, Novell Inc. "Novell's Integrated Publishing System" 6:30 Refreshments 7:00 Vendor Demonstration: Chip Pettibone, EBT Dynatext At our November meeting, Peter Jerrum, Director of Corporate Publications at Novell, Inc. will describe how Novell incorporated SGML into an established technical writing department in order to deliver the documentation for Netware Release 4.0 online. Novell's Integrated Publishing System introduced SGML with minimal disruption to the procedures or tools that their writers were already using. For our vendor presentation, Chip Pettibone, Regional Sales Manager for Electronic Book Technologies (EBT) will demonstrate Dynatext, an electronic publishing system that accepts and exploits SGML directly. Dynatext is the delivery engine used by Novell for their online manuals. Upcoming Programs: On January 18th, Tommie Usdin from ATLIS Consulting Group will talk about analyzing documents and developing DTDs. If you've wondered how this critical aspect of SGML system design is done, this session is for you. David Harkness of WordPerfect will demonstrate Intellitag, WordPerfect's tool for coupling SGML constructs to their popular word processor. About the Forum The SGML Forum of New York is a nonprofit organization devoted to the exchange of ideas and information about SGML. Organized primarily as a user group, the Forum seeks to promote an understanding of the scope and benefits of the SGML standard and to further its practical application within a variety of industries, including publishing, financial services, insurance, pharmaceuticals, and telecommunications. Membership helps support the Forum's activities, but it is not required for attending general meetings. If you would like to receive word about future Forum meetings, send your name and address to: SGML Forum of New York, Inc. Bowling Green Station P.O. Box 803 New York, NY 10274-0803 We will be happy to put you on our mailing list. </message> <message id="<19931117.151435.770@almaden.ibm.com>" date="2962545250"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 17 Nov 1993 17:14:10 UT From: "Eliot Kimber" \<drmacro@vnet.IBM.COM> Message-ID: <19931117.151435.770@almaden.ibm.com> Subject: IBMIDDOC Changes to Comply with HyTime Standard If you have received from us a copy of the IBMIDDoc DTD and/or documentation, please note that we are in the process of updating the hyperlinking design to make it completely HyTime conformant. When we started doing the IBMIDDoc design, our understanding of HyTime of was incomplete, and we made a few design choices that seemed reasonable at the time, but in retrospect, were not the best thing to do, now that we better understand HyTime. In short, we have resolved all the various attributes used to create specific types of hyperlinks (Annotations=, RetrievalAlts=, PropertyRef=, and Revisions=), into a set of defined anchor roles to be used in conjunction with a single Linkends= attribute. Thus, where in the old design you would specify retrieval alts like so: \<p retrievalalts="alt1 alt2"> You would now do: \<nameloc id=alts> \<nmlist>alt1 alt2\</nmlist> \</nameloc> \<p linkends="alts" anchorroles="alternate linksource"> Where the anchor roles "alternate and linksource" are IBMIDDoc-defined anchor roles, and the association of the alternate role to the Linkends= ID value "alts" indicates that the objects ultimately located are alternates of the linksource element. We have also removed the Docname= (our name for Docorsub=) from all elements except NMList, and are now allowing Nameloc within DataPool (phrase-level) content for convenience. While this change leads to more characters of markup, it is completely HyTime compliant. We are further assuming that editor functionality will be used to hide the complexity of the markup itself, letting authors focus on the semantics of the hyperlinks and not the details of their encodings. (This approach also suggested to me that part of any SGML application design should be an abstract definition of the authoring functionality the application designer expects to be provided in any conforming authoring implementation, parallel with an abstract definition of the processing functionality. In a sense you could think of this definition as the authoring "style" to be applied to the source document -- a nice bit of symmetry, I think). I am in the process of updating the documentation and Wayne is slaving over the DTD changes. If you've requested a copy of the IBMIDDoc documentation, I am delaying sending it out until these changes are finalized. -- Eliot Kimber Internet: drmacro@vnet.ibm.com Dept E14/B500 IBMMAIL: USIB2DK9@IBMMAIL Network Programs Information Development Phone: 1-919-254-5160 IBM Corporation Research Triangle Park, NC 27709 "But Ranger Doug, can't we just use some proprietary data format instead of this SGML stuff?" "Sure Slim, that would be the easy way, but it wouldn't be the Cowboy Way." </message> <message id="<19931118T085810Z@news.naggum.no>" date="2962547530"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 17 Nov 1993 17:52:10 UT From: "Steven R. Collard" \<Steve_Collard.SD@xerox.com> Message-ID: <19931118T085810Z@news.naggum.no> Subject: Documation '94 Conference/Expo, Feb 21-25, Los Angeles In light of recent requests of more advanced notice of conference information, here is the Documation '94 Conference Information forwarded from Marion Elledge of the GCA. Steve Collard Xerox/XSoft Publishing Systems San Diego, California ---------------------------------------------------------------- Please feel free to distribute the information on Documation '94 in the same fashion as SGML '93. Thanks, Marion L. Elledge (document@well.sf.ca) DOCUMATION '94 Conference and Exposition Century Plaza Hotel and Tower Los Angeles, California USA February 21-25, 1994 Frank Gilbane Conference Chair DOCUMATION '94 the international forum for document management applications, document systems and document computing Managing documents and the information they contain is the most important information management challenge facing businesses today. New products and technologies are reshaping the information technology industry as publishing, document management, workflow, imaging, database, retrieval, and computer system suppliers all focus on the problem of managing document information with the same flexibility and control we demand of corporate database applications. Document system technology has begun to have a profound impact on the way businesses operate in both local and competitive global environments, and will drive corporate information management strategies in the 90s. This is why document management is now widely recognized as the most critical client/server application for businesses to focus on. Documation is the annual event where the future direction of document management technology will be decided by corporate users and technology suppliers. At Documation you will see and hear what you need to know about document management applications. Help define the future of the document computing industry -- join us at Documation '94! GENERAL SESSION Tuesday Morning, February 22 Document, Data & Image Management 8:30 am - 12:30 pm Chair: Frank Gilbane, President, PTM, Publisher, The Gilbane Report Businesses looking for document management solutions are confronted with a variety of solutions from different segments of the information technology industry. There is a confusing and sometimes conflicting array of terminology being used. In the opening session our keynote speakers will address: What is document management? What are the roles of publishing, data base, document management,workflow/imaging and integration suppliers? Who is best equipped to supply you with a document management solution? General Session Keynotes: Charles M. Geschke, President & COO, Abobe Systems, Inc. Peter Lamb, Senior Partner, Andersen Consulting Mark Ruport, President & CEO, Interleaf, Inc. Larry Stevens, Vice President, Office Systems, Oracle Corporation Jordan Libit, Vice President, Marketing, FileNet Tuesday Afternoon, Tuesday, February 22 2:00 pm - 4:45 pm Document, Data & Image Management Sessions Track Chair: Matthew Shanahan, Manager, Andersen Consulting Document and image management have not only become high profile technologies, they are quickly becoming integral to organizations' information infrastructures. These technologies can easily frustrate or derail a project if they are deployed incorrectly or for the wrong reasons.The document management track will present sessions to help you plan successful deployment and alignment of document and image management systems within your information infrastructure. These sessions address the following questions: What are the tools that comprise document management? How can they be used to reengineer my business processes?, and What is the role of workflow? Understanding the state of the market is key to successfully implementing a project in the near term, but understanding current challenges and industry directions allow strategic technology decisions to be made. It is with this in mind that the document management track will investigate issues such as the role of object management and how to manage documents in conjunction with external data stores. The sessions that deal with these issues are intended to provide you with insight and inputinto industry technology directions. Tools of the Trade: What are the tools that comprise document management? Chair: Claude Finn, Vice President of Information Technologies, Datalogics Division of Frame Technology Corporation. Speakers: Brian Cassidy, Vice President, Saros Corporation John Newton, Chief Architect, DOCUMENTUM, Inc., David Ruiz, Director, Product Marketing, ViewStar Corporation Tools of the Trade will be a panel session that provides attendees with an inventory of tools and utilities, comprising a document management system. Rather that providing a top down definition of document management, the panelists of this session will define the tools and utilities that they feel are required within a document management system. Along with describing the tools, panelists will define the purpose of the tools and the motivations for incorporation the tools within a given system.Examples of these tools and utilities include version management,document access auditor, tool launchers, converters and archival mechanisms. Business Process Reengineering: How does document management change my business? Chair: Matt Shanahan, Manager, Andersen Consulting Speakers: Scott Wilson, Partner, Deloitte and Touche, Michael Devereol, Partner, Deloitte and Touche, Bill Braasch, President, Database Architects, Inc. The session will present three aspects of business process reengineering as it pertains to document management. The first presentation will cover a survey of document management implementations. The second presentation will develop a profile of process improvement opportunities within an organization and a set of metrics for verifying the process improvements. The third presentation will describe value-driven reengineering as a part of a document management systems implementation. The goal of this session is to develop an understanding of the role of document management within the organization, the metrics for managing success and methods for achieving successful business integration. Case Studies: Best of Breed Integration, Image and Document Integration, Project Life Cycle Chair: Catherine Leloup, Director, GEIE Gavel (France) Speakers: Paula Angerstein, Director, Product Development, Texcel (UK) Michael Polelle, Manager, Andersen Consulting, Helmut Faasch, Information Systems Engineering, Lufthansa German Airlines (Germany), Jean Louis Henriot, LASCOM (France), Gareth Lloyd, Westrn Provident Association This session will present a series of case studies about document management implementations. The goal of this session is to deliver practical considerations to attendees as the result of document management projects that have been implemented within the last year. The first case study will present a "best-of-breed" integration in which disparate authoring, document management and viewing tools were integrated into a seamless authoring and retrieval platform. The second case study will present a systems implementation that integrated image and document management. The third case study will present the life cycle of a document management project examining the development process from initial design to application roll-out. Workflow and Document Management: Competing or Complementary Technologies? Chair: Ronni Marshak, Editor & Chief, Workgroup Computing Report Speakers: Daniel Cheifetz, President, Odesta, Dave Seaman, President, InfoDesign, Frank Deven, Aldus Workflow is an important aspect of any document system. Workflow is the enabler that allows the processes associated with a document to be managed. This session answers the questions: How does workflow integrate with document management? and are workflow and document management competing technologies? As a panel session, the goal will be to develop a positioning of workflow within a document system. The session will provide a description of the role of workflow within a document system and the types of workflow a document system will encompass, e.g. ad-hoc, process-based and project-based. As a follow up, the session panelists will define the requirements of a workflow monitor. The panelists will additionally discuss the ability to integrate a workflow product with a document management product. Documents as Objects: Is It Necessary? Chair: Larry Bohn, Senior Vice President, Business Development, Interleaf, Inc. Speakers: Tom Atwood, Chairman, Object Design Others to be announced Document management systems are increasingly using object-based technologies to model and encapsulate documents. Is an object oriented technology ultimately required to manage documents? Is it relational technology that is required?, or is it both? The goal of this session is to help managers make decision on technology directions for methodologies, development tools and databases. This session will examine the object issue by examining the factors influencing the object decision. Factors include data type support in relational databases, inheritance of document attributes and behavior (reuse), techniques for object encapsulation (e.g. SGML), techniques for encapsulating behavior (e.g. RPC), version control and performance. Managing Collections: Managing Large Numbers of Documents and Multiple External Databases Chair: Michael Rogers, Director, Information Technology Products, SunSoft Inc. Speakers to be announced Document management systems not only manage a single instance of a document but must in many cases manage collections of documents and relationships to multiple external data stores. This session will investigate the techniques required to manage collections and relationships. The synchronization, transaction control and interchange. The goal of this session is to provide attendees with a background for making technology decisions concerning document management of thousands of documents and collections of documents that are tightly integrated to external systems. Wednesday, February 23, General Session Document System Technology 8:30 am - 10:30 am Chair: Frank Gilbane Some corporate requirements for management of complex document information can only be efficiently achieved with low level support from operating environments. In this session our keynote presenters will provide a look at what is coming and what we need in the form of compound document architectures, document-oriented interfaces, and other platform technologies that will facilitate document management and information delivery. General Session Keynotes: Larry Tesler, Chief Scientist, Apple Computer Bruce Tognazzini, Distinguished Engineer, Sun Microsystems Invited Speaker to be announced Vertical Industry Senior Executive Forum 11:00 am - 12:30 pm Chair: Frank Gilbane Large vertical industries face similar document management problems, yet use different terminology and sometimes choose different kinds of solutions. In this session we will examine what document management problems some of these industries have in common, and where they differ. You will hear from leading executives in four vertical industries talk about the important document management challenges they face, and what they require from suppliers and integrators to meet them. Speakers: Ed Jowdy, Senior Vice President, Information Technology, Aetna Life & Casualty Fred Mitchell, Vice President, Customer Service, The Boeing Company Charles Popper, Vice President, Corporate Computer Resources, Merck & Company Donald G. Hedeen, Director, Desktops and Deployment, General Motors Corporation Wednesday Afternoon 2:00 pm - 4:45 pm Document Creation & Capture: Standards, Technology and Applications Sessions Chair: Jack Gold, The Meta Group This track includes corporate publishing application case studies and covers technical issues in the creation component of document systems. How can SGML provide for interoperability between authoring and document management systems? How do you decide which kind of authoring system you need to meet your company's information management requirements? Which new technologies for authoring systems are ready for prime time? What are the authoring issues you need to be aware of when creating information for electronic delivery? What technologies are being developed to "image enable" horizontal applications? What is the state-of-the-art in scanning and recognition software? Interoperability Success Stories & Challenges Chair: Pamela Gennusa, Chief Marketing Officer, SGML Open Speakers: Companies who have implemented SGML systems In this session members of the SGML Open consortium will host customers who will describe the challenges they face integrating authoring, publishing and database systems in ways that allow them to share and re-use structured information. SGML Open members will describe how the work of the consortium addresses these challenges. Learn why so many companies have chosen SGML as a foundation for managing information in documents. Choosing An Authoring System for Corporate Applications Chair: Linda Burman, Director of Marketing, SoftQuad Inc. Speakers: David Harkness, Director, Electronic Publishing Tools, WordPerfect Corporation, Yuri Rubinsky, President, SoftQuad Inc. Others from Frame, InContext to be announced. In this session vendors of word processors, structured authoring, and WYSIWYG authoring systems will each describe the kinds of applications best suited to their type of authoring system. Conversion, database integration, and demanding publishing applications all impose requirements on authors. Is there a single best solution for you? Advanced Authoring Technology for Corporate Publishing Chair: Craig Cline, Associate Editor, Seybold Publications Speakers: Doug Gorman, President, Information Mapping; Lisa Wellman, Industry Manager, Publishing, Apple Computer; Lorraine Fox, Manager, Interactive Services Strategy, Sun Microsystems Computer Company Authoring systems that only allow for the creation of black and white text and illustrations are no longer sufficient for many kinds of technical documentation, training, and other corporate publishing applications.Electronic delivery for desktops and PDAs as well as low cost color printers are upping the ante. Hypertext, color, and multimedia support are all being added to authoring systems. This session will discuss the challenges these new features entail, and what makes sense to implement today, and what strategies make sense for the future. Image-Enabling Horizontal Applications Chair: Keith Dawson, Contributing Editor, The Gilbane Report Speakers: Kevin Strehlo, Executive Editor, Reviews and Testing, InfoWorld; David Skok, President, Watermark; John Hoy, Marketing Manager, Kodak Imagery Document imaging is moving from a specialized application towards a horizontal system service. Solutions are becoming available that enable a broad range of applications on a network to make use of faxes, scanned pages, and other kinds of images. Infrastructure is being developed that will provide the document-management and storage-management services that imaging requires for the same broad range of applications. Panel members will provide perspectives on the development, present reality,and future direction of image as a data type. Technical Documentation Case Studies: Government Applications Chair: Robin Tomlin, Senior Manager, Federal & Industrial Publishing Solutions, Intergraph Corporation Speakers: Horace Layton, Senior Project Manager, Computer Sciences Corporation, Donald Rollert and James Byers, Government Printing Office. Others to be announced. This session provides an opportunity to hear from users involved in large government technical document system applications. Standards issues for forms, IETMs (Interactive Electronic Technical Manuals), and CALS,integration, document distribution, and costs and benefits will all be covered. Compound Documents: Using Compound Document Architectures With Document Management Systems Chair: Richard Hay, Vice President, Marketing, DOCUMENTUM, Inc. Speakers: Kurt Piersol, Software Architect, Apple Computer, Paul Grosso, Vice President, Arbortext. Others to be announced. Document authoring or capture tools provide mechanisms for constructing large documents from graphics, tables, data from other applications and multiple sub documents. A document built from multiple object types is typically called a compound document and while authoring tools support a document's construction, the document management tools assume that the compound document will be stored in the directories of the computer's file system, not in a document repository. This session will examine the issues of managing compound documents using a repository both in terms of what is possible in the market today and what the approaches will be in the future. Compound document technologies examined include Object Linking and Embedding, OpenDoc, proprietary architectures and SGML. Thursday, February 24, General Session Document Presentation & Distribution 8:30 am - 10:30 am Chair: Frank Gilbane There is no hotter topic these days than electronic document delivery. Businesses are already implementing electronic delivery systems and reducing document distribution costs. Businesses also have many requirements for rapid delivery of paper documents, and will for the foreseeable future. There are still challenges facing companies who want to implement on-demand document delivery for either electronic or paper media, including support for color, multimedia, or hypernavigation, and integrating a delivery system with a document management system. Our keynote presenters will discuss the challenges and predict how document delivery applications will evolve. General Session Keynotes: Ed Heresniak, Senior Vice President, Information Technology, McGraw-Hill Ron Brumback, Senior Vice President, Information Management Services & Products, R.R. Donnelley & Sons Dennis Andrews, President, X-Soft Thursday Vertical Industry Tracks 11:00 am - 12:30 pm Each of the four vertical industry sessions (automotive, aviation, insurance, and pharmaceutical) will be devoted to the most critical document management problem facing each industry. Hear representatives from each of these industries discuss the requirements they face, and what they are doing to meet them. This is an opportunity to see and learn from what other industries are doing to manage documents and document information. Commerical Aviation Chair: Frank Ruggiero, Manager, Technology Development, The Boeing Company Speakers: Peter M. Morton, Director, Customer Training, Boeing Commercial Airplane Group, Lou Mancini, Vice President Engineering and Fleet Operations, Northwest Airlines Inc. Ron Sorenson, Director Information Technology, Canadian Air International (Retired) Dave Fastenow, Director Integration Technology Management, Collins Air Transport Div., Rockwell International Pharmaceutical Chair: Fred Moehle, Consultant Speakers: Barry Behnken, Director Quality Control, Schwarz-Pharma, Dennis Devonshuk, CANDA Task Force, Miles Pharmaceuticals, Dr.Joshua Sharline, Reviewer FDA Center for Veterinary Medicine Automotive Chair: Connie Greaser, Manager, Service Communications, American Honda Company Speakers to be announced. Insurance Chair: Richard Stover, Editor, Document Management & Windows Imaging Magazine Speakers: Lou Londono, Assistant Vice President & Director AMS Strategic Systems, ITT Hartford George McKenna, President, Roll Systems. Others to be announced. Thursday Afternoon: Document Distribution Sessions 2:00 pm - 4:45 pm Track Chair: Mary Laplante, President, Laplante & Associates Meeting the Challenge of Electronic Document Distribution Chair: Jamie Popkin, The Gartner Group Speakers: Kent Summers, Director, Marketing, Electronic Book Technologies, Bill Freeland, Product Marketing Manager, Interleaf Inc. Clint Nagy, Vice President, Adobe Systems, Rick Dillhoff, CEO, InfoAccess, Robert J. Glushko, Chief Scientist, Passage Systems Inc. In this session, vendors and their customers discuss real-world applications for electronic document delivery products and technologies. Vendor panelists will briefly describe their company, their products, and the capabilities that make them unique in the marketplace. Customer panelists will describe their business problems, the solutions that they developed, and how they leveraged their vendors' product strengths to solve the problems and create competitive advantage. The team discussions are preceded by an overview of electronic document delivery, including a report on the current state-of-the-art and methodology for determining the benefits and risks of implementing electronic distribution within your company. Managing Document Printing and Distribution Chair: Brian Corrigan, Pesko and Associates Speakers: Ron Arelano, Director, Publishing Operations, F.W. Dodge, Carolyn Strong, Test and Measurement, Documentation Manager, Tektronix. Others to be announced. Companies with large-scale document production and distribution requirements can be overwhelmed by the challenges involved in publishing, printing, and distributing hundreds of thousands of documents a year. In this session, speakers describe how their companies are successfully meeting these challenges. They will explain how their organizations saved money, reduced production time, and improved reader satisfaction with various print-related technologies including: - On-demand printing - Automatic production and distribution of customized documents - Network printing architectures Delivering Performing-Critical Information Chair: Jim Giles, Senior Research Fellow, Logistics Management Institute Speakers: Jeff Pepper, President, ServiceWare, Inc., Harry Caplowitz, President, InfoData Systems, Inc. Others to be announced. Performance-critical documents are documents that support the optimum performance of task-related work. They convey knowledge and information that helps people execute tasks more efficiently, more effectively, and more consistently. Such documents play an important role in customer and product support environments, where users need fast access to very specific information. This session explains how business organizations can leverage their investment in corporate knowledge by using leading-edge document distribution technologies to deliver performance-critical documents an realize the benefits associated with getting the right information to the right people at the right time. Automating Document Distribution Chair: Janet Endrijonas, Editor, Managing Automation Speakers: Steven Kiser, Vice President, Business Development, XSoft Others to be announced. Many companies have attempted to address the challenges of reducing costs, improving productivity, and enhancing quality by automating manufacturing and production processes. This session looks at some of those automation efforts and examines how they can serve as models for automating the distribution of documents, both print and electronic. What do the successes -- and the failures -- tell us? How can we apply the economic, social, and technical lessons we've learned from automating other business processes to building information distribution systems for the 21st century? Keep the Customer Satisfied: Assessing Requirements for Document Distribution Chair: Carlton Neville, Consultant Speakers: Les Cowan, Publisher, Micro Publishing News Carmen Egido, Bellcore The new technologies for generating and distributing documents can offer great potential for economic and productivity benefits within your company. But how do they affect people outside your organization? Most importantly, what impact will your decision to adopt new document technologies have on your customers? In this session, speakers share their experiences with assessing customer response to new distribution methods. They also offer practical advice on evaluating customer-related risks and on helping them to make the technology transition with you. Additional Conference Speakers Confirmed Colin Brace, Editor, Language Industry Monitor, Harvey Spencer, Harvey Spencer Associates, Ken Goist, Senior Information Analyst, Computer Task Group, Steve Sklepowich, Product Marketing Manager, Apple Computer Tim Bray, Founder, Open Text, Paul Deccico, Partner, Branscomb, Decicco, Copelowitz & Quinn. About the sponsors -- What is GCA? GCA is a volunteer non-profit membership association formed in 1966 to apply computer technology to printing and publishing. Its purpose is to bring about the coordination among industry segments that is necessary to apply technologies and in other ways increase productivity and market responsiveness in the creation, manufacture, distribution, management and marketing of information. GCA currently has over 40 working committees developing industry specifications and standards and providing solutions to a number of document production and delivery issues. GCA sponsors a number of annual conferences, such as the TechDoc Series, Spectrum and Color Connections and tutorials providing the forums for examining a vast number of topics and technology advancements, presenting solutions, and encouraging user to user and user to supplier interface. What is PTM & The Gilbane Report? Publishing Technology Management, Inc., is publisher of The Gilbane Report on Open Information and Document Systems, and an independent international consulting organization specializing in open information technology. The Gilbane Report covers the same issues being addressed at Documation. PTM provides consulting service and seminars in the U.S. and Europe on document systems, document management and electronic delivery. PTM clients include: the U.S. government, computer manufacturers, software suppliers, aerospace and manufacturing companies, and system integrators. What is GCARI? GCARI, the Graphic Communications Association Research Institute, is a nonprofit organization devoted to the support of technological advancements in information technology and graphic arts through the establishment, coordination and funding of research and development to create and apply new opportunities for information managment and dissemination. The Documation Exposition The Documation Exposition will showcase the latest in open document and information systems technology and applications. Suppliers participating in the exposition will represent publishing systems and software, database management software, document storage and retrieval systems, information management systems, imaging systems, conversion software, client/server architectures and multiple platform solutions. Over 30,000 square feet of exposition space has been reserved. If your organization is interested in exhibiting, please contact Tanya Bosse at GCARI. Telephone (703) 519-8174. Exposition space may be reserved after July 5. There will be a major emphasis on new product releases and press announcements. The Documation Exposition will be managed by GCARI. All income from the Exposition will be used for research and development. Exposition hours Tuesday, February 22 12:30 pm - 8:00 pm Wednesday, February 23 10:00 am - 7:00 pm Thursday, February 24 10:00 am -7:00 pm Exhibitors to date include: Andersen Consulting Arbortext CALS Journal Computer Sciences Corporation Computer Task Group Database Publishing Systems Data Conversion Laboratory Datalogics Documentum Electronic Book Technologies Exoterica FileNet Frame Technologies GCA GCARI ICL, Ltd. Information Dimensions Inc. InfoAccess InContext InfoDesign Intergraph Interleaf Inc. PTM SoftQuad Inc. SGML Open Texcel Ltd. US Army Printing & Publishing US Lynx Westinghouse Xerox Corporation X-Soft Xyvision Tutorials - Monday, February 21, 1994 Tutorials precede Documation '94 to provide up-to-speed/or in-depth discussions of mainstream issues to be addressed during the conference program. These sessions will provide conference participants with a better understanding of the terminology, methodology and technology discussed in the following three days. Introduction to Document Management The term "document management" has a different meaning to anyone you ask to define the term. And one definition is probably just as good as any other. This session will take a look at the basic concepts of document management and attempt to provide a better understanding of how to define it; what processes are involved; the terminology; and available technology. Industry Standards Can you define the following standards? CCITT, TIFF, SGML, DSSSL, HyTime, ODA, SQL, CGM. Can you make the decision on which to use in your organization? What are the benefits of one over another? How does one work with the others? What products are available today to support these standards? This session will provide a guide to industry standards and how each plays a role in the overall process of document management. Electronic Distribution A number of options are available today for the electronic distribution of information. How must information be created and managed to allow for the method of electronic distribution that you chose? What technology is available now to support delivery of information through electronic books,online and optical disks? How does electronic mail play a role? Imaging & Workflow What are the components of an imaging system? What are the unique aspects of imaging? How does image processing fit into an organization's overall document management philosophy? What is the relationship between imaging and electronic workflow? What technologies support electronic workflow? This session will provide answers to these questions and present examples of existing applications. Database Technology A number of issues must be addressed in building an organizational database. How is the information to be accessed? For what purposes will the information be used? What are the advantages of object-oriented database technologies over relational? Will the database be centralized or decentralized? Is security an issue? Does SGML meet organizational requirements? What tools are available today to support document management? Authoring & Copyright Issues As documents go electronic, information can be re-used in ways that its author never intended. Who "owns" electronic documents? Does it matter whether the author is an employee? What about multimedia -- are the rules the same for text, graphics, sound or movies? What kinds of re-use are permitted under the law? What constitutes permission? How far must corporations go to police their employees' use of information? What if you also do business oveseas -- whose law applies? In this sesson we look at the many questions corporations must ask themselves when doing business in the electronc age, and we discuss tools and procedures that can help firms minimize their liability. Industry Advisory Board Representatives from the following organizations serve on the Industry Advisory Board: Adobe Systems Aetna Life and Casualty American Honda Andersen Consulting Apple Computer Avalanche Development Company The Boeing Company Computer Task Group Documentum EDS Frame Technology The Gartner Group GEIE Gavel InfoAccess Intergraph Corporation Interleaf, Inc. McGraw-Hill Merck & Company Novell Object Design Oracle Corporation R.R. Donnelley & Sons SoftQuad, Inc. Sun Microsystems Texcel Xerox Corporation Xyvision Media Advisory Board Mark Walter - Seybold Report on Publishing Systems Janet Endrijonas - Managing Automation Karyl Scott, David Strom - InfoWorld Esther Dyson - Release 1.0 Jeff Hill - CALS Journal Yves Stern - Argos (France) Caroline Pinola - Database Advisor Dave Churbuck - Forbes Les Cowen - Micropublishing Report John Verity - Business Week Chris Locke - Internet Business Report Thomas Temin - Government Computer News Ronni Marshak - Workgroup Computing Report Dale Waldt - \<TAG> Colin Brace - Language Industry Monitor (Netherlands) Richard Stover - Document Management & Windows Imaging Country Agents Catherine LeLoup - France Pam Gennusa - United Kingdom Eric van Herwijnen - Switzerland Ping-Shia Kung - Taiwan Akira Mizobuchi - Japan Tibor Tsechke - Germany Per-Olof Jonasson - Sweden User Group Meetings Industry associations, working groups, standards committees and user groups are encouraged to hold meetings prior to or immediately following Documation '94. Meeting rooms will be provided by GCA. Space is limited. FOR MORE INFORMATION: For more information on the Documation Conference program contact: Frank Gilbane, President, PTM Telephone: (617) 643-8855 FAX: (617) 643-0678 E-mail: fgilbane@world.std.com or Marion Elledge, Vice President, Information Technologies, GCA Telephone: (703) 519-8193 FAX: (703) 548-2867 E-mail: document@well.sf.ca.us For exposition details and information contact: Tanya Bosse, Exposition Manager, GCARI Telephone: (703) 519-8174 FAX: (703) 548-2867 E-mail: document@well.sf.ca.us Hotel Information The Documation '94 conference and exposition will take place at the Century Plaza Hotel and Tower, 2025 Avenue of the Stars, Los Angeles, California. A block of rooms has been reserved at the conference rate of $119 single/double in the Century Plaza, and $160 single/double in the Tower. These rates do not include tax currently at 12.5%. For reservations, contact the hotel reservations department direct at (213) 551-3300 or toll free (800) 228-3000 for accommodations. A deposit equal to the room rate for one night, or a major credit card number is required to confirm reservations. Reservations and deposits received after January 19, 1994 will be confirmed on a space available basis only. Check-in time is 3:00 pm. Check-out is 1:00 pm. REGISTRATION MAIL registration form to GCA, (check or credit card only) 100 Daingerfield Rd., Alexandria, VA 22314-2888; OR PHONE registration (credit card only): Call 703-519-8160; OR FAX registration (credit card only): FAX form to 703-548-2867 GCA Member: $745 Non-Member of GCA: $895 Exposition Only Sign up now! Save $25: Pre-register before February 4 for FREE admission to the Exposition. Register by mail or fax. Conference registration include exposition. Please register me for the following: (check appropriate boxes): [ ] Tutorials [ ] Introduction to Document Management [ ] Industry Standards [ ] Electronic Distribution [ ] Imaging & Workflow [ ] Database Technology [ ] Authoring & Copyright Issues [ ] Documation '94 Conference [ ] Exposition only Name (as you wish it to appear on badge): Title:_____________________________________________________________ Company:___________________________________________________________ Street Address/Mail Stop/Suite:____________________________________ City/State/Zip:____________________________________________________ Country:___________________________________________________________ Telephone Number:__________________________________________________ Fax:_______________________________________________________________ E-Mail:____________________________________________________________ Payment Payment accepted in US Funds only, payable to GCA. [ ] Visa [ ] MasterCard [ ] AmEx Credit card #______________________________________________________ expiration date_____________ Name on card:______________________________________________________ Signature:_________________________________________________________ Cancellations There is a $100 cancellation fee for cancellation before February 7, 1994. After that date registrants are liable for the entire registration fee. Cancellations must be received in writing. Substitutions are welcome. ICO9421 </message> <message id="<1993Nov18.105352.22805@newsserver.rrzn.uni-hannover.de>" date="2962608832"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 18 Nov 1993 10:53:52 UT From: "Stephan Olbrich" \<zzol@ipc1.rrzn.uni-hannover.de> Organization: RRZN Message-ID: <1993Nov18.105352.22805@newsserver.rrzn.uni-hannover.de> References: <199311081605.IAA04086@mail.netcom.com> Subject: Re: G4 Decompression Algorithms [Lori Snyder] | Does anyone know where I can find algorithms for CCITT G4 decompression | for a Unix X-platform or any library routines or any conversion | utilities to convert G4 to X11 bitmap? | | We are in the process of converting a hypertext product for a DOS | platform to Unix. Any information would greatly be appreciated. There are sources that includes compression/decompression of G4 coding in the TIFF tools, available at sgi.com (192.48.153.1) in directory graphics/tiff. -- // Stephan Olbrich voice: +511 762 4720 or \\\\ // RRZN/Universitaet Hannover +511 762 3078 \\\\ // Schlosswender Str. 5 fax : +511 762 3003 \\\\ // D-30159 Hannover email: olbrich@rrzn.uni-hannover.d400.de \\\\ </message> <message id="<2cfme5INN1r6@nestroy.wu-wien.ac.at>" date="2962611077"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 18 Nov 1993 11:31:17 UT From: Rony Flatscher \<Rony.Flatscher@wu-wien.ac.at> Organization: Vienna University of Economics and Business Administration Message-ID: <2cfme5INN1r6@nestroy.wu-wien.ac.at> Subject: SGML on OS/2: EPM ? In the online-help (help -> product information -> list box), there is an "advertisement" about upcoming SGML-authoring tools. Does anyone from IBM know the status of this project? What would be included, when would it be available? ---rony </message> <message id="<2cfniu$1ds0@ina.zfn.uni-bremen.de>" date="2962612254"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 18 Nov 1993 11:50:54 UT From: "Projekt FORAUS" \<foraus@alf.zfn.Uni-Bremen.DE> Organization: Universitaet Bremen Message-ID: <2cfniu$1ds0@ina.zfn.uni-bremen.de> Subject: ICA & QWERTZ Hello! We are a little student project working on an SGML-Textbased-System. Now we got some informations that 2 Public Textsystems exists, called ICA & QWERTZ - but no one could tell us were we could get them. Could someone here help us??? Please EMail us directly! Project Foraus foraus@alf.zfn.uni-bremen.de Thanx :) </message> <message id="<1993Nov18.131004.28005@cscs.ch>" date="2962617004"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Followup-To: poster Date: 18 Nov 1993 13:10:04 UT From: "Nicole Vecchi" \<nvecchi@cscs.ch> Organization: Centro Svizzero di Calcolo Scientifico / CH-6928 Manno Message-ID: <1993Nov18.131004.28005@cscs.ch> Subject: User Group Meeting in Zurich? I heard that there's a user's group meeting in Zurich next week -- could someone confirm that with more definitive information? Thanks! Nicole </message> <message id="<2cgfpr$5ll@fitz.TC.Cornell.EDU>" date="2962637051"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 18 Nov 1993 18:44:11 UT From: "Steve J. Lombardi" \<stlombo@eos.acm.rpi.edu> Organization: The Voice of Fate Message-ID: <2cgfpr$5ll@fitz.TC.Cornell.EDU> Subject: Looking for SGML consultant (short term) We're looking for an SGML consultant to help us sort through the maze of software options. This is a paid position. It would be advantageous if you were located in the Northeast. we're in Albany, NY. If interested please call steve lombardi at 518-436-8647 or send email to stlombo@acm.rpi.edu thanks. -- | steve lombardi | She won't get out of the tub. She stlombo@acm.rpi.edu | has morning wood. -- Beavis | </message> <message id="<NORM.93Nov18142537@ruby.ora.com>" date="2962639536"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 18 Nov 1993 19:25:36 UT From: "Norman Walsh" \<norm@ora.com> Organization: O'Reilly and Associates, Inc. Message-ID: \<NORM.93Nov18142537@ruby.ora.com> Subject: sgml-mode in emacs 19? I've just started trying to use the sgml-mode that comes with Emacs 19, and I can't seem to get next-error to parse sgmls output. Before I go digging around, has anyone else been able to make this work? Here's an example of my *compilation* buffer, if that helps. cd ~/ report test.sgm Validating test.sgm using sgmls version 1.1 sgmls: SGML error at test.sgm, line 4 at ">": PARA end-tag implied by PARA start-tag; not minimizable Element structure: DOCBOOK CHAPTER sgmls: SGML error at test.sgm, line 4 at "s": CHAPTER end-tag implied by data; not minimizable Element structure: DOCBOOK sgmls: SGML error at test.sgm, line 4 at "s": Out-of-context data ended DOCBOOK document element (and parse) ... testing is completed. Compilation finished at Thu Nov 18 14:24:55 </message> <message id="<lenrandCGpn7C.Lo9@netcom.com>" date="2962653239"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 18 Nov 1993 23:13:59 UT From: "Len Rand" \<lenrand@netcom.com> Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest) Message-ID: \<lenrandCGpn7C.Lo9@netcom.com> Summary: Looking for source of descriptive documentation Subject: SGML spec Can anyone give me a source on the net for a description of SGML and a spec on its syntax? I've done a quick ARCHIE search, but haven't found what I'm looking for (I'm a new, and somewhat inexperienced user of the internet, so I may have missed the obvious). Please mail me the answer directly. Thanks, Len Rand -- +--------------------------------+ | From: Len Rand | | lenrand@netcom.com | | compuserve: 72570,1506 | +--------------------------------+ </message> <message id="<4728@newton.mdavcr.mda.ca>" date="2962720720"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 19 Nov 1993 17:58:40 UT From: "Duncan Fraser" \<djf@mdavcr.mda.ca> Message-ID: <4728@newton.mdavcr.mda.ca> Subject: Where are: FAQ? DTD's? I'm looking for an SGML FAQ, and any standard (approved, de facto, whatever) DTD's I can get my hands on. Thanks -- Duncan Fraser (djf@mda.ca) Research Dept., MacDonald Dettwiler Richmond, B.C., Canada </message> <message id="<19931119.012@sfo.naggum.no>" date="2962765413"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 20 Nov 1993 06:23:33 UT From: Erik Naggum \<erik@naggum.no> Message-ID: <19931119.012@sfo.naggum.no> Subject: About comp.text.sgml, archives, FAQs, etc. This messages contains some information about the newsgroup, and assorted services related to the newsgroup. If you are about to ask _the_ most frequently asked question on this newsgroup, "where is the FAQ?", you will find the answer below. For future revisions of the FAQ, it would be helpful if people could give some indication of what they are looking for when they ask this question. The newsgroup's topic is "ISO 8879 SGML, structured documents, markup languages," as it was defined when the newsgroup was created by Edward Vielmetti in September of 1990. Ed sent out the Call for Votes on 1990-08-02, but I have lost track of the actual creation date; it was probably the first week of September, 1990. The earliest trace of e-mail about comp.text.sgml that I have seen dates back to 1990-01-20, so if we let history begin with the year 1990, we are not off by too much. The Standard Generalized Markup Language (SGML) itself was created by Charles Goldfarb, and through an excruciatingly slow and painful process known as "standardization", the specification for the language was published by the International Organization for Standardization, ISO, in 1986 as ISO 8879:1986, full title "Information processing -- Standard Generalized Markup Language (SGML)". A few fixes to the specification were published in 1988, called Amendment 1, ISO 8879/A1:1988. Charles Goldfarb's work dates back to the late 1960's, with the very successful language GML, for Generalized Markup Language, or Goldfarb, Mosher, and Lorie. More on the history of the language can be found in the article "A Brief History of the Development of SGML", available in _The SGML Handbook_, the reference for which is near the end of this message. The standard, like all ISO standards, is available from ISO in Geneva, and from various national standards bodies, such as the American National Standards Institute (ANSI) in the U.S., British Standards (BS) in the U.K., Deutsche Institut fuer Normierung (DIN) in Germany, Association Francaise de Normalisation (AFNOR) in France. However, instead of going to any of these standards bodies for copies, use _The SGML Handbook_. It contains the entire standard, annotated by the creator and editor of the standard, as well as incorporating the amendment and some clarifications of difficult parts of the standard. The standard is _not_ available electronically. In the first few months of its existence, sufficiently interesting material had been posted to the newsgroup that I wanted an archive of the newsgroup. This was at the time when I was trying to figure out what the "Entity end" really meant, so if anyone can attest to the usefulness of USENET as a means of learning and open communication between interested people, it is me. The first article in the archive is dated 1991-03-20, although almost 300 articles had appeared in the newsgroup before that time. Systematic archiving did not start until early April 1991, but from then on, every article that has appeared on the newsgroup, with the exception of canceled articles, has been archived. The archive is found at FTP.IFI.UIO.NO in /pub/SGML/comp.text.sgml. There are two trees: by.date and by.msgid, so that retrieval can be by these two keys. The first article is "by.date/1991/03/20/114250.Lennestal" and also known as "by.msgid/3635@lulea.telesoft.se". The time format in the by.date tree should be obvious given that time on USENET is usually GMT (aka UTC.) In addition to anonymous FTP, the archive can be accessed through the WAIS source "comp.text.sgml.src". The SGML archive contains more than the newsgroup archive. At the time of writing, it contains the ARC SGML parser by Charles Goldfarb in the directory "ARC-SGML", the Amsterdam SGML Parser in "ASP-SGML", some information about the Computer-assisted Acquisition and Logistics Support standards from the DoD in "CALS", a list of ISO 10646-1:1993 names and character numbers for use with SGML systems in "CHARSET", proceedings of the Davenport group in "DAVENPORT", various user-supplied programs in "DEMO", some public document type definitions in "DTD", some public entity sets in "ENTITIES", a draft set of answers to Frequently Asked Questions in the file "FAQ.0.0", the FORMAT package that handles SGML-to-LaTeX mapping in the directory "FORMAT", some information about the now approved ISO standard ISO 10744 Hypermedia/Time-based Structuring Language in "HyTime", the distribution images of the Interactive Authoring and Display System in "IADS", the Integrated Chameleon Architecture version 1.5 in "ICA", an enhanced version by James Clark of the ARC SGML parser in "SGMLS", some information about the SGML Users' Group Special Interest Group on Hypertext and Multimedia in "SIGhyper", archives of the Text Encoding Initiative in "TEI", Robin Cover's excellent bibliography in the file "bibliography", some useful Emacs-lisp functions in the directory "elisp", and the recently published comprehensive list of ISO standards that users of SGML might find interesting, compiled by Heather Davenport, in file "standards". The SGML archive is liberal in what it accepts. Requests for information on how to put things in the archive can be obtained by writing the archive maintainer at \<SGML.archive@ifi.uio.no>. The newsgroup archive is updated manually, after articles have been edited to obtain a consistent style of presentation. Excessive quoted text (e.g., signatures and cascades) is trimmed, and the article is reformatted. Spelling is normalized and capitalization is applied where missing or wrong, but no other changes are made. The edited articles are also available on a mailing list that helps people who are not able to receive or post USENET news get access to the newsgroup. The mailing list service consists of two parts: a news-to-mail service that distributes archived articles, and a mail-to-news service that allows non-USENET users to post articles. The mail-to-news service has _one_ restriction on posting: if the article quotes something that has not appeared on the newsgroup, the article will not be posted immediately, but held, waiting for the quoted article to appear. If it does not, the article is returned to the author with a request that an appropriate copyright or "reprinted by permission" note is attached. USENET effectively removes copyright from articles, unless the author take great pains to protect to it, so text that is already copyright by someone else, or, worse, is private communication, must not be distributed. Other than this rule, everything will be posted, although I do reserve the right to discourage posting. Insisting that it be posted works, though. Since you read this article either on the mailing list or in the newsgroup, keep the following for friends who ask for information. If you have previously quoted from similar articles by me, _please_ note that I have changed the addresses a few times, but that I intend to keep these. To subscribe, send a note to \<comp-text-sgml-request@naggum.no>. You will be added to the mailing list if I can talk to a system that is willing to accept mail for you and which does not send error messages to wrong places. (Well-known culprits include cc:Mail and Microsoft Mail, so if you rely on either of these, kindly make a request to your systems administrator that he get something that works all the time.) To post an article, send it to \<comp-text-sgml@news.naggum.no>. If you reply to an article you have received from the mailing list, this will be automatic. The only thing I ask you to do is to keep the article number that appears in the Subject header, including the brackets to distinguish it from anything else in the header. If you don't, it will take me more time to post the article, and this may cause delays. If you look for the definition of SGML, there is only one place to go at present: Charles F. Goldfarb: The SGML Handbook; Oxford University Press, 1990. ISBN 0-19-853737-9. This book will set you back almost $100, but will also answer all your questions about the language itself. The rest may be in the archive. If you have Internet access, you are well advised to search it. Several issues have been discussed a few times over, and in the absence of any strong reason to want to stop further discussion, the archive material should be regarded as background material rather than authoritative answers, even though the authoritative answer may be found therein. No attempt has been made to mark those articles, however. A word of encouragement as well as caution: Everybody who is something in the SGML world, in particular the creator of the language and the ISO working group that defined SGML, as well as several vendors of outstanding SGML products, are listening to what you say in this newsgroup. If you have problems with the language or an implementation of it in a product, or with implementing it, and particularly if you have a suggestion for a solution to some problem, you may find that your article is quoted at ISO meetings and taken very seriously by vendors. Know that your voice is heard, and that your input is very much appreciated. In fact, the archive for this newsgroup is a source of information for the review process now taking place in the ISO working group. As of early November, the estimated readership of this newsgroup was 36,000 people, up 4,000 from October. 78% of the USENET community receives the newsgroup on their system, and can read it if they want to, down 1% from October. In October, 178 messages comprising 495K were posted to the newsgroup. Only 2% of the articles are crossposted to other newsgroups, which indicates a continued and specific need for the newsgroup, although only 1% of the total USENET readership reads it. The newsgroup with the highest readership is news.announce.newusers with 12.6% share of the readership, for a total of 470,000, followed by alt.sex.stories with 8.1% share, and 300,000 readers. This indicates the diversity of USENET, if nothing else. Amidst all this diversity (read: chaos), this newsgroup has been known for the highest "signal to noise ratio" on USENET over its three years of existence, and this can only continue with the support of readers like you. Best regards, \</Erik> -- Erik Naggum \<erik@naggum.no> \<SGML@netcom.com> ISO 8879 SGML Chairman, SGML SIGhyper \<SGML.SIGhyper@naggum.no> ISO 10744 HyTime "Memento, terrigena. Memento, vita brevis." ISO 10646 UCS </message> <message id="<CGtJ2v.M2t@lysator.liu.se>" date="2962834492"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 21 Nov 1993 01:34:52 UT From: "Lars Aronsson" \<aronsson@lysator.liu.se> Organization: Lysator Academic Computer Society Message-ID: \<CGtJ2v.M2t@lysator.liu.se> References: <20@markj.win.net> \<THOMAS.93Nov9093731@noosa.gmd.de> <19931109.004@sfo.naggum.no> \<THOMAS.93Nov9142606@noosa.gmd.de> <19931110.018@sfo.naggum.no> Subject: Re: Standard DTDs (was: Evaluating SGML) [Erik Naggum] | At the time when troff was king, there were several communities that | used different macro packages. Is there yet a DTD that replaces the troff "man" macros? I guess it would take an afternoon to design one, and then one could make translators between the troff/man and SGML/man formats. This could be the base for some free SGML software: the "test data" is already there, on every UNIX system. Perhaps I am reinventing some wheels? -- Lars Aronsson, Lysator, Linkoping University, Linkoping, Sweden </message> <message id="<3318@cthulhuControl.COM>" date="2962882487"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 21 Nov 1993 14:54:47 UT From: "Bill Downing" \<bdowning@Control.COM> Organization: Control Technology Corp., Hopkinton MA Message-ID: <3318@cthulhuControl.COM> Subject: SGML '93 - When/Where? The subject says it all. Please email reply, if possible... Thanks, -- Bill Downing, President Email: bdowning@control.com DOWNING ASSOCIATES, INC. 8 Doyle Lane Hopkinton, MA 01748 Voice: 508-435-4567 </message> <message id="<2cp28k$tq8@genesis.ait.psu.edu>" date="2962918100"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 22 Nov 1993 00:48:20 UT From: "Bernie Thompson" \<bernie@bjt105.rh.psu.edu> Organization: Penn State class of '94 Message-ID: <2cp28k$tq8@genesis.ait.psu.edu> References: <2cfme5INN1r6@nestroy.wu-wien.ac.at> Subject: Re: SGML on OS/2: EPM ? [Rony Flatscher] | In the online-help (help -> product information -> list box), there is | an "advertisement" about upcoming SGML-authoring tools. | | Does anyone from IBM know the status of this project ? What would be | included, when would it be available? I don't know, but you can contact the author, Larry Margolis, directly. He hangs out in comp.os.os2.apps and his email is margoli@watson.ibm.com -- Bernie Thompson -- Internet connected with Linux over PSU dorm ethernet IBM co-op for OS/2 2.0 and 2.1 (video devices) </message> <message id="<HAYASHI.93Nov22160933@arrow.rst.fujixerox.co.jp>" date="2962940923"> Newsgroups: comp.databases,comp.databases.theory,comp.lang.visual,comp.theory,comp.ai,sci.logic,comp.text.sgml Date: 22 Nov 1993 07:08:43 UT From: "Koichi Hayashi" \<hayashi@rst.fujixerox.co.jp> Organization: FUJI XEROX Co., Ltd. Message-ID: \<HAYASHI.93Nov22160933@arrow.rst.fujixerox.co.jp> Subject: Pre-Announcement of Principles Of Document Processing'94 Pre-Announcement of Principles Of Document Processing'94 Distribution: world Pre-Announcement PODP'94 Second International Workshop on Principles Of Document Processing PODP'94 is the second in this series of workshops, which focus on modeling document processing systems. The goal of PODP is to foster a happy marriage between (A) documents in the real world, and (B) theories and tools developed in computer science, mathematics, and any other promising sources. We would like to see papers that attempt to find a good balance between these two. Papers that address both (A) and (B) on a somewhat equal basis are welcome. The program committee members will be chosen from (A) those who are active in the area of document processing, and (B) those who are active in relavant areas of computer science, such as database, and are very interested in documents. Derick Wood (University of Western Ontario) will join the program committee. We will ask that the organizers of PODP'92 to join. They are: Anil Nerode, Department of Mathematics, Cornell University; Richard Furuta, Texas A\&M University; Howard Blair, Syracuse University; and, Allen Brown, Jr., Xerox. PODP'94 will be a part of this April's set of coordinated conferences in Darmstadt (Germany). (However, PODP'94 is only a workshop and not a conference.) The date is April 11-12th, 1994. The other conferences in this set are EP'94, TEP'94, and RIDT'94. You are invited to submit six copies of an extended abstract or a complete paper by January 15th, 1994 to: Murata Makoto Xerox Webster Research Center 0128-29E 800 Phillips Road Webster, NY 14580 USA Each submission should have one cover page, which indicates the name, affilitiation, address, electronic mail address, and telephone number of the contact author. Submission by e-mail (to murata@wrc.xerox.com) is acceptable but not preferable. In this case the paper should be in ASCII, LATEX, or Postscript. One author of each accepted paper will be expected to present the paper at the workshop. Proceedings will be distributed at the workshop but will not be publicly available afterwards. However, as in PODP'92, some of the accepted papers will be published in a widely available journal or book. In order to assess the number of participants and contributors, we ask those who are interested in PODP'94 to fill out the form below and return it promptly to murata@wrc.xerox.com. Details of the conference (the program committee, registration procedure, etc.) will appear in the final announcement in December. CO-CHAIR Herve Gallaire Murata Makoto (My family name is Murata) Rank Xerox Fuji Xerox -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Q1. Are you interested in submitting papers to PODP'94? Yes or No. Q2. What is the title of your paper (if you intend to submit)? Q3. Are you interested in attending PODP'94? Yes or No. Q4. What is your affilitiation? </message> <message id="<9311220850.AA00479@ipsi.darmstadt.gmd.de>" date="2962947052"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 22 Nov 1993 08:50:52 UT From: Klemens Boehm \<kboehm@darmstadt.gmd.de> Message-ID: <9311220850.AA00479@ipsi.darmstadt.gmd.de> Subject: HyperODA Hello, I am interested in introductory, illustrative material on HyperODA. Any hint is sincerely appreciated. Cheers, Klemens Boehm </message> <message id="<753987127snx@sgml.com>" date="2962975927"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 22 Nov 1993 16:52:07 UT From: "Brian E. Travis" \<brian@sgml.com> Organization: SGML Associates, Inc. Message-ID: <753987127snx@sgml.com> Subject: \<TAG> Abstracts, November, 1993 The November, 1993 issue of \<TAG> The SGML Newsletter is in the mail. As a service to the readers of this list, the table of contents, along with a brief description of each article, is listed below. \<TAG>, published monthly, is the only regular source of information for the SGML industry: articles, reviews, product news, tutorials, standards updates, user group information, case studies, and useful technical tips and information. \<TAG> is designed to be an objective voice of the SGML community. We accept no advertising and encourage frank and open debate on the issues faced by the information publisher. For more information about \<TAG>, contact SGML Associates at +1 303-680-0875, by fax: +1 303-680-4906, or by e-mail: tag@sgml.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------- \<TAG> November 1993 ----------------------------------------------------------------- A Business Case for SGML By Chet Ensign In the first article of a two-part series, the author explains how his company, Information Builders, Inc., came to the discovery that, by treating their text in a structured manner, several business problems could be solved. This first article explains the company's business problems in the documentation area. Editorial At the recent Seybold San Francisco Conference and Exposition, there was much debate on the subject of which one of the recently announced electronic page-turner technologies is the best to use for electronic delivery of documents. This is a warning to those who feel these new solutions represent an ideal system. The Battle of the Page-Turners By Brian Travis A trip report on the recent Seybold San Francisco Conference and Exposition. Vendors delivering electronic delivery and management systems for documentation were highly visible at this popular annual conference. In addition, an entire one-day seminar was devoted to SGML -- a first for Seybold. Information and Technology Week By Simon Wickes Mr. Wickes shares his experience as an end-user and developer of SGML applications after attending the recent Graphic Communications Association SGML publishing conference in Los Angeles. SGML on a Silver Platter By Brian Travis A review of the recently released CD-ROM product titled "The Compleat SGML". The product contains the complete text of the ISO SGML standard (ISO 8879), complete with proposed corrections, revisions, or Exoterica's editorial comments. Also included is Exoterica's test suite of 2400 conforming and non-conforming documents, and a couple very large documents for exercising parsers. SGML Tips and Techniques Using DOCTYPE ID to Fool Application News 'Frame-Based' Authoring Tool Released Davenport Group to Meet MID Announces SGML Filter for FrameBuilder ACM Announces Shift to Electronic Delivery 1993 Calendar University of Wisconsin offers SGML Database Course No. Cal. SGML Users' Group -- Submitted by: Brian E. Travis brian@sgml.com Principal Consultant Managing Editor, Tele: +1 303 766-1336 Information Architects, L.L.C. \<TAG> The SGML Newsletter Fax: +1 303 680-4906 </message> <message id="<19931122T220008Z@news.naggum.no>" date="2962994408"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 22 Nov 1993 22:00:08 UT From: Lori Snyder \<Lsnyder@redstone-emh2.army.mil> Message-ID: <19931122T220008Z@news.naggum.no> References: <2b8pcu$di1@pens-emh2.ncts.navy.mil> <2bbr9f$rur@elroy.jpl.nasa.gov> <199311081746.JAA18601@mail.netcom.com> <1993Nov10.204842.27564@gdstech.grumman.com> Subject: Re: Has anyone gotten IADS to load? [Larry Beck] | How can you say that IADS will handle "CALS-standard text?" When I | looked at this product The first thing that I say was that all names | were restricted to eight characters. The "CALS SGML Declaration" | provides for 32 character names. Does the next release of the product | address this issue? That was true for IADS v1.0. But since then, IADS v1.2 and v1.3 both are capable of handling 32 character names. For those of you who did not there was a version 1.3, it was released less than a month ago. Give us a few weeks to figure out the quickest way to update the ftp sites. \</lori> -- Lori Snyder lsnyder@redstone-emh2.army.mil Systems Engineering Soutions, Inc. lsnyder@cs.uah.edu Huntsville, AL 35801 (205) 867-4562 </message> <message id="<19931122.160111.860@almaden.ibm.com>" date="2962996160"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 22 Nov 1993 22:29:20 UT From: "Eliot Kimber" \<drmacro@vnet.IBM.COM> Message-ID: <19931122.160111.860@almaden.ibm.com> Subject: Getting a Grip on HyTime Schedules If you, like me, are trying to understand HyTime and how it works, you are probably struggling to make sense of finite coordinate spaces, event schedules, and the like. I decided to see if I could finally get a grip on schedules, and in so doing, discovered, I think, one serious confusion factor that may be making things more difficult than they should be. This post is an attempt to undo that confusion. The basic idea of schedules and finite coordinate spaces in HyTime is really pretty straightforward: you define a coordinate space (say a grid), and then place things in that space. For example, to create a windowed user interface, you could define a two-dimensional grid, and then define the position of windows and window components in terms of their relative positions on the grid (think of most dialog editors, for example). Elements in the grid can be positioned absolutely or relative to each other, or even relative to other grids (alignment). Grids can be abstract ("screen units") or concrete ("pixels"). However, in HyTime, the simplicity of this basic idea can be obscured by the syntax, which because of its generality and range of function, can sometimes seem overly verbose. Also, the way coordinate spaces are defined and the way objects are placed in them may not be intuitive to everyone. The problem I had was that I was expecting the direction of reference to be from objects to their position in a coordinate space. For example, I might have an element that contains a multimedia object, which I would then want to position in a finite coordinate space. I expected that this object would define its position--in fact, it is just the opposite--the position definition refers to the object to be positioned. This in fact makes sense when you consider that for a given object there may be many places it will be placed (re-use being one of the driving reasons for using SGML in the first place). Therefore, it has to be the case that the object and its positioning would be separate, and since there is a one-to-many relationship between objects and positions, the positions should point to the objects. The thing that defines a position and associates it with an object is called an *event*. An event exists within an *event schedule* and associates a set of coordinates with an object, either by direct containment or by reference. Here's the basic scheme (ignoring several details for the moment): contains Refers to Event ----------> Event-----------> position and extent Schedule | | | contains | | Refers to '----------> FCS definition The event schedule (evsched) refers to a defined finite coordinate space, which defines the properties of the space (number of axes, measurement units, etc), and then contains one or more events, which are placed within the FCS. Each event then refers to an element that defines the position of the event within the FCS and its extent (how big it is in each axis), and also contains the object to be positioned). It was the method by which an event's position and extent is defined that threw me. I was expecting the position and extent to be a direct attribute of the event element, and the definition of the Event architectural form in the HyTime standard does not explicitly show how these properties are defined. I was, in short, confused. After some careful reading, I realized that my original expectation was incorrect, that in fact the Event element uses an ID reference to refer to a separate element, called an *extent specification* (exspec). In the definition of the Event form, this is indicated by a comment showing that the Event element uses the exspec attributes, which are defined separately because they're used by several different forms. It took me a while to make this connection, but once I had, things became a lot clearer. The extent specification elements are what HyTime calls "resources", which are elements that contain data to be used by reference from other elements, but that have no independent function. They can go anywhere, because, since they are only used by reference, it doesn't really matter where they are, since they'll never interact with anything around them. In the HyTime meta-DTD, they are inclusions, but application designers can define specific places for them if they prefer. The reason for using a separate element rather than a direct attribute to specify the coordinates of an event is that the position specification could be quite complex, depending on the needs of the application, and must be able to include subelements. While this is added overhead in the simple case, it is a requirement for all other cases (and in any case, this data would be generated by authoring tools or transforms anyway, so it doesn't really matter). Thus, a typical event will look like this: \<event exspec="exspec-1"> ---> \<exspec id=exspec-1>1 10 1 20\</exspec> \<MultiMediaObject object=myvideo> \</event> (Here I've shown the Exspec element as being "somewhere else"--remember it could be anywhere, we don't really care). In this example, the extent specification is a simple dimension list: a set of two axis marker pairs, where each pair of numbers defines a starting position and an extent, e.g., "1 10" and "1 20", indicating that the event starts at quantum (1,1) of the coordinate space and extends 10 quanta in one direction, 20 quanta in the other. The event element contains the object to be "scheduled", in this case, a video data entity represented by the contained MultiMediaObject element. Thus we have specified that this video should be positioned in one corner of our coordinate space (without knowing the other details of the space, we really don't know that that means, but it's clear otherwise). To put this all together, here's a fairly simple coordinate space example that solves the mundane but important problem of positioning multimedia objects on the screen. The example is represented by a single HyTime document which defines the coordinate space and then contains a single event schedule to define one presentation of the objects to be positioned. You can think of this document as a sort of "style spec" that is being applied to the multimedia objects--it exists solely to relate the objects to positions in a coordinate space. An application would, presumably, take this document as input from which it would derive the actual presentation using whatever presentation functionality it had. \<!DOCTYPE HyTimeSample PUBLIC "ISO/IEC 10744:1992//DTD HyTime//EN" &#DSO; \ \<!ELEMENT HyTimeSample - - (Extents, ScreenFCS+) > \<!ATTLIST HyTimeSample HyTime NAME #FIXED HyDoc unmspace NAME #FIXED "unified" -- Unified entity/ID name space -- > \ \<!ELEMENT ScreenFCS - O (evsched | wand | baton)+ > \<!ATTLIST ScreenFCS HyTime NAME #FIXED fcs -- instance of FCS form -- axisdefs NAMES #FIXED "vgaXaxis vgaYaxis" -- GIs of Axis form instances -- FCSMDU="gquantum" -- Generic quantum measurement unit for simplicity. Assume appl. will map quanta to pixels for now. -- > \<!ELEMENT (vgaXaxis | vgaYaxis) - - (#PCDATA) > \<!ATTLIST vgaXaxis HyTime NAME #FIXED axis axismeas NAME #FIXED "pixels" -- "notation" -- axisdim CDATA #FIXED "1024" -- length of axis -- > \<!ATTLIST vgaYaxis HyTime=axis axismeas NAME #FIXED "pixels" -- "notation" -- axisdim CDATA #FIXED "780" -- length of axis -- > \<!ELEMENT MultiMediaObject - O (TextAlt) > \<!ATTLIST MultiMediaObject HyTime NAME #FIXED ilink anchrole NAMES #FIXED "linksource object" object NAME #REQUIRED -- IDREF or ENTITY -- HyNames CDATA #FIXED "object linkends" -- Object attribute is really HyTime linkends= attr -- > \<!ELEMENT TextAlt - O (#PCDATA) > \<!ELEMENT extents - - (exspec+) > \<!ATTLIST extents HyTime NAME #FIXED HyBrid> &#DSC;> \<HyTimeSample> \<extents> \<exspec id=main-video>\ \<dimlist>10 400 10 300\</dimlist> \</exspec> \<exspec id=subwindow-1>\ \<dimlist>410 200 10 150\</dimlist> \</exspec> \<exspec id=subwindow-2>\ \<dimlist>410 200 155 150\</dimlist> \</exspec> \</extents> \<screenFCS>\ \<evsched id=JFK-Oswald-Ruby> \<event exspec=main-video> \<MultiMediaObject object=JFKinaug> \<textalt>Video of JFK's inauguration speech.\</textalt> \</MultiMediaObject> \</event> \<event exspec=subwindow-1> \<MultiMediaObject object=Zapruder-film> \<textalt>The Zapruder film. \</textalt> \</MultiMediaObject> \</event> \<event exspec=subwindow-2> \<MultiMediaObject object=RubyShoots> \<textalt>Video of Jack Ruby shooting L.H. Oswald \</textalt> \</MultiMediaObject> \</event> \</evsched> \</ScreenFCS> \</HyTimeSample> Note that the properties of the coordinate space are defined in the DTD itself and are therefore fixed. The FCS specification consists of two parts: the FCS element itself, and one axis form element for each axis of the FCS. The FCS element serves to define a specific coordinate space and its basic properties (number of axes, measurement domain, etc.). Each axis element defines the specific properties of a given axis, such as its length, its measurement units (inches, seconds, pixels, units), and so on. Within the document instance, each evsched with the FCS element (ScreenFCS in this example), defines a new instance of the coordinate space, and serves to contain events within that instance of the space. The event elements then associate actual data objects (in this case video clips, but it could be anything) with positions within the FCS. If I've done it right, the document above should define a presentation something like this: +----------------------------------------------------------+ | | | | | | | | Zapruder Film | | | | | JFK video | | | | | | | | | |-------------------------| | | | | | | | | Ruby and Oswald | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | +----------------------------------------------------------+ Note how the extent specification elements are used as resources, serving to define areas within the finite coordinate space with specific meanings and that can then be re-used. For example, I could have many different event schedules with different events, all using the same extents, and thus getting the same relative presentation for different videos. Likewise, by changing just the extent specifications, that change would apply to all events that used those extents. There are more details that I've glossed over, and other things you can do with extents, but this should help put schedules and finite coordinate spaces into a little more concrete context. As an exercise, you might figure out how to integrate the audio with the video (also using an event schedule), or how to control the timing of the three different videos. For really advanced students, you might puzzle out how to define the base FCS completely abstractly and then use HyTime constructs to project that FCS onto a concrete FCS (this would allow you to scale the presentation for different size screens, for example). -- Eliot Kimber Internet: drmacro@vnet.ibm.com Dept E14/B500 IBMMAIL: USIB2DK9@IBMMAIL Network Programs Information Development Phone: 1-919-254-5160 IBM Corporation Research Triangle Park, NC 27709 "But Ranger Doug, can't we just use some proprietary data format instead of this SGML stuff?" "Sure Slim, that would be the easy way, but it wouldn't be the Cowboy Way." </message> <message id="<CGy8IM.B9@nas.nasa.gov>" date="2963054109"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml,comp.text.tex Date: 23 Nov 1993 14:35:09 UT From: "Dr. Kuditipudi V. Rao" \<rao@amelia.nas.nasa.gov> Organization: NAS, NASA Ames Research Center, Moffett Field, California Message-ID: \<CGy8IM.B9@nas.nasa.gov> Subject: Translator from GML to TeX HELP! HELP! HELP! HELP! Does anyone know of a translator from GML to TeX (LaTeX)??? </message> <message id="<754074152snz@pira2.demon.co.uk>" date="2963062952"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 23 Nov 1993 17:02:32 UT From: "Francis Cave" \<cave@pira2.demon.co.uk> Organization: Pira International Message-ID: <754074152snz@pira2.demon.co.uk> References: <9311220850.AA00479@ipsi.darmstadt.gmd.de> Subject: Re: HyperODA [Klemens Boehm] | I am interested in introductory, illustrative material on HyperODA. | Any hint is sincerely appreciated. As far as I know, you have a world expert on HyperODA working at your sister organization GMD-Fokus: Angela Scheller. -- Francis Cave Pira International Randalls Road Leatherhead KT22 7RU United Kingdom Tel +44 372 376161 Fax +44 376 377526 email cave@pira2.demon.co.uk </message> <message id="<754074798snz@pira2.demon.co.uk>" date="2963063598"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 23 Nov 1993 17:13:18 UT From: "Francis Cave" \<cave@pira2.demon.co.uk> Organization: Pira International Message-ID: <754074798snz@pira2.demon.co.uk> References: <1993Nov13.154817.5269@falch.no> Subject: Re: SGML tools for Folio Views 3.0 [Steve Pepper] | SGML tools (list generated 13 November 93) | ========================================================== | | 1. By product category | ---------------------- : | | Databases : | - SGML Darc [U,W] Synex Information AB ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Any more information from anyone? -- Francis Cave Pira International Randalls Road Leatherhead KT22 7RU United Kingdom Tel +44 372 376161 Fax +44 376 377526 email cave@pira2.demon.co.uk </message> <message id="<1993Nov23.175408.18333@vax.oxford.ac.uk>" date="2963066048"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 23 Nov 1993 17:54:08 UT From: "Lou Burnard" \<lou@vax.oxford.ac.uk> Organization: Oxford University VAX 6620 Message-ID: <1993Nov23.175408.18333@vax.oxford.ac.uk> Subject: How to tag tables As a relaxation from the wonders of HyTime, I thought some readers of this list might like to share their wisdom on the subject of that favourite SGML chestnut: how to tag tables. (What prompted this thought was the fact that I'm currently looking at the draft of a chapter of the TEI Guidelines in which this topic is addressed) Here's the current proposal. SGML hackers from way back will recognize several neat ideas stolen from various sources... \<!ELEMENT table - - (head?, (row+|col+|cell+)) > \ \ \<!ATTLIST table rows NUMBER #IMPLIED cols NUMBER #IMPLIED> \ \<!ELEMENT (row|col) - o ((cell|table)+) > \<!ATTLIST (row|col) role (label|data) data > \ \ \<!ELEMENT cell - o (%phraseSeq)> \ \ \<!ATTLIST cell role (label|data) %INHERITED \ \ rows NUMBER 1 cols NUMBER 1 > \ \ This is woefully underspecified if you care about rendering, of course. We're taking the strong TEI position which says "put it all in the global rend attribute (but we're not saying how)". So no particular way of saying "align contents of this cell Left", "use double thick rules between this row and the next" "overprint with the word 'SPECIMEN'" etc. It does however allow you to handle some fairly tricky tables as well as some easy ones. Here's a middling complicated example, based on one I found in the HTML+ spec. +------+----------------------+-----------------+ | | average | fondness for | | | height | weight | tuna fish | +------|----------+-----------|-----------------+ |dogs | 34.2 | 12.3 | LOW | |cats | 23.4 | 11.2 | HIGH | +------+----------+-----------+-----------------+ Figure 7. Pet Preferences and Co-ordinates Here it is encoded row-wise : \<table rows=4 cols=4> \<head n='7'>Pet Preferences and Co-ordinates \<row role=label> \<cell rows=2>\ \<cell cols=2>average \ \<cell rows=2>fondness for tuna fish \ \</row>\<row role=label> \<cell>height \ \<cell>weight \ \</row>\<row role=data> \<cell role=label>dogs \ \<cell> 34.2 \<cell> 12.3 \<cell> LOW \</row>\<row role=data> \<cell role=label>cats \<cell> 23.4 \<cell> 11.2 \<cell> HIGH \</table> That wasn't so bad was it? Now let's try it again, only column-wise and without the stupid comments. At the same time, we'll try to do something about 'average height' by representing that whole thing as a nested table. \<table rows=4 cols=4> \<head n='7'>Pet Preferences and Co-ordinates \<col role=label> \<cell rows=2> \<cell>dogs \<cell>cats \<col> \<table rows=2 cols=2> \<row role=label>\<cell cols=2>average \<row role=label>\<cell>height\<cell>weight \</table> \<cell>34.2 \<cell>23.4 \<col> \<cell>12.3 \<cell>11.2 \<col> \<cell rows=2>fondness for tuna fish \<cell>LOW \<cell>HIGH \</table> Comments? Bouquets? Brickbats? Is this too much? Too little? -- Lou Burnard / Text Encoding Initiative lou@ox.ac.uk Oxford University Computing Services fax: +44 865 273275 13 Banbury Rd, Oxford OX2 6NN tel: +44 865 273200 </message> <message id="<CGz16G.GGA@ora.com>" date="2963091256"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 24 Nov 1993 00:54:16 UT From: "Terry Allen" \<terry@ora.com> Organization: O'Reilly & Associates, Inc. Message-ID: \<CGz16G.GGA@ora.com> Subject: Good CALS Table Documentation? Does anyone know of good CALS table documentation, aside from what I take to be the original (obtained from ftp.ifi.uio.no)? Regards, -- Terry Allen (terry@ora.com) Editor, Digital Media Group O'Reilly & Associates, Inc. </message> <message id="<1993Nov24.012046.7013@sqwest.wimsey.bc.ca>" date="2963092846"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 24 Nov 1993 01:20:46 UT From: "Marcy Thompson" \<marcy@sqwest.wimsey.bc.ca> Organization: SoftQuad Inc., Surrey, B.C. CANADA Message-ID: <1993Nov24.012046.7013@sqwest.wimsey.bc.ca> Subject: Job posting SoftQuad is hiring again. This time we need an experienced Scheme programmer who would like to be involved with training activities and (possibly) customer support, too. For more information, please see the posting titled "Scheme programmer / Training / SGML / OOP" in can.jobs and misc.jobs.offered. Marcy -- Marcy Thompson Manager, Education and Training SoftQuad Inc. +1 604 585 0079 marcy@sqwest.wimsey.bc.ca </message> <message id="<CGzw3t.Cto@curia.ucc.ie>" date="2963131337"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 24 Nov 1993 12:02:17 UT From: "Peter Flynn" \<pflynn@curia.ucc.ie> Organization: University College, Cork Message-ID: \<CGzw3t.Cto@curia.ucc.ie> References: <1993Nov23.175408.18333@vax.oxford.ac.uk> Subject: Re: How to tag tables It looks about right for most purposes. Have you done the canonical test (see the TeXbook, p.247, with footnote?) ///Peter </message> <message id="<9311241332.AA12205@wpdis03.wpafb.af.mil>" date="2963136774"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 24 Nov 1993 13:32:54 UT From: "Matt L. Voisard" \<mvoisard@wpdis03.wpafb.af.mil> Message-ID: <9311241332.AA12205@wpdis03.wpafb.af.mil> Subject: Compton's "patent" on Multimedia Has anyone heard or seen anything on this? I'd like to hear some details about exactly what Compton's is attempting here. What effect will this have on the SGML/HyTime/DSSSL community? Matthew L. Voisard RJO Enterprises, Inc. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1993 21:03:15 +22311151 From: "Karl F. Bridges" \<cfkfb@UX1.CTS.EIU.EDU> Subject: Re: FW: Compton Encyclopedia patents 'Multimedia' ! To: Multimedia List \<MMEDIA-L%ITESMVF1.BITNET@RICEVM1.RICE.EDU> They are that stupid. Does anyone wonder anymore why American business has gone straight into the toilet. Anyway, who really cares. So they patent it. To have a patent you have to be able to enforce it. Lets see how long they have a business when they have to spend all their resources and time suing everyone who is violating their patent. Since, for example, Hypercard was packaged with the Mac for years they will have to sue every person who has ever bought hypercard??? More to the point, they have to sue every person who has ever used a hypercard or hypercard like stack. Tell them to get stuffed. > I've heard this from a few sources - this is so stupid that it could be > true! This surely must have very serious consequences? Does anyone else > know anymore of the details? > > M.P.Stratfold@open.ac.uk > > ________________________________________________________________________ > > JimP writes:- > > From: Info-Amiga List on Sun, Nov 21, 1993 9:36 pm > Subject: Compton Encyclopedia patents 'Multimedia' ! > To: Multiple recipients of list I-AMIGA > > Well, I hate to say this but at COMDEX, Compton's Encyclopedia, Inc. > announced that they have patented the concepts behind multimedia. That > would be 'boot up a program, click on a text, see highlighted word, click > on it, see picture and hear speech attached to that word.' A number of > people in the audience were very upset! { I mean really pissed. } This > is on CNN Headline News for several days now. paraphrase 'You have a lot > of gall patenting something we have been doing since 1986 and 1987! You > are going to get alot of trouble over this!' > > Compton said they had been working on Multimedia since 1989. > > Many of the audience seemd to very very upset! > > The CEO { Chief Executive officer } of the new subsidiary { Compton > Multimedia }, says that they only want one percent of the product's cost > as a royalty, they aren't trying to stifle Multimedia! > > { Yeah, right, and all politicians are honest. } > > Several people in the audience promised litigation. > > Later, JimP. > > -- > Dreamy Jim aka Jim Pierce B.Sc. Disclaimer:Standard. > "We're not shy." Pugsley Addams "We're contagious." Wednesday -- ***************************************************************************** Karl Bridges cfkfb@eiu.edu ***************************************************************************** </message> <message id="<1993Nov24.153051.23052@spectrum.xerox.com>" date="2963143851"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 24 Nov 1993 15:30:51 UT From: "Hugh Stabler" \<hugh_stabler.wgc1@rx.xerox.com> Organization: Rank Xerox Ltd. Message-ID: <1993Nov24.153051.23052@spectrum.xerox.com> References: <1993Nov23.175408.18333@vax.oxford.ac.uk> Subject: Re: How to tag tables On the whole I like it, especially the recursive tables and the choice between row-wise or column-wise markup. A few points occur to me though... A shortref for cell would be handy, say "|". I like the label/data distinction, but in the real tables I deal with there are very often several levels of label rows, ie a column header row followed by a number of sub-header rows, and there would normally be a distinction between headers and sub-headers (in font style or ruling) when it came to rendering. I know it's not politically correct, anathema even, but I have to say that I would like to see an optional alignment attribute for cells, and maybe a ruling attribute too. To take your example table, it seems to me that the meaning might not be quite so clear when the table is formatted if the label "average" were left-justified as opposed to centered. I'm biased mind you, since I'm generally concerned with capturing other folks' (highly technical) tables, and in my experience it can be dangerous to make assumptions about what meaning is implied by particular alignment or ruling, especially if the person doing the markup has no knowledge of the subject matter. As an example of a table where the significance of the ruling might not be immediately apparent to someone not "skilled in the art", look at Figure 15 on page 552 of "The SGML Handbook". In any case, it seems to me that the distinction between format and structure gets rather wooly when we start talking about tables; spanning cells are a case in point. Anyway that's my tuppence-worth. - Hugh Stabler (consultant) </message> <message id="<CH07J3.CJI@dove.nist.gov>" date="2963146142"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 24 Nov 1993 16:09:02 UT From: "Bob Bagwill" \<bagwill@sst.ncsl.nist.gov> Organization: NIST Message-ID: \<CH07J3.CJI@dove.nist.gov> References: <1993Nov23.175408.18333@vax.oxford.ac.uk> Subject: Re: How to tag tables [Lou Burnard] | +------+----------------------+-----------------+ | | | average | fondness for | | | | height | weight | tuna fish | | +------|----------+-----------|-----------------+ | |dogs | 34.2 | 12.3 | LOW | | |cats | 23.4 | 11.2* | HIGH | | +------+----------+-----------+-----------------+ | Figure 7. Pet Preferences and Co-ordinates * (Estimated) [footnote added] First, let me caveat, in an Alexander Haig-ish way, what follows, because I didn't follow the long-ago table discussion closely, and I know almost nothing about SGML, DTD's TEI, etc. Maybe I'm poorly re-inventing a wheel. Anyway, Lou's format seemed over-constrained to me. I drew sort of a bubble chart (zen Venn) of the elements, and came up with this: \<cell name=preferences> Pet Preferences and Co-ordinates \<cell name=species inside=preferences> \<cell name=average inside=preferences> average \<cell name=fondness inside=preferences> fondness For tuna fish \<cell name=height inside=average> height \<cell name=weight inside=average> weight \<cell name=dogs inside=species> \<cell inside=dogs\&height> 34.2 \<cell inside=dogs\&weight> 12.3 \<cell inside=species> cats \<cell inside=cats\&height footnote=(Estimated)> 23.4 \<cell inside=cats\&weight> 11.2 \<cell inside=dogs\&fondness> LOW \<cell inside=cats\&fondness> HIGH Notice that it doesn't say what's a column or row, or what order things appear, or what should be the top or side. It also doesn't use nesting of elements to express containedness. Since an element like 34.2 is not in height or dogs, but both, using nested elements to express the relationship seems wrong. This format also would allow multi-dimensional tables. I would guess that some of the 3D spreadsheets must do something like this. -- Bob Bagwill rbagwill@nist.gov </message> <message id="<1993Nov24.174154.16887@falch.no>" date="2963151714"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 24 Nov 1993 17:41:54 UT From: Steve Pepper \<pepper@falch.no> Organization: Falch Hurtigtrykk as, Oslo, Norway Message-ID: <1993Nov24.174154.16887@falch.no> References: <1993Nov13.154817.5269@falch.no> <754074798snz@pira2.demon.co.uk> Subject: SGML Darc (Document Archive Controller) [Francis Cave] | >- SGML Darc [U,W] Synex Information AB | ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ | Any more information from anyone? Contact: Hasse Haitto Synex Information AB Kallforsv. 24 S-124 32 Bandhagen Sweden \<haitto@nada.kth.se> Best regards, Steve -- </(pepper)steve> pepper@falch.no ------------------------------------------------------------------ falch hurtigtrykk a.s, postboks 130 kalbakken, n-0902 oslo, norway tel +47 2216 3040 fax +47 2216 2350 "Life begins at 0x28" </message> <message id="<199311241754.JAA29277@netcomsv.netcom.com>" date="2963151757"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 24 Nov 1993 17:42:37 UT From: Chet Ensign \<DOCCOE@IBIVM.IBMMAIL.COM> Message-ID: <199311241754.JAA29277@netcomsv.netcom.com> References: <9311241332.AA12205@wpdis03.wpafb.af.mil> Subject: Re: Compton's "patent" on Multimedia Following up on Matt Voisard's message about Compton patenting "multimedia," here is the text of their press release, downloaded from the Multimedia Vendor's Forum on Compuserve. What bothers me is paragraph 4, where it says "There is no intention, therefore, of limiting this invention to the exact abstract or disclosure presented herein." That sentence suggests that, indeed, they are trying to patent not just their delivery engine, but in fact the entire notion of "hypertext." I don't see how they could do that, if only because so many people were already developing the tools years before Compton came on the scene. But then, I'm not a lawyer and I don't think like one. Here's the text. Judge for yourselves. \<TEXT> BUSINESSWIRE 11/15 Compton's NewMedia receives patent for multimedia invention LAS VEGAS--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Compton's NewMedia, a leading publisher, developer, and distributor of multimedia titles, today announced that they were granted United States Patent Number 5,241,671. The patent identifies Compton's NewMedia as the owner of the "Multimedia search system using a plurality of entry path means which indicate interrelatedness of information." An abstract in the patent document further describes the invention as: "A database search system that retrieves multimedia information in a flexible user friendly system. The search system uses a multimedia database consisting of text, picture, audio and animated data. That database is searched through multiple graphical and textual entry paths." And further, "There is no intention, therefore, of limiting this invention to the exact abstract or disclosure presented herein. More particularly, it is contemplated that this invention can be used with any information that can be stored in a database." Compton's NewMedia, while granted patent rights described in the 671 patent, wants to continue to foster the growth of this industry, and will license developers the use of the multimedia invention as defined in the Compton's patent. Compton's licensing program will consist of a tiered structure which will give developers several options including: entering into a strategic joint venture relationship with Compton's NewMedia, entering into a distribution arrangement with Compton's NewMedia's Affiliated Label Program, developing a product using Compton's SmarTrieve technology, or complying with a royalty structure as set forth by Compton's NewMedia. "We simply want the public to recognize Compton's NewMedia as the pioneer in this industry, promote a standard that can be used by every developer, and be compensated for the investments we have made to make multimedia a reality for developers and end users," said Stanley Frank, Ed.D., president and chief executive officer of Compton's NewMedia. "We encourage developers to use the distribution channels and development tools Compton's NewMedia has made available to them. Our royalty structure and distribution options will benefit our licensees." Compton's intends to offer a special reduced royalty program until June 1, 1994 for licensees who sign with Compton's prior to that date. Compton's NewMedia applied for the patent on Oct. 26, 1989, immediately after the release of Compton's MultiMedia Encyclopedia, the first electronic encyclopedia to integrate pictures, sound, motion, and multiple entry paths. A continuing application is currently pending. To distinguish it from other CD-ROM based products in its time, the Compton's multimedia invention uniquely provides the ability to explore databases of text or graphics that can be interrelated and yet searched independently of each other. "We knew immediately that we had an important development when we first conceived of Compton's MultiMedia Encyclopedia," said Stanley Frank. "We decided to patent a system to search and display multiple databases that would include graphics, sound and video in addition to text. It just happened that the first product we developed was an encyclopedia that would set the standard for educational and entertainment multimedia for years to come." The multimedia concept is not limited to CD-ROMs on PCs. As the storage and delivery capacity of media have expanded, Compton's has continued to enhance its technology to extend to other platforms including the Macintosh, Sony Multimedia CD-ROM Player, Philips CD-I, and Tandy VIS, to name a few. The encyclopedia and other Compton's titles will soon appear on other interactive delivery systems as explained by Norman J. Bastin, executive vice president and general manager of Compton's NewMedia: "Compton's has invested many years and millions of dollars to create a solid, patented foundation of multimedia technology," said Norm Bastin. "The patent is not limited to any delivery medium such as CD-ROM. We are looking far down the road beyond the CD-ROM to the Digital Highway and what it promises for education, information, and entertainment from PDA's to interactive television." Technology Throughout its history, Compton's continued to improve its search and retrieval technology. The company developed SmarTrieve in 1986, a developer's tool designed to index unstructured databases (such as encyclopedias or book text) and make them searchable. Compton's SmarTrieve SmartKit Developers Toolkit was released in 1992 providing indexing tools and a standard user interface which gives developers the flexibility to use Compton's front end interface or substitute their own end user interface if they wish. Distribution Shortly after announcing its encyclopedia in 1989, Compton's NewMedia began breaking new ground in multimedia software distribution. Instead of relying entirely on traditional channels such as computer speciality and software only stores, Compton's immediately set out to bring multimedia to bookstores, record stores, mass merchandisers, and consumer electronics retailers. In January of 1993, Compton's announced that it had broken through the software rental barrier by providing CD-ROM titles to Major Video Concepts, one of the nation's leading rental distributors and only last week through Blockbuster. In August 1993, Compton's announced its titles would be available for lending in public libraries. In 1991, Compton's opened its distribution doors to other developers. The company launched its Affiliated Label Program, designed to provide avenues of distribution to smaller developers. Together, these companies and Compton's NewMedia team up to offer a selection of appropriate titles for each of the diverse retail channels that Compton's has opened to multimedia. Today, Compton's has over 20 companies in its affiliated label program, distributing over 150 titles in Compton's twelve channels of distribution. Today, Compton's is a leading producer of interactive information, infotainment, edutainment, and entertainment software on CD-ROM and floppy media. Compton's own titles and those of its affiliates can be found at more than 7,500 retailers throughout the country. Compton's has 22 affiliates bringing the total of titles distributed by Compton's NewMedia to over 150. Compton's has launched an aggressive marketing program for the mass consumer market, offering such compelling CD-ROM titles as Compton's Interactive Encyclopedia for the PC and Macintosh, The Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous Cookbook, and Jazz: A Multimedia History, and The Sporting News series. Compton's MultiMedia Group is part of Tribune Publishing Company, a wholly owned subsidiary of Tribune, a leading information and entertainment company. Tribune publishes six daily newspapers, operates seven television and six radio stations, produces and syndicates information and programming, publishes books and information in print and digital formats, and has an ownership interest in one of Canada's largest newsprint manufacturers. BUSINESSWIRE 11/15 Compton's NewMedia receives patent -2- Early Days, Early Visions What is known today as Compton's Interactive Encyclopedia on the commercial market and Compton's MultiMedia Encyclopedia in schools, started as a concept in the early 80s. Stanley Frank, then executive vice president, and Norman J. Bastin, then executive director of corporate planning and development at Encyclopedia Britannica Inc. were searching for a new generation of products to enhance information delivery. While Encyclopedia Britannica was not interested in electronic publishing of their own volumes, they owned the publishing rights to Compton's Encyclopedia, a well-known, highly regarded family and school encyclopedia. The idea for a multimedia encyclopedia started in 1985 and Compton's Encyclopedia was chosen to be the basis for the product a year later. Stanley Frank and Norman Bastin realized that the appropriate platform would be one that offered flexibility and interactivity. It had to add value for the user beyond what could be found in a print medium or in the text only CD-ROMs currently on the market at that time. Until then, CD-ROM was a little-known medium that focused on text and conventionally used Boolean logic for searches. Frank and Bastin knew they wanted to integrate graphics and set out to find the experts to create the search and retrieval software that would provide easy access to all the textural and graphical elements of the first multimedia encyclopedia. To get a feeling for software, Frank and Bastin acquired Eduware and Designware, two software companies that provided important knowledge about the software industry but lacked development staff. Soon, a relationship was struck with Jostens Learning Co., then Education Systems Corp. and the synergy began. Over the next two and a half years, the Encyclopedia/Jostens team developed proprietary software. Rather than relying entirely on software engineers for their multimedia product, they brought in experts from many disciplines including educational designers, educational consultants, animators, programmers, videographers, marketing gurus, and financial analysts. "We knew what we wanted, got the people we needed, and together created a product with appeal and relevance to the mass public,'' said Norman Bastin. "We tested the product in focus groups who confirmed that people learn best when all the senses are used. They loved the way text and graphics were at their fingertips. We had a winner.'' In conjunction with the software tool development, the editorial team completed an $8.5 million editorial makeover of the underlying Compton's print and photo content. "We knew we were going to have groundbreaking technology and wanted the same for the content," Frank said. "Compton's was written for computers in a pyramid style as with newspapers, with main facts up front, then more depth." /CONTACT: Christina Germscheid of Compton's NewMedia, 619-929-2500; or Pat Meier of Pat Meier Associates, 415-957-5999, for Compton's NewMedia/ 09:37 EST </> </message> <message id="<2d1373$d0s@samba.oit.unc.edu>" date="2963181219"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 25 Nov 1993 01:53:39 UT From: "Simon E Spero" \<ses@tipper.oit.unc.edu> Organization: University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill Message-ID: <2d1373$d0s@samba.oit.unc.edu> References: <9311241332.AA12205@wpdis03.wpafb.af.mil> <199311241754.JAA29277@netcomsv.netcom.com> Subject: Re: Compton's "patent" on Multimedia I think that Compton is going to get squished on this one; not only is the patent vacuously invalid (on grounds of prior art), the companies likely to challenge have the muscle to squash Compton flat. The issue is too important to too many people's strategic plans to settle out of court on; It'll be interesting to see who Compton first tries to collect from. I wonder if IBM would appear as Amicus Curae for Microsoft, or vice versa? Maybe Apple's lawyers are still up for the fight? Simon -- Hackers Local 42- National Union of Computer Operatives, Chapel Hill section ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Tar Heel Information Services - Nothing but net! | WAIS/Z39.50 spoken here North Carolina - First in Usenet | DoD #612 | Tel: +1-919-962-9107 </message> <message id="<CH1t71.DG7@ul.ie>" date="2963220877"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml,comp.text Date: 25 Nov 1993 12:54:37 UT From: "Liam Relihan" \<relihanw@ul.ie> Organization: CSIS Dept, U. of Limerick Message-ID: \<CH1t71.DG7@ul.ie> Subject: architectures of DSSSL and CDA ? Hi... Can anyone give me some pointers to information on the architectures of CDA and DSSSL. I have already read the executive summaries, etc., and these are not helpful (at least the ones I have read). I have also searched the sites where I'd expect information on this stuff to be, but little joy so far. I don't really have enough time to acquire the DSSSL standard from ISO. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks Liam </message> <message id="<1993Nov25.145053.21377@kub.nl>" date="2963227853"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 25 Nov 1993 14:50:53 UT From: "Arthur van Horck" \<Arthur.vanHorck@kub.nl> Organization: KUB, The Netherlands Message-ID: <1993Nov25.145053.21377@kub.nl> Subject: Whereis ICA? Dear Group, Would anyone care to enlighten me as to the whereabouts of the Integrated Chameleon Architecture (ICA)? ICA is a conglomerate of programs to assist in the generation of translators between different representations of electronic data. ICA should be available for anonymous FTP somewhere. Archie was not very helpful, hence this message. Thanks a lot, Arthur -- ***--*--*---------------------- Arthur van Horck ----------------------------+ ** * * KUB-University Tilburg, the Netherlands Phone: (+31) 13 662232| * * * Arthur.vanHorck@kub.nl Fax: (+31) 13 662537| +-*--*-----------------------------SPIN\\SMCT---------------------------------+ </message> <message id="<1993Nov25.210012.25301@sq.sq.com>" date="2963250012"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 25 Nov 1993 21:00:12 UT From: "Yuri Rubinsky" \<yuri@sq.sq.com> Organization: SoftQuad Inc., Toronto, Canada Message-ID: <1993Nov25.210012.25301@sq.sq.com> References: <3318@cthulhuControl.COM> Keywords: SGML '93 and related events Subject: Re: SGML '93 - When/Where? 1) SGML '93 Conference Sesions: December 6-9, 1993 2) SGML Database Migration and "Just Enough SGML" Tutorials: Dec 5 3) OmniMark Users' Group Meeting: Dec 5 4) International SGML Users' Group Meeting: Dec 6 8pm 5) SoftQuad "Conceptual Overview of SGML" Tutorial Dec 2-3 and again 13-14 6) SGML Open Technical and Marketing Working Committee Meetings: Dec 10 Sheraton Boston Hotel and Towers Boston Massachusetts USA Call GCA at 703 519-8160 to register for items 1 and 2 above. Call Exoterica at 613 722-1700 for information about item 3. Call SoftQuad at 416 239-4801 to register for either of item 5. Send mail to me to indicate your interest in attending item 6. Simply show up to take part in item 4. -- Yuri Rubinsky +1 416 239-4801 President, SoftQuad Inc. (800) 387-2777 (from US only) Chairman, SGML '93 uucp: {uunet,utzoo}!sq!yuri Suite 810 56 Aberfoyle Crescent Internet: yuri@sq.com Toronto, Ontario, Canada M8X 2W4 Fax: +1 416 239-7105 </message> <message id="<19931126.009@sfo.naggum.no>" date="2963344197"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 26 Nov 1993 23:09:57 UT From: Erik Naggum \<erik@naggum.no> Message-ID: <19931126.009@sfo.naggum.no> References: <1993Nov25.145053.21377@kub.nl> Subject: Re: Whereis ICA? [Arthur van Horck] | ICA should be available for anonymous FTP somewhere. Try FTP.IFI.UIO.NO:/pub/SGML/ICA. The directory contains these files: -rw-r--r-- 1 enag 1144389 1992-07-21 00:05:11 ICA-1.5.tar.Z -rw-r--r-- 1 enag 682465 1993-11-27 00:01:29 ICA-1.5.tar.gz -rw-r--r-- 1 enag 1093649 1992-07-21 00:07:20 ICAdoc-1.2.tar.Z -rw-r--r-- 1 enag 790150 1993-11-27 00:02:13 ICAdoc-1.2.tar.gz The .gz files are just recompressions of the .Z files, for convenience. The distribution was announced on this newsgroup and a WAIS search on comp.text.sgml.src for "ICA" would have turned up all the relevant articles, including the announcements by Sandy Mamrak in July 1992. The original distribution is on archive.cis.ohio-state.edu in /pub/chameleon. The .Z files above are the latest versions from that archive. Best regards, \</Erik> -- Erik Naggum \<erik@naggum.no> \<SGML@netcom.com> ISO 8879 SGML Chairman, SGML SIGhyper \<SGML.SIGhyper@naggum.no> ISO 10744 HyTime "Memento, terrigena. Memento, vita brevis." ISO 10646 UCS </message> <message id="<19931126.010@sfo.naggum.no>" date="2963344854"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 26 Nov 1993 23:20:54 UT From: Erik Naggum \<erik@naggum.no> Message-ID: <19931126.010@sfo.naggum.no> References: \<CGz16G.GGA@ora.com> Subject: Re: Good CALS Table Documentation? [Terry Allen] | Does anyone know of good CALS table documentation, aside from what I | take to be the original (obtained from ftp.ifi.uio.no)? A copy of MIL-M-28001B has been placed in FTP.IFI.UIO.NO:/pub/SGML/CALS. The formatting is atrocious, and I have made a feeble attempt to reformat the first few thousand lines to fit a 75-column line. Best regards, \</Erik> -- Erik Naggum \<erik@naggum.no> \<SGML@netcom.com> ISO 8879 SGML Chairman, SGML SIGhyper \<SGML.SIGhyper@naggum.no> ISO 10744 HyTime "Memento, terrigena. Memento, vita brevis." ISO 10646 UCS </message> <message id="<1993Nov29.014640.5274@sq.sq.com>" date="2963526400"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 29 Nov 1993 01:46:40 UT From: "Yuri Rubinsky" \<yuri@sq.sq.com> Organization: SoftQuad Inc., Toronto, Canada Message-ID: <1993Nov29.014640.5274@sq.sq.com> Summary: Writer seeks SGML news items for SGML '93 talk Subject: Last Call for Two or Three Sentences Before the Seybold Conference, I posted a request for SGML news of any sort and received an interesting (but small) assortment. Now that we're coming up to the SGML '93 Conference, I'd like to remind those of you who always intended (and all the rest of you too) to send in a mention of: 1 Relevant Standards Activity 2 Governmental (or EC/CE or other international) Initiatives 3 Major Industry Initiatives 4 New (since Oct '92) and Forthcoming Publications 5 Major or Especially Interesting SGML Implementations 6 Any SGML Activity that fits in the "Miscellaneous" Category Of particular interest are updates on any activities reported in previous Year in Review collections. EVEN IF YOU ARE PLANNING TO SPEAK ABOUT THE RELEVANT ITEM AT SGML '93, IT WOULD STILL BE VERY USEFUL FOR US TO HAVE A FEW SENTENCES TO DESCRIBE IT IN THE Year in Review. As always, thanks in advance. Make sure I have them by late Thursday EST, and I'll post the full collection here in a few weeks. -- Yuri Rubinsky +1 416 239-4801 Chairman, SGML '93 (800) 387-2777 (from US only) President, SoftQuad Inc. uucp: {uunet,utzoo}!sq!yuri Suite 810 56 Aberfoyle Crescent Internet: yuri@sq.com Toronto, Ontario, Canada M8X 2W4 Fax: +1 416 239-7105 </message> <message id="<1993Nov29.095744.28682@gmd.de>" date="2963555864"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 29 Nov 1993 09:57:44 UT From: "Thomas F. Gordon" \<thomas@slim.gmd.de> Organization: German National Research Center for Computer Science (GMD) Message-ID: <1993Nov29.095744.28682@gmd.de> Subject: ANNOUNCEMENT: FrameBuilder EDDs for ISO 12083 FrameBuilder versions of the ISO 12083 SGML DTDs for articles and books are available on our ftp server, at ftp.gmd.de:gmd/sgml/fbedds.tar.Z I've also included a few FrameBuilder "templates" for these document types containing layout information. The article template is in the style of a Kluwer journal article. ISO 12083 is a set of SGML DTDs for articles, books and serials. FrameBuilder is a version of FrameMaker with very nice support for editing and formatting structured documents, but unfortunately does not support SGML directly. The README file is attached. Please let me know if you find any errors or make any improvements. Dr. Thomas F. Gordon GMD, FIT-KI; Schloss Birlinghoven 53757 Sankt Augustin / Germany email: thomas.gordon@gmd.de; phone: (+49 2241) 14-2665 --------------------------- READ ME ---------------------------------------- This directory contains FrameBuilder Element Definition Documents (EDDs) "templates" for the ISO 12083 document types. The ISO documents are defined as SGML Document Type Definitions (DTDs), but it was rather straightforward, if tedious, to translate these by hand into EDDs. There are two EDDs, one for books and one for articles. I haven't translated the ISO 12083 DTD for serials. Whereas a EDD describes the logical structure of a document type, a FrameBuilder "template" is contains the paragraph and character styles which define the layout of the document. The templates included here are incomplete. I've only included what I have needed so far in my own work. Their is no template for a complete book. Rather, there is a template for a single chapter. Presumably one will want to use FrameBuilder's "book" feature for combining several documents into a book. The "kluwer" article template is in the style of a Kluwer journal article. The "manuscript" template is the same, except that lines are double-spaced. The article and book templates already include their respective EDDs; they don't need to be imported separately. The "letter" template is a FrameBuilder version of our GMD letterhead stationary, and is presumably only of interest to others here at GMD. This template is unstructured; it doesn't include an EDD. Please inform me about any improvements you may make to these templates, or other templates you may design for these EDDs. </message> <message id="<1993Nov29.165323.10256@falch.no>" date="2963580803"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 29 Nov 1993 16:53:23 UT From: Steve Pepper \<pepper@falch.no> Organization: Falch Hurtigtrykk as, Oslo, Norway Message-ID: <1993Nov29.165323.10256@falch.no> Subject: SGML Tools Thanks to everyone who responded to my previous posting concerning 'The Whirlwind Guide to SGML Tools'. Here is a new version of the listing. By popular demand it now includes vendors addresses, phone and fax numbers and email address. As before, please send corrections and additions to me at pepper@falch.no - DO NOT post them in the newsgroup. And please read the preamble carefully before telling me that I've categorised a product incorrectly or omitted a tool that ought to be on the list. The listing will be made available to participants at the SGML '93 conference in a few days time, so get your comments to me quickly! Best regards, Steve -- </(pepper)steve> pepper@falch.no ------------------------------------------------------------------ falch hurtigtrykk a.s, postboks 130 kalbakken, n-0902 oslo, norway tel +47 2216 3040 fax +47 2216 2350 \<SGMLTOOLS> The purpose of this listing is to give a brief overview of SGML Tools currently available on the market. While we would like the list to be as comprehensive as possible, we are not interested in every piece of software that claims 'SGML compatibility'. The main criterion for inclusion in the list is that the software incorporates some kind of SGML parsing capability, or that it is in some way specifically geared to handling SGML documents. The products in the list are arranged in a set of very broad categories that should not be taken too literally since no two tools have exactly the same functionality. (We could have carried on subdividing categories forever in order to express the finer distinctions, but we had to stop somewhere...) There are bound to be some inaccuracies, for which we apologise in advance. Please send corrections and additions to the address below. Updated versions of this list will be posted periodically in the SGML Archives at ftp.ifi.uio.no. Steve Pepper (pepper@falch.no) Falch Hurtigtrykk A/S Postboks 130 Kalbakken N-0902 Oslo Norway SGML tools (generated 29 November 93) ============================================================= 1. By product category ---------------------- Supported platforms (where known) are shown in parentheses as D = MS-DOS I = IBM CMS/MVS M = Macintosh O = OS/2 U = UNIX W = MS-Windows Browsers - Lector (U W) OpenText - SuperBook (U) Bellcore Conversion software - Balise (U D) MID - FastTAG (U W) Avalanche - Integrated Chameleon Architecture (U) PD - OmniMark (U D M) Exoterica - qwertz/FORMAT (U) PD - SGML Hammer (U W) Avalanche - SGML Translator DCF Edition (I) IBM - TableTAG (U D) Unifilt Databases - BASIS SGMLserver (U) InfoDim - PAT (U) OpenText - SGML/Search (U) AIS - SGML/Store (U) AIS Electronic delivery - DynaText (U W M) EBT - Pathways (U) Westinghouse - WorldView (U W) Interleaf HyTime engines - HyMinder (U D) TechnoTeacher Page layout software - ADEPT Publisher (U W) ArborText - CAPS (U) XSoft - DL Composer (U) Datalogics - FrameBuilder (U W) Frame - Interleaf 5 \<SGML> (U D) Interleaf Document management - PassagePRO (U) Passage - SGML Darc (U W) Synex Parsers/SGML Engines - Amsterdam Parser (U) PD - ARC-SGML (D) PD - Mark-It (U D) SEMA - MarkMinder (U D) TechnoTeacher - SGML Kernel (U D M) Exoterica - sgmls (U) PD Text editors - ADEPT Editor (U W) ArborText - Author/Editor (U W M) SoftQuad - EASE (E2S Advanced SGML Editor) (D) E2S - GRIF SGML Editor (U) Grif - InContext (W) InContext - Intellitag (U D) WordPerfect - SGML Ghost (D) OUP - SGML Smart Editor (D) Auto-Graphics - Write-It (D) SEMA - WriterStation (D O) Datalogics DTD utilities - Document Analyzer (U D) Avalanche - DTDocumenter (U) SoftQuad - Near & Far (W) Microstar - RulesBuilder (U W M) SoftQuad - SGML DTD Viewer (W) ZIFTech Various - ApplicationBuilder (U W M) SoftQuad 2. By vendor ------------ AIS Berger-Levrault 34 Avenue du Roule 9220 Neuilly-sur-Seine France Tel: +33 (1) 46-40-10-60 - SGML/Search - SGML/Store ArborText Inc. 1000 Victors Way, Suite 400 Ann Arbor MI 48108 USA Tel: +1 (313) 996-3566 Fax: +1 (313) 996-3573 - ADEPT Editor - ADEPT Publisher Auto-Graphics, Inc. 3201 Temple Avenue Pomona CA 91768 USA Tel: +1 (909) 595-7204 Fax: +1 (909) 595-3506 - SGML Smart Editor Avalanche Development Co. 947 Walnut Street Boulder CO 80302 USA Tel: +1 (303) 449-5032 Fax: +1 (303) 449-3246 Email: louise@avalanche.com - Document Analyzer - FastTAG - SGML Hammer Bellcore Address anyone? - SuperBook Datalogics, Inc. 441 West Huron Street Chicago IL 60610 USA Tel: +1 (312) 266-3202 - DL Composer - WriterStation E2S Address anyone? - EASE (E2S Advanced SGML Editor) Electronic Book Technologies, Inc. One Richmond Square Providence RI 02906 USA Tel: +1 (401) 421-9550 Fax: +1 (401) 421-9551 - DynaText Exoterica Corp. 1545 Carling Avenue, Suite 404 Ottawa Ontario K1Z 8P9 Canada Tel: +1 (613) 722-1700 Fax: +1 (613) 722-5706 Email: info@exoterica.com - OmniMark - SGML Kernel Frame Technology Corp. 1010 Rincon Circle San Jose CA 95131 USA Tel: +1 (408) 433-3311 - FrameBuilder Grif S.A. Immeuble "Le Florestan" 2, boulevard Vauban B.P. 266 78053 St. Quentin en Yvelines France Tel: +33 1-30-12-14-30 Fax: +33 1-30-64-06-46 - GRIF SGML Editor IBM Corp. 400 Columbus Avenue Valhalla NY 10595 USA Tel: +1 (914) 749-3409 - SGML Translator DCF Edition InContext Corp. 2 St. Clair Ave. West, Suite 1701 Toronto M4V IL5 Canada Tel: +1 (416) 922-0087 Fax: +1 (416) 922-4282 - InContext Information Dimensions Inc. 5080 Tuttle Crossing Blvd Dublin OH 43017-3569 USA Tel: +1 (614) 761-8083 Fax: +1 (614) 761-7290 - BASIS SGMLserver Interleaf, Inc. Prospect Place 9 Hillside Avenue Waltham MA 02154 USA Tel: +1 (617) 290-0710 Fax: +1 (617) 290-4943 - Interleaf 5 \<SGML> - WorldView Microstar Software Ltd. 34 Colonnade Rd N Nepean Ontario K2E 7J6 Canada Tel: +1 (613) 727-5696 Fax: +1 (613) 727-9491 - Near & Far MID Information Logistics Group Ringstrasse 19 D-69115 Heidelberg Germany Tel: +49 6221-166091 Fax: +49 6221-23921 Email: post@mid-heidelberg.de - Balise Open Text Corp. 180 King Street South, Suite 550 Waterloo Ontario N2L 1P8 Canada Tel: +1 (519) 571-7111 Fax: +1 (519) 571-9092 - Lector - PAT Oxford University Press Walton Street Oxford OX2 6DP UK Tel: +44 (865) 56767 Fax: +44 (865) 56646 - SGML Ghost Passage Systems, Inc. 465 Fairchild Dr., Suite 201 Mt. View CA 94043 USA Tel: +1 (415) 390-0911 - PassagePRO Public Domain - Amsterdam Parser - ARC-SGML - Integrated Chameleon Architecture - qwertz/FORMAT - sgmls Sema Group AG Building Place du Champ de Mars 5 Bte 40 B-1050 Bruxelles Belgium Tel: +32 2 508 5323 Fax: +32 2 512 1499 - Mark-It - Write-It SoftQuad Inc. 56 Aberfoyle Crescent, Suite 810 Toronto Ontario M8X 2W4 Canada Tel: +1 (416) 239-4801 Fax: +1 (416) 239-7105 - ApplicationBuilder - Author/Editor - DTDocumenter - RulesBuilder Synex Information AB Kallforsv. 24 S-124 32 Bandhagen Sweden Email: haitto@nada.kth.se - SGML Darc TechnoTeacher, Inc. P.O.Box 3208 1810 High Road Tallahassee FL 32303-4408 USA Tel: +1 (904) 422-3574 Fax: +1 (904) 386-2562 Email: markminder@techno.com - HyMinder - MarkMinder Unifilt Co. P.O.Box 2528 Edison NJ 08817 USA Tel: +1 (908) 225-2243 Fax: +1 (908) 225-2248 - TableTAG Westinghouse Electric Corp. P.O.Box 746 Baltimore MD 21298-6451 USA Tel: +1 (410) 993-2214 - Pathways WordPerfect Corp. 1555 N. Technology Way Orem UT 84057 USA Tel: +1 (801) 228 5006 - Intellitag XSoft 10200 Willow Creek Road San Diego CA 92131 USA Tel: +1 (619) 695 7700 Fax: +1 (619) 695 7710 - CAPS ZIFTech Computer Systems, Inc. 120 Herchmer Crescent Kingston Ontario K7M 2V9 Canada Tel: +1 (613) 531-9226 - SGML DTD Viewer \</SGMLTOOLS> </message> <message id="<1993Nov29.195912.21477@news.lrz-muenchen.de>" date="2963591952"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 29 Nov 1993 19:59:12 UT From: "Martin Josko" \<martin@pollux.edv.agrar.tu-muenchen.de> Organization: Leibniz-Rechenzentrum, Muenchen (Germany) Message-ID: <1993Nov29.195912.21477@news.lrz-muenchen.de> Subject: SGML Database SIG ? I've read in Robin Cover's Bibliography about the SGML Database Special Interest Group (DBSIG/DSIG), but the given contact addresses are not up to date. Could somebody give me an advice how I can get in contact with this SGML SIG?? I'm interested at any basic concepts and any implementations concering the storing of SGML documents in databases. I thank you in advance. -- Martin Josko Technical University Munich TU-Muenchen Department of Mathematics DVS-Weihenstephan Statistics and Data Processing D-85350 Freising Freising Germany email: martin@pollux.edv.agrar.tu-muenchen.de phone: +49-(0)8161-71-4506 fax: +49-(0)8161-71-4409 </message> <message id="<19931129T213404Z@news.naggum.no>" date="2963597644"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 29 Nov 1993 21:34:04 UT From: Lori Snyder \<Lsnyder@redstone-emh2.army.mil> Message-ID: <19931129T213404Z@news.naggum.no> Subject: IETMDB \<MIL-D-87269> I've been looking at MIL-D-87269 (IETMDB). I was wondering how other people have interpreted this specification. It never states how one would test for compliancy. This seems to leave room for numerous interpretations. In Appendix-A on page A-3, the entity declaration for hytime references a file called hytime.dtd. I didn't know there was such a DTD. On page A-9, under the Hytime Linking Mechanism, it defines the element link to use the Hytime 'ilink'. Is this correct or is it suppose to be a 'clink'? Maybe I am just confused on what the difference is between an 'ilink' and a 'clink'. Are there any papers written on this subject? If so, where can I find them? Thanks in advance, \</lori> -- Lori Snyder lsnyder@redstone-emh2.army.mil Systems Engineering Solutions, Inc. lsnyder@cs.uah.edu Huntsville, AL 35801 (205) 867-4562 </message> <message id="<2ddr3b$69v@slip.aisg.com>" date="2963598891"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 29 Nov 1993 21:54:51 UT From: "Michael Clark" \<mdc@aisg.com> Organization: Gateway Conversion Tech. Message-ID: <2ddr3b$69v@slip.aisg.com> Subject: J2008 DTD needed Anyone have a copy of the J2008 DTD(s) they can email me, or a pointer to an ftp site which has it? TIA, Michael -- | Michael Clark | Paul's Law: You can't fall off | | Gateway Conversion Technologies | the floor. | | Research Triangle Park, NC | | | mdc@aisg.com | Cole's Law: Thinly sliced cabbage. | </message> <message id="<19931130.091020.887@almaden.ibm.com>" date="2963601101"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 29 Nov 1993 22:31:41 UT From: "Eliot Kimber" \<drmacro@vnet.IBM.COM> Message-ID: <19931130.091020.887@almaden.ibm.com> References: <19931129T213404Z@news.naggum.no> Subject: Re: MIL-D-87269 (IETMDB) [Lori Snyder] | On page A-9, under the Hytime Linking Mechanism, it defines the element | link to use the Hytime 'ilink'. Is this correct or is it suppose to be | a 'clink'? Maybe I am just confused on what the difference is between | an 'ilink' and a 'clink'. HyTime considers links (the connections or relationships between objects) as peer objects to the anchors of the links (the objects being connected). This allows you to do two things: 1. Apply hyperlinks to objects to which you do not have write access (e.g., "webs applied to data", ala the IRIS system at Brown) 2. Define properties of links independent of the anchors themselves. The basic hyperlink construct is the "independent link", or "ilink". It is called an independent link because the link element is independent of its anchors. Note that the link element itself is transparent to the anchors--in other words, when you traverse a link from one anchor to another, you are unaware that the link itself was established via an ilink element. Ilinks can have two or more anchors, and HyTime defines ways to indicate how the various anchors can be accessed from the other anchors (for example, can you only tranverse from one anchor to another, or can you traverse among all the anchors, etc.), as well as other properties of the link. The normal Ilink picture looks something like this: .---------------Ilink---------------. | | V V Anchor A<- - - - - - - - - - - - - ->Anchor B The ilink element locates the anchors and defines the meaning of the relationship established, but from the point of view of either anchor, the link is directly to the other anchor. The anchors can be located using any of the various HyTime location methods, from direct ID reference to queries of various sorts. This is the general case of hyperlink. However, there is a special case of hyperlink where one of the anchors is also the hyperlink element, such as a cross reference. This is modeled as a "contextual link", or clink. It is a contextual link because the link element occurs in the context of the information, rather than being independent of it. The clink element is a special case of ilink with the following constraints: 1. There are only two anchors, the clink element being one, the target of the clink being the other. 2. The anchor roles are fixed as "refmark refsub". Clink is intended to directly model existing cross-reference elements in existing applications. However, it is also possible to use an Ilink in this way by making the Ilink element one of the anchors of the link: .----. | V '---ilink------------>Anchor A You can do this either by explicit ID reference, e.g.: \<ilink id=me linkends="me anchor-A" anchrole="linksouce target">I link to myself\</ilink> Or by having one more anchor role value than Linkends= value, in which case, the first anchor role applies to the ilink element itself: \<ilink linkends="anchor-A" anchrole="linksource target"> In this example, the anchor role "linksource" applies to the inlink element, and the anchor role "target" applies to the element "anchor-A". Thus, clink is useful for any "traditional" cross references, but not for much else. Ilink should be used for all other types of link elements, with the self-referential form used when the ilink is one of its own anchors. Note that anchor role names are to HyTime what element names (generic identifiers) are to SGML: they are application-specific names intended to relate to some application-specific semantic or object. HyTime, for the most part, does not define any anchor roles, and certainly doesn't constrain the set of anchor roles you might have. It is up to applications to define meaningful anchor roles. In most applications you would expect the anchor role to be used to constrain or inform the processing that is done based on the role an given anchor satisfies. For example, in IBMIDDoc, we define the anchor role "annotation", which means that the object linked to with that role is an annotation of the link source. This can be used, for example, to apply the appropriate "annotation style" to the element linked to. For example, in an online presentation, you might have annotations come up in a window at a particular place relative to what they annotation, and with some specific decoration unique to annotations (think of footnote windows typical in most online systems). (Note: This ends the basic discussion of ilink and clink. The rest is a discussion of anchor roles and how they might be used to do interesting things in conjunction with event schedules. ) Another interesting use of anchor roles is in concert with events in event schedules. Events in event schedules serve to locate objects, contained (literally or by reference) by the events, within coordinate spaces (e.g., windows on a display screen). Events can also refer to events using a clever sort of query called an "accessed anchor list". An accessed anchor list contains a list of anchor role names, and indicates that when an element is accessed as satisfying one of the listed roles, it should be considered to be contained by the event *for the duration of the access*. This is a very interesting way to define the presentation of elements because it means you can define the presentation purely in terms of the relationships between objects with no knowledge of the objects themselves. For example, in my previous post on finite coordinate spaces and event schedules, I used as an example a simple coordinate space that defined three windows on a display screen, like so: +---------------------------+ | | Zapruder| | | | | JFK |---------| | | Ruby | | | | +---------------------------+ In the example, since it was November 22, I had as the contents of the window, JFK's inaugural speech, the Zapruder film, and the video of Jack Ruby shooting Oswald. In my example, I had shown explicit containment of these objects by the events that represented the three windows. Simple enough, but pretty static. However, if we apply accessed anchor lists, we can create an interesting dynamic system. Let's pretend we have a database of various information objects categorized by subject in such a way that we can do queries against them. These objects represent things like people, organizations, etc. As part of the definition of these objects, there are included various interesting multimedia objects associated with them, such as videos, photographs, old engravings, text, sound recordings, etc.. These objects are self describing in the sense that having located an object, you can find out what its notation is, etc. (for example, each one may be represented by a master entity declaration as part of the database). Now, because we are conspiracy theorists, pretend we want to create a system that will present information about heads of state, their assassins, and the controllers of the assassins. This will help us uncover conspiracies while providing an entertaining and enlightening presentation of the data. We could go through the database, find heads of state that were assassinated, find the information about them, get the object locations, build the event schedules, etc. Boring. Tedious. Unnecessary. Instead, we can apply the power of anchor roles and accessed anchor lists to the problem. Our problem statement defines the anchor roles: head-of-state, assassin, controller. Thus, we can define our event schedule for the above presentation like so (ignoring the tedious details for now): \<fcs> \<evsched> \<event exspec="headofstate-extent"> \<accanch> \<acctype linktype="ilink" accrole="head-of-state"> Accesses the head-of-state anchor of any ilink element. \</acctype> \</accanch> \</event> \<event exspec="assassin-extent"> \<accanch> \<acctype linktype="ilink" accrole="assassin"> Accesses the assassin anchor of any ilink element. \</acctype> \</accanch> \</event> \<event exspec="controller-extent"> \<accanch> \<acctype linktype="ilink" accrole="controller"> Accesses the controller anchor of any ilink element. \</acctype> \</accanch> \</event> \</evsched> \</fcs> This FCS now applies to any set of links within our imaginary system that satisfy these roles. We can test it by recreating our original picture. Imagine that our system works by building Ilink elements on the fly that are then input to the system. The act of inputing an ilink starts the process, giving some user interface gizmo by which we can start the "access" action for the murdered leader of our choice. Because we are working against a database that has been designed for query-based retrieval, we can do our accessing using queries, something like this: \ \<nmquery qdomain="assassins" fn="assassinated"> select(CAND eq(%1 Proploc(person_assassinated))) \</nmquery> \ \<nmquery qdomain="database" fn="controledby"> select(CAND eq(%1 Proploc(controledby))) \</nmquery> \ \<nameloc id=head-of-state-loc> \<nmquery qdomain="heads-of-state"> select(DOMROOT eq(TRUE proploc(Was_Assassinated CAND))) \</nmquery> \</nameloc> \ \<nameloc id=assassin-loc> \<nmquery args="\&head-of-state;" usefn=assassinated> \</nameloc> \ \<nameloc id=controller-loc> \<nmquery args="\&assassin;" usefn=controledby> \</nameloc> These location elements set up our queries into the database. The first two NMQuery elements define functions that take arguments, which we'll use by reference from the Nameloc elements. We need to use functions because the specific arguments will be determined by which head of state we choose. The third Nameloc contains a direct query which will serve to set up our system. Assuming that we have a database of heads of state (or a specific "heads of state index in our database), the query returns all those heads of state that were assassinated. This list will then be the entry point into our application, letting us explore the relationships between heads of state, their assassins, and the conspiracies behind them. We only need a single ilink element to set this thing in motion: \<ilink id=conspiracy-adventure linkends="heads-of-state-loc assassin-loc controller-loc" anchrole="head-of-state assassin controller"> This link links heads of state to assassins and controllers via the referenced location elements. It is input to the Conspirator-O-Matic program. \</ilink> Now imagine how this might work when we give this ilink to the Conspirator-O-Matic program: 1. The act of inputing the ilink serves to start access to the "head-of-state" anchor, which in this case is represent by presenting a list of heads of state who have been assassinated. We can then chose an entry in the list, which by definition of our application, serves to access the other two anchors. 2. As soon as the "head-of-state" anchor is accessed, the "head-of-state" event "contains" the object that satisfies that anchor, in this case our list of heads of state. For simplicity, assume that the application is defined such that no objects are actually retrieved until an item in the list is selected. Having selected a head of state, however, the visual representation of that head of state will become the content of the event. Let's pretent we've defined the application such that it picks the first object it finds that it can present and presents it, in this case, the film of JFK's inaugural speech, which comes up in the window defined by the first event's extent spec. 3. As soon as we select a head of state, the system uses that value as the argument value to the "assassin" anchor query, which gets us to the assassin entry in the database. Again, we pick the first displayable thing associated, this time the Zapruder film (remember, I'm just making this up, it could be defined any way we like). It comes up in the second event's window. 4. Having located the assassin, the assassin value is used as the input to the controller query, in this case locating Jack Ruby, the entry for whom happens to be the first object in our "conspiracy behind the JFK assassination" object in the database. The TV news scenes are the first thing found, so they come up in event 3. Now think about what happens when you select another head of state from the original list: you select Lincoln. Maybe you get a clip of some actor playing Lincoln, an engraving of John Wilkes Booth, and photograph of brothel where he met with his conspirators. You select Julius Caesar and get a picture of a Roman coin, and two different passages from the Shakespear play, etc.. Maybe we refine the system so that with each event you can select the different presentation objects associated with the anchor--you can probably think of other cool and interesting ways you might like the system to work. This is a pretty simple example, and neither the querying, in and of itself, nor the presentation are particularly unique or innovative, but I think the integration of the presentation definition with the queries in an abstract way that is tied to the relationships between objects and not the objects themselves is unique, or if not unique, at least pretty cool and very useful. What I find particularly interesting is the way this system stays organized into well-defined parts that can be implemented separately and integrated at a fairly high level through the event schedule, the location methods, and the ilink. The problem of presenting video or pictures in a window is easy to solve, the problem of doing queries is easy to solve, and the problem of generating user interface objects from lists of things is easy, all in isolation. The HyTime part of the system, the part that manages the coordinate space elements, the linking and location, is completely independent of the details of the presentation or user interface. Given a query system and a HyTime link and location manager, as well as basic multimedia functionality such as MMPM/2 or Windows Multimedia Extensions, or a system like ToolBook, it should not be too difficult to write the application-specific code to glue it all together, certainly no more difficult than writing a print composition application. Once you have a system like this, it becomes a very powerful information visualization tool, doing for amorphous information what spread sheets do for numbers. I'm imagining visualization systems where with a relatively simple authoring interface you define the queries and relationships to use, relate them to presentation spaces (windows on a screen, points on a graph, areas within a 3-D virtual space, whatever), select a few style options, and set the thing in motion. If the system is built correctly, if the style choices are reasonable but limited, if the user interface is truly usable, 90% of the effort in building a presentation should be thinking about the relationships and queries to apply against the database. And because the definition of the relationships is independent of the concrete presentation, it means you can derive a wide variety of presentations from the same queries, or share the definitions among disparate presentation systems or databases. If 90% of the effort goes into forming the queries and defining the relevant relationships, then you'd better make sure your investment in those is preserved. That is what HyTime promises, because it is a standard designed to provide just that sort of independence, and why a standard query notation, such as HyQ is important. If I build some queries, I better be able to through them at Lexus, Nexus, the Perseus system, my local body of data, my research notes, and so on, without ever changing the query itself. I find this sort of system very exciting. It seems to tie together all the different approaches to hypertext that various groups are working on, unifying them within the common framework of HyTime and exploiting the power of queries to resolve connections. -- Eliot Kimber Internet: drmacro@vnet.ibm.com Dept E14/B500 IBMMAIL: USIB2DK9@IBMMAIL Network Programs Information Development Phone: 1-919-254-5160 IBM Corporation Research Triangle Park, NC 27709 "But Ranger Doug, can't we just use some proprietary data format instead of this SGML stuff?" "Sure Slim, that would be the easy way, but it wouldn't be the Cowboy Way." </message> <message id="<1993Nov29.233940.20283@ctp.com>" date="2963605180"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 29 Nov 1993 23:39:40 UT From: "Eddy Wong" \<ewong@ctp.com> Organization: Cambridge Technology Partners Message-ID: <1993Nov29.233940.20283@ctp.com> Subject: Conversion tools from word processor formats to SGML Hi netters, I'm looking for conversion tools from word processor formats (RTF, Frame) to SGML. I'm looking at Avalanche's FastTag right now. Are there any other ones? I'm looking for tools as well as companies that can do this kind of job. Sorry if this a FAQ. Thanks in advance, Eddy. -- * Eddy Wong ewong@ctp.com * * Cambridge Technology Partners, Inc. (617) 374-8410 * * 304 Vassar St, Cambridge, MA 02139 (617) 374-8300 (fax) * </message> <message id="<2df0c4$4sm@klaava.Helsinki.FI>" date="2963637060"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 30 Nov 1993 08:31:00 UT From: "Patric M Stickler" \<stickler@klaava.Helsinki.FI> Organization: University of Helsinki Message-ID: <2df0c4$4sm@klaava.Helsinki.FI> Subject: Question regarding (erroneous?) interpretation of RS/RE ... I thought I understood well the somewhat "slippery" issues regarding RS/RE interpretation in mixed and non-mixed data content; however, I recently came across a problem that threw me. Since two unrelated (as far as I know) parsers behave the same way (Sgmls and Omnimark), I will assume that their interpretation is correct, and although I would perhaps like them to behave differently, I am more interested in refining my understanding of this issue. The problem involves the effect of a RE in the selection by the parser of two alternate content models. I.e., given the declarations \<!DOCTYPE Input [ \<!ELEMENT Input - - (Data+)> \<!ELEMENT Data - - (Text|#PCDATA)> \<!ELEMENT Text - - (#PCDATA)> ]> and then the input \<Input> \<Data> Here is some text. \</Data> \<Data> \<Text> Here is some text. \</Text> \</Data> \<Input> the first Data element, containing only PCDATA, is parsed with no problems; however, the second Data element, containing a single Text subelement, is flagged as erroneous, to the effect that the Text element is not permitted in this location. The output/error messages from Sgmls are (INPUT (DATA -Here is some text. )DATA (DATA sgmls: SGML error at test.sgml, line 12 at ">": DATA end-tag implied by TEXT start-tag; not minimizable )DATA sgmls: SGML error at test.sgml, line 12 at ">": Out-of-context TEXT start-tag ended INPUT document element (and parse) )INPUT If we modify the input data and remove the RE/RS preceeding the Text element \<Input> \<Data> Here is some text. \</Data> \<Data>\<Text> Here is some text. \</Text> \</Data> \</Input> then we get a second error, again from Sgmls (INPUT (DATA -Here is some text. )DATA (DATA (TEXT -Here is some text. )TEXT sgmls: SGML error at test.sgml, line 13 at record end: DATA end-tag implied by data; not minimizable )DATA sgmls: SGML error at test.sgml, line 13 at record end: Out-of-context data ended INPUT document element (and parse) )INPUT Only when we remove the RE/RS both from preceeding the Text element's start tag and following the Text element's end tag is the input is processed with no errors. Likewise, if the declaration of Data is changed to be mixed \<!ELEMENT Data -- ((Text|#PCDATA)+)> then either input example is processed with no errors, but the declaration fails to accurately describe the document structure as it would permit multiple Text elements and PCDATA, which is not acceptable. Apparently, the parser is interpreting the RE's preceeding and following the Text element as data. Yet according to my understanding of the Standard, the RS and RE both preceeding and following the Text element should be ignored, given their context. Is it perhaps a case where the RE occuring between the Data start tag (or perhaps the RS preceeding the Text start tag) is apparently leading the parser to select the content model option where the content of Data is only #PCDATA, in which case when the Text start tag is encountered, an error is (given the interpretation of the content model, correctly) flagged. Yet even this is suspect, because if only the RE/RS is removed preceeding the Text start tag, yet the RE/RS following the Text end tag remains, an error is still flagged, to the effect that the Data element end tag is not minimizable an is missing (which it is not). If the parser selects the alternative where the Data element contains a sinble Text subelement, then the RE/RS following the Text element should be ignored. All in all, it's very mysterious as to what the parser is expecting. It was my understanding that RS is always ignored (except in very rare cases where it is defined as markup, which it is not here, 7.6.1 #1), that "the first RE of an element is ignored if no RS, data, or proper subelement" preceeds it (7.6.1 #6), and that "the last RE in an element is ignored if no data or proper subelement follows it" (7.6.1 #8) which is the case in the first example input. Yet perhaps this does not apply to the effect of RE on the parsing of the DTD itself, or the resolution of alternative grammatical interpretations of the input structure? Nowhere in the standard (or Goldfarb's annotations) could I find reference to the effects of RS or RE on the parsing strategy taken in selecting alternate content models (except for a short blurb in Appendix F regarding record boundaries which I'm not sure if it is relevant or not); yet both Sgmls and Omnimark behave identically in their interpretation of the input data and their report of the apparent errors in the example inputs. Are they both erroneous, or is this yet another "gotcha" associated with the other linefeed complexities in SGML? Even if the parser considered the Data element to be mixed (which I don't, since the Text and #PCDATA alternatives are mutually exclusive), the RE/RS preceeding and following the Text start tag in the first example input should still be ignored. It appears to me that the neither parser is talented enough to take into account the fact that the first RE may or may *not* be significant, and thus is unable to provide the expected semantics for the defined content model. I'd very much appreciate any discussion that can shed some light on this issue, primarily so that I can avoid similar problems in the future. Please no discussion of "why" the elements are defined as they are. The data is coming from an external source, and it is significant whether or not the content of the the Data element is encapsulated in a Text element. The relevant issue here is the effect of RS/RE on parser behavior and content model semantics. Thanks in advance to all who reply. -- Patrick M. Stickler OH2LUV, KC4YYY The comments contained herein WSOY, Information Systems Division do not necessarily reflect the Helsinki, Finland - psti@wsoy.fi official views of my employer. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Don't put off for tomorrow what you can do today; because if you enjoy it today, you can do it again tomorrow... </message> <message id="<CHAr9v.9qL@exodus.iti.gov.sg>" date="2963638291"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 30 Nov 1993 08:51:31 UT From: "Edgar Teo" \<edgarteo@iti.gov.sg> Organization: Information Technology Institute, National Computer Board, S'pore Message-ID: \<CHAr9v.9qL@exodus.iti.gov.sg> Keywords: DSSSL, ISO Subject: Request for DSSSL update Hi all, Would appreciate it if someone could update me on the latest happenings in DSSSL? Has it been adopted as an ISO standard? Where can I get a copy of the specs? Thanks in advance. - Edgar </message> <message id="<JJC.93Nov30171006@jclark.jclark.com>" date="2963668205"> Newsgroups: comp.text.sgml Date: 30 Nov 1993 17:10:05 UT From: "James Clark" \<jjc@jclark.com> Organization: None, London, England Message-ID: \<JJC.93Nov30171006@jclark.jclark.com> References: <2df0c4$4sm@klaava.Helsinki.FI> Subject: Re: Question regarding (erroneous?) interpretation of RS/RE ... [Patric M Stickler] | The problem involves the effect of a RE in the selection by the parser | of two alternate content models. I.e., given the declarations | | \<!DOCTYPE Input [ | \<!ELEMENT Input - - (Data+)> | \<!ELEMENT Data - - (Text|#PCDATA)> | \<!ELEMENT Text - - (#PCDATA)> | ]> | | and then the input | | \<Input> | \<Data> | Here is some text. | \</Data> | \<Data> | \<Text> | Here is some text. | \</Text> | \</Data> | \<Input> | | the first Data element, containing only PCDATA, is parsed with no | problems; however, the second Data element, containing a single Text | subelement, is flagged as erroneous : | Apparently, the parser is interpreting the RE's preceeding and | following the Text element as data. Yet according to my understanding | of the Standard, the RS and RE both preceeding and following the Text | element should be ignored, given their context. The parser is correct to reject your example. The process of determining whether an RE can be ignored according to 7.6.1 happens after the process of checking whether the content of an element conforms to its content model. See the first note in clause 7.6.1 (starting at 322:12 in Goldfarb), and the second note in clause 11.2.4 (starting at 411:12). James Clark jjc@jclark.com </message>